[CPRB] Oral arguments for Mumia

[Brian Dolinar]

>From Democracy Now:

For our first segment, we turn to Philadelphia and a pivotal court hearing
for the imprisoned journalist and former Black Panther, Mumia Abu-Jamal.
Abu-Jamal has spent a quarter-century on death row. He was convicted of
killing a police officer following a controversial trial before a
predominantly white jury. In 2001, a judge overturned Abu-Mumia's death
sentence but upheld his conviction. On Thursday, a three-judge panel heard
oral arguments to decide whether Mumia gets a new trial, life in prison
without parole, or execution. Hundreds of people packed the courtroom while
an even larger crowd rallied in support of Mumia outside. A decision may not
come down for months.

We are joined now by Mumia Abu-Jamal's lead attorney. Robert Bryan has
represented Mumia since 2003. He is a fellow of the American Board of
Criminal Lawyers and the former Chair of the National Coalition to Abolish
the Death Penalty.

   - *Robert Bryan*, Mumia Abu-Jamal's lead attorney. He is a fellow of
   the American Board of Criminal Lawyers and the former Chair of the National
   Coalition to Abolish the Death Penalty.

------------------------------
RUSH TRANSCRIPT

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*JUAN GONZALEZ: *For our first segment, we turn to Philadelphia and a
pivotal court hearing for the imprisoned journalist and the former Black
Panther, Mumia Abu-Jamal. Abu-Jamal has spent a quarter-century on death
row. He was convicted of killing a police officer following a controversial
trial before a predominantly white jury. In 2001, a judge overturned Mumia
Abu-Jamal's death sentence, but upheld his conviction. On Thursday, a
three-judge panel heard oral arguments to decide whether Mumia gets a new
trial, life in prison without patrol, or execution. Hundreds of people
packed the courtroom, while an even larger crowd rallied in support of Mumia
outside. A decision may not come down for months.

*AMY GOODMAN: *We're joined right now by Mumia Abu-Jamal's lead attorney.
Robert Bryan has represented Mumia since 2003. He's a fellow of the American
Board of Criminal Lawyers and the former chair of the National Coalition to
Abolish the Death Penalty. Welcome to *Democracy Now!*

*ROBERT BRYAN: *It's a pleasure to be here, Amy

*AMY GOODMAN: *Why don't you lay out what happened in the courtroom for --
what was it? -- two hours yesterday?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Well, it was over two hours. We argued before a three-judge
panel of the United States Court of Appeals for the Third Circuit, which is
just below the US Supreme Court. The court seemed really interested. There
are a number of issues pending before this court. They involve the death
penalty, racism in jury selection, the racism and bias of the trial judge,
Sabo, who referred to my client during the trial, to use his words -- I'm
quoting him -- "I'm going to help them fry the nigger," referring to Mumia
Abu-Jamal.

*AMY GOODMAN: *Who heard that?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Pardon?

*AMY GOODMAN: *Who heard that?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *A court stenographer. It was just outside the courtroom. She
was going with her judge to another courtroom, and they passed Judge Sabo in
an antechamber adjacent to the courtroom where the trial occurred, and Sabo
started talking about the trial and made those comments, which are as
offense as -- I mean, as you may know, I specialize in death penalty
litigation. I've handled hundreds of death penalty trials and cases in
post-conviction proceedings in the past three decades. I even went and spent
three days in jail in a murder case for contempt of court, in which my
client was acquitted -- African American. I've seen a lot of racism, but
I've never heard anything like that, except in this case in Philadelphia.
It's unprecedented.

*JUAN GONZALEZ: *And that court stenographer's statement, has it ever gone
before a judge on this case?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Juan, it went before the court yesterday. I said -- from my
lips -- and I said, "Understand, these are the words of Judge Sabo, not
Robert R. Bryan." But our focus yesterday is interesting, with all the
energy by the prosecution to kill my client. The focus yesterday was on
constitutional crimes committed by the prosecution. What the whole focus was
primarily was on the death penalty, I'd say 20% and 80% on racism in the
District Attorney's office of Philadelphia. And in all of my years of doing
this kind of work, I find yesterday's hearing, as I think back on it this
morning, as unprecedented. These judges, how they'll rule, we do not know,
but they were very troubled -- that was very clear -- about the racism in
this case.

*JUAN GONZALEZ: *One of the main points that you were raising was the jury
selection process in the original trial, right?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Yes.

*AMY GOODMAN: *The number of challenges of potential white jurors versus
black jurors. Could you talk about that?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Yes. The US Supreme Court has been very clear in recent
years, beginning with a 1986 decision, that racism in jury selection offends
the US Constitution. And in this case, the prosecutor used over two-thirds
of his strikes to remove people of color, African Americans, only 20% to 25%
white people. I mean, you know, you have all of these African American
people removed and very few white people. And it's well-documented that the
District Attorney's office of Philadelphia during that period in the early
'80s, and certainly going back, were very active in employing racism in jury
selection discrimination. And the big question yesterday, in my words, was
-- an issue for the court was and is -- was race, was discrimination at work
in this case? And it seems like not only the statistics, but a wealth of
other evidence, certainly seems to establish that. Let's just hope that the
judges agree with us.

*AMY GOODMAN: *Robert Bryan, the Assistant District Attorney Hugh Burns told
the appellate panel that Judge William Yohn erred when he overturned
Abu-Jamal's death sentence, because he should have deferred to the decision
of the Pennsylvania Supreme Court, which had already held that the penalty
phase jury instructions were not confusing. Please explain that, because
most people think Mumia Abu-Jamal remains on death row.

*ROBERT BRYAN: *That is true. He is still on death row. He's in a cell
today, Amy, that's smaller than most of our bathrooms at home. And from
there, he does his journalism, which is another story, and it's phenomenal.
But the lower US district court reversed the case in December 2001, because
of a misuse of the death penalty by Judge Sabo, the trial judge. He
instructed the jury that they could not return anything less than death,
unless they all agreed on any one particular special circumstance, such as
his good works in his life. In other words, you couldn't have one juror feel
that he should not get death for one reason, another or different reason;
they had to all agree, which is nonsense and contrary to US Supreme Court
precedent. Immediately after that decision, he reversed it. In other words,
he said there had to be a trial on the question of life or death, a new jury
trial. The prosecution immediately appealed it, so thus the death penalty
remained in effect. Mumia remains on death row, where he sits today, as
we're here in this nice studio.

And the court started out yesterday just ripping into the prosecutor. He had
the opening comments, because he's the one who initially appealed. Then we
cross-appealed. And they just could not understand how one could logically
find that what the judge did in this case in instructing the jury would pass
muster with the US Constitution. So the court seemed very troubled by that.

What we're interested in are the other issues. Of course, I do not want my
client to be executed. I do not want to have to go and watch my friend, who
has first asked me to represent him in 1986, twenty-one years ago -- I do
not want to lose him. But I want a new trial for him. And at that trial --
I've won countless murder cases through the years -- this case deserves an
acquittal. I want him to go home to his family.

*JUAN GONZALEZ: *Now, in terms of the move from here, the court -- you
expect a decision sometime in the next few months?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Yes. And there's really no way of predicting. I can only
give a guess, a guesstimate, not even an estimate. I would predict that we
would probably have a decision in forty-five to ninety days.

Now, I just received an email last evening from the court, which is -- I've
never had this happen in the hundreds of death penalty cases I've handled
through the years, in which they want us now to order transcripts of the
hearing. Now, this isn't a trial. This is before a US Court of Appeals
three-judge panel. And so, I will deal with that later today. So they
actually want transcribed -- I don't know why they'd want to read what I had
to say, but maybe my associates, maybe they want to see what they had to
say. But they want transcripts of the hearing, which is unusual in a case at
this stage.

*JUAN GONZALEZ: *And it was also a unusual that they allowed the NAACP to
actually argue an *amicus* brief.

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Yeah, and one of the first things I did when I -- even
though Mumia asked me to represent him in 1986, and I turned him down; I was
just too busy with other cases -- when I finally took over the case -- he
came back to me four-and-a-half or five years ago -- one of the first things
I did was, I started talking with the NAACP Legal Defense Fund here in New
York, because they are very well-known for their great work and particularly
in racism in jury selection, which is one of our big issues.

And so, they argued -- Christine Swarns of that office argued yesterday. I
shared some of -- and I was able to persuade the court -- I filed a motion
asking if they'd be able to share some of my argument time. Normally, what
they would call *amicus curiae*, friend of the court people, organizations
like the NAACP Legal Defense Fund, only submit briefs. I asked the court if
they could also join me in argument, and the court granted it, which was
wonderful.

And so, here I was here up arguing then, and my associate Judith Ritter,
who's a law professor, argued. And she argued strictly on the death penalty
issue. And then the NAACP Legal Defense Fund was able to argue. And then I
wrapped up. I argued twice. But it was marvelous to have them join us. So I
think it indicates the concern this court has. They seem to be trying to
grapple with trying to do the right thing. Only time will tell. But also the
National Lawyers Guild filed an *amicus curiae* brief. They did not argue
yesterday, because we just didn't have enough time.

*AMY GOODMAN: *Ed Rendell, the governor of Pennsylvania, was the DA at the
time in 1982 --

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Yes.

*AMY GOODMAN: *-- when Mumia Abu-Jamal was tried. His wife is a judge on the
Third Circuit?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *But she recused herself, disqualified herself. She does in
every case down in Philadelphia, so that was a non-issue. The prosecution
tried to use that red herring to get rid of this court, and, of course, the
court slapped them down and rejected that. She always steps aside in these
type of cases.

*AMY GOODMAN: *Mumia Abu-Jamal was not at the hearing yesterday?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *No, unfortunately, because it wasn't a trial.

*AMY GOODMAN: *How is he doing?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *I talked with him at length, Amy, last night, and he was
very humble about what happened yesterday. And his comments to me -- and,
incidentally, he wanted me to say hello to both of you this morning -- his
comments to me was, "You know what I want, Robert: people to understand that
this is not about me, Mumia Abu-Jamal. This is about everybody on death row
around the world. This is about all political prisoners around the world.
And I hope that, through what the court does in this case, it will help
other people." It's a typical Mumia comment and attitude, and he's very
humble about his position in this.

*JUAN GONZALEZ: *And also, for some of our listeners or viewers who may not
be as familiar with Mumia's case, how would you estimate the impact of his
case -- given the virtual blackout that you have in the commercial media of
the Mumia Abu-Jamal case, what is the impact of this case around the world?

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Well, the impact in commercial media, as we're speaking
today, has been shifting and changing. I've worked hard to try to bring it
to everybody, the message in this case. But it's a worldwide issue, Mumia
Abu-Jamal. I have given a number of talks in Paris, in various places in
France. I spoke to 2,500 people in January in Berlin, Germany. And there's
world interest, standing ovation at the end of all of these talks. And it's
not about me. It's not about Mumia, as he keeps reminding me. It's about him
as a symbol in the fight against the death penalty.

And you have to remember that he's unique in the world, because Mumia
Abu-Jamal is not just a death row prisoner, a brilliant one at that, but he
is a journalist. When he was arrested, he was already known as the voice of
the voiceless, and he continues from this tiny bathroom-sized cell to turn
out weekly these commentaries that are read and heard by people, not only
here, but around the world. And it just -- there's nothing like what's
happening with Mumia around the world. So he's important to people
everywhere.

*AMY GOODMAN: *Robert Bryan, I want to thank you very much for being with
us. Robert Bryan is the lead attorney for Mumia Abu-Jamal, fellow of the
American Board of Criminal Lawyers, former chair of the National Coalition
to Abolish the Death Penalty. And we will certainly continue to follow this
case. Thank you.

*ROBERT BRYAN: *Thank you.


-- 
Brian Dolinar, Ph.D.
303 W. Locust St.
Urbana, IL 61801
briandolinar at gmail.com
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