From carl at newsfromneptune.com Mon Nov 1 17:20:41 2021 From: carl at newsfromneptune.com (C. G. Estabrook) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2021 12:20:41 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Chomsky on vaccines & voting Message-ID: <4B7AD942-CCEB-428A-AB7E-4A0283D27413@newsfromneptune.com> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzWcP2b4uZ4 From karenaram at hotmail.com Mon Nov 1 18:59:52 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2021 13:59:52 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: A very interesting analysis of the film Spartacus References: Message-ID: > Subject: Analysis of the film Spartacus > > http://isj.org.uk/spartacus/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbn at forestfield.org Tue Nov 2 00:37:40 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2021 19:37:40 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Chomsky on vaccines & voting In-Reply-To: <4B7AD942-CCEB-428A-AB7E-4A0283D27413@newsfromneptune.com> References: <4B7AD942-CCEB-428A-AB7E-4A0283D27413@newsfromneptune.com> Message-ID: <4ac8396e-f725-d906-fd64-6b36e9cca3a3@forestfield.org> C. G. Estabrook via Peace-discuss wrote: > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzWcP2b4uZ4 https://youtube.com/watch?v=Cc_neyVp-rI has just the vaccine mandate section of that interview. Jimmy Dore is really doing well on this topic. For responses, please watch: Jimmy Dore Show https://youtube.com/watch?v=IpEch0McjZ0 -- ""Isolate Unvaxxed From Society" says Noam Chomsky" https://youtube.com/watch?v=zYkbIf27Gqs -- "Vaxxed Just As Likely To Spread Covid As Unvaxxed - New Study" Full Primo Radical interview of Jimmy Dore https://youtube.com/watch?v=wB0a0DrgbdE Bloomberg.com (https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-10-28/getting-vaccinated-doesn-t-stop-people-from-spreading-delta) has been publishing about a recent study: > People inoculated against Covid-19 are just as likely to spread the delta variant > of the virus to contacts in their household as those who haven?t had shots, > according to new research. > > In a yearlong study of 621 people in the U.K. with mild Covid-19, scientists found > that their peak viral load was similar regardless of vaccination status, according > to a paper published Thursday in The Lancet Infectious Diseases medical journal. > The analysis also found that 25% of vaccinated household contacts still contracted > the disease from an index case, while 38% of those who hadn?t had shots became > infected. This significantly undermines Chomsky's view that the unvaccinated are "killers". Even the CDC Director publicly recognizes that "Covid-19 vaccines no longer prevent transmission" according to CNN. As I type this Jimmy Dore is live (https://youtube.com/watch?v=ECD7d8tC_4Q) with Prof. Richard Wolff on the class fight going on now which involves Covid-19 mandates. Dore was just talking about the flip-flopping liberals (ACLU, Joe Biden, Nancy Pelosi) going from objecting to a vaccine mandate to supporting a mandate, or vaccine passport (which disallows access to the unvaccinated). Chomsky seemed supportive of mandates as well based on his misframing (comparing vaccine hesitancy/rejection to objecting to traffic lights) and misinformation (unvaccinated are "killers"). From what we can tell, we will not vaccinate our way out of this pandemic. Even if we could magically vaccinate all people, we'd all pass around Covid. Vaccinating everyone is to be avoided because it will make worse Covid variants that we can't defend ourselves from (much like superbugs arise in fully-vaccinated commercial chicken coops, as Dr. Malone points out in the interview I cite below). We should vaccinate the vulnerable -- elderly and those with co-morbidities. But we see vaccine mandates for children and healthy adults (like Joe Rogan and Bill Mahr who have both survived Covid and question getting vaccinated with "booster" shots). See Jimmy Dore's interview with Dr. Robert Malone (mRNA technology inventor) for more (https://yewtu.be/watch?v=iwPKnOhJRYg). The interview further undermines so much of what Chomsky's views on this topic. Covid-19 will become endemic (more widespread, less deadly). So if you're vulnerable (elderly, have co-morbidities) and you fear Covid you could get vaccinated and reduce the odds you'll be hospitalized or die. But no vaccine you can get will make you safe from Covid. If you've had Covid and lived, you likely possess superior antibodies to what any vaccine could give you hence you could well be unvaccinated and be better suited to cope than the vaccinated. I don't agree with the logic of 'any Blue will do', but that's another topic. Chomsky doesn't agree with that specific wording, but he uses other poor logic to arrive at the same conclusion I disagree with -- keep voting Democratic Party. -J From brussel at illinois.edu Tue Nov 2 01:25:38 2021 From: brussel at illinois.edu (Brussel, Morton K) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 2021 01:25:38 +0000 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Chomsky on vaccines & voting In-Reply-To: <4B7AD942-CCEB-428A-AB7E-4A0283D27413@newsfromneptune.com> References: <4B7AD942-CCEB-428A-AB7E-4A0283D27413@newsfromneptune.com> Message-ID: Listening to Chomsky on this interview was for me painful. His avoiding of questions involving Venezuela (Guido!) or Syria (Mat? reports) or with of like Congresswoman Ocasio(?) Ortez was abysmal. (Yes, she did exemplary things on climate policy!). He willfully avoided tough questions put to him on several topics, boasting instead of his own past positions. His lack of objectivity on the behavior of the Democratic party (on militarism/Russia/China, for example) was worse than regretful, his answer being that in view of the Republicans, one has no real choice. I found that to be at best superficial. Most who recorded their opinions of the interview (thumbs up or down) found it disappointing? ?mkb > On Nov 1, 2021, at 12:20 PM, C. G. Estabrook via Peace-discuss wrote: > > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzWcP2b4uZ4__;!!DZ3fjg!uahcK_wckK7D9yk3UQeQeUx5C3_kaWc4f0vT_W8a8Qi1unxV11EEN47L_I63R2Q$ > > _______________________________________________ > Peace-discuss mailing list > Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net > https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss__;!!DZ3fjg!uahcK_wckK7D9yk3UQeQeUx5C3_kaWc4f0vT_W8a8Qi1unxV11EEN47LZFI-Nyg$ From karenaram at hotmail.com Tue Nov 2 11:00:30 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 2021 06:00:30 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] Chomsky on vaccines & voting In-Reply-To: References: <4B7AD942-CCEB-428A-AB7E-4A0283D27413@newsfromneptune.com> Message-ID: Mort Sadly, you aren?t alone in your disappointment with Chomsky, many others feel exactly the same. > On Nov 1, 2021, at 8:25 PM, Brussel, Morton K via Peace wrote: > > Listening to Chomsky on this interview was for me painful. His avoiding of questions involving Venezuela (Guido!) or Syria (Mat? reports) or with of like Congresswoman Ocasio(?) Ortez was abysmal. (Yes, she did exemplary things on climate policy!). He willfully avoided tough questions put to him on several topics, boasting instead of his own past positions. His lack of objectivity on the behavior of the Democratic party (on militarism/Russia/China, for example) was worse than regretful, his answer being that in view of the Republicans, one has no real choice. I found that to be at best superficial. > > Most who recorded their opinions of the interview (thumbs up or down) found it disappointing? > > ?mkb > >> On Nov 1, 2021, at 12:20 PM, C. G. Estabrook via Peace-discuss wrote: >> >> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzWcP2b4uZ4__;!!DZ3fjg!uahcK_wckK7D9yk3UQeQeUx5C3_kaWc4f0vT_W8a8Qi1unxV11EEN47L_I63R2Q$ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Peace-discuss mailing list >> Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net >> https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss__;!!DZ3fjg!uahcK_wckK7D9yk3UQeQeUx5C3_kaWc4f0vT_W8a8Qi1unxV11EEN47LZFI-Nyg$ > > _______________________________________________ > Peace mailing list > Peace at lists.chambana.net > https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace From jbn at forestfield.org Tue Nov 2 22:53:44 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Tue, 2 Nov 2021 17:53:44 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Chomsky on vaccines & voting In-Reply-To: <4ac8396e-f725-d906-fd64-6b36e9cca3a3@forestfield.org> References: <4B7AD942-CCEB-428A-AB7E-4A0283D27413@newsfromneptune.com> <4ac8396e-f725-d906-fd64-6b36e9cca3a3@forestfield.org> Message-ID: <0d1efae3-5b27-b1ce-58d4-c311369b7aae@forestfield.org> I wrote: > As I type this Jimmy Dore is live (https://youtube.com/watch?v=ECD7d8tC_4Q) with > Prof. Richard Wolff on the class fight going on now which involves Covid-19 mandates. https://youtube.com/watch?v=Z1S6KGzUX10 https://rumble.com/voluae-workers-uprising-vaxx-mandates-wages-labor-militancy-wprofessor-richard-wol.html has this interview with Prof. Wolff. The YouTube.com copy might be higher-res than rumble.com -- 1080P instead of 720P -- but the same interview with the same discussion are in both. I recommend watching the interview. Side note on rumble.com: I'd guess that it's just a matter of time before Alphabet (which owns Google and thus owns YouTube) censors Jimmy Dore more, pushing Dore & co. to move everything they do to rumble.com. I don't know when the Dore live shows will go to rumble.com but I'd bet that they will at some point. We won't know if Rumble will cave to censorious pressure as Facebook, YouTube, and Twitter have until the US government extends their unlawful censorship threats to Rumble. I say that this pressure campaign is unlawful because, as far as I know, it's not legal for the US government to get private parties to carry out the censorship it can't do itself on threat of punishment (such as shutting down access to their websites by blocking network access in various ways, increased harassment via taxation review/audit, or even kidnapping and imprisoning company personnel as the US government got the Canadian government to do against Huawei). There will be a new live Jimmy Dore show on tomorrow (2021-11-03) evening, according to Stef Zamorano yesterday. Keep an eye on https://youtube.com/channel/UC3M7l8ved_rYQ45AVzS0RGA for the live show URL tomorrow evening (Central time zone). -J From karenaram at hotmail.com Wed Nov 3 14:24:18 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2021 09:24:18 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: Stokely on Black Power References: Message-ID: > An Important point is made. > While freedom is necessary as the first goal to be achieved, once freedom has been acquired, power is required. > > Stokely aka Kwame Ture and SNCC saw this clearly during the civil rights movement of the 60's. > Power is required to improve the material conditions which are necessary for survival, and without which we can see the results today, both in the US and South Africa. KA > > Please see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A9SKoMfzek From jbw292002 at gmail.com Wed Nov 3 17:20:28 2021 From: jbw292002 at gmail.com (John W.) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2021 12:20:28 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] Fwd: Stokely on Black Power In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Sure. And what inevitably happens when power is acquired? On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 9:24 AM karen aram via Peace < peace at lists.chambana.net> wrote: > An Important point is made. > > > While freedom is necessary as the first goal to be achieved, once > freedom has been acquired, power is required. > > > > Stokely aka Kwame Ture and SNCC saw this clearly during the civil rights > movement of the 60's. > > Power is required to improve the material conditions which are necessary > for survival, and without which we can see the results today, both in the > US and South Africa. KA > > > > Please see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A9SKoMfzek > > _______________________________________________ > Peace mailing list > Peace at lists.chambana.net > https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karenaram at hotmail.com Wed Nov 3 18:01:29 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2021 13:01:29 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] Fwd: Stokely on Black Power In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Well John, had Africans in South African actually gained power they might not be suffering the exact same conditions they are now. The end of apartheid brought freedom, but freedom to do what, it didn?t change any of the conditions of poverty, lack of education, healthcare, housing, jobs, clean water, and the crime there is one of the worse in the world. Check out what is taking place there now with Covid, etc. Or read Naomi Klein?s "Shock Doctrine," which covers this issue a bit. In short they gained freedom at the expense of allowing foreign investment by corporations come in and exploit. In the US, we ended racism with the civil rights marches didn?t we? It?s true we have many AfroAmericans now receiving an education, rising into positions of power, the professions, etc. We even had a Black President didn?t we? Did he improve the lives of any Black people? No, other than his own, in fact the AfroAmerican communities are worse now than ever. Yes, some have benefitted and thats a good thing. However, the majority of AfroAmerican communities have continued to suffer poverty, poor education, poor housing and healthcare, unhealthy water, and other environmental conditions. Many white people suffer poverty etc, its not just AfroAmericans but always the AfroAmericans suffer the most. So many died just getting out the vote, and for what, to have a system that gerrymanders them out with rules and regulations making it difficult, and then putting individuals into power that do nothing for them? Even if the individuals are sincere, it matters not because individuals lack power. Our mass incarceration is a perfect example. It began under the Nixon administration as a continuation of preventing a rise of AfroAmericans as the Panthers, and SNCC which I am particularly fond given they were clearly on the right path. By the way, Stokely was only a Panther for one year, for many reasons. His points were very much shared by Fred Hampton, Elaine Brown and others who recognized just putting individuals in power meant they would be coopted by the organizations, not necessarily corrupted, but ?..there are other podcasts which have them discussing this issue in the ?80?s? not Fred he was already dead, because he dared unite with white racist activists from the south, convincing them that their suffering was the same as Black Africans. The US could never allow such unity. Just look at today, how many AfroAmericans have died by shooting in the back by police with impunity. It matters not what the race of the police happen to be, and it?s not just a matter of one bad apple, it?s systemic. As to ?freedom," yes I?m sure there are millions of people across the globe ever so grateful for US assistance in gaining their freedom, by way of US imperialism with financial debt, bombs, drones, sanctions, etc. Libya, Yemen, Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, just to name a few of the most obvious. To gain power one must focus on class and those who suffer from poverty related to capitalism. Stokely and others recognized that we need system change, if we?re to improve the lives of not just some, but all. I recommend ?Ready for Revolution,? by Kwame Ture aka Stokely Carmichael. Michael Hudsons 3rd edition of "Super Imperialism.? Vijay Prasad?s ?Bullets Over Washington.? And, many more. > On Nov 3, 2021, at 12:20 PM, John W. wrote: > > > Sure. And what inevitably happens when power is acquired? > > > > On Wed, Nov 3, 2021 at 9:24 AM karen aram via Peace > wrote: > > > An Important point is made. > > > While freedom is necessary as the first goal to be achieved, once freedom has been acquired, power is required. > > > > Stokely aka Kwame Ture and SNCC saw this clearly during the civil rights movement of the 60's. > > Power is required to improve the material conditions which are necessary for survival, and without which we can see the results today, both in the US and South Africa. KA > > > > Please see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A9SKoMfzek > > _______________________________________________ > Peace mailing list > Peace at lists.chambana.net > https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karenaram at hotmail.com Thu Nov 4 00:13:00 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Wed, 3 Nov 2021 19:13:00 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: What is imperialism/PSL References: Message-ID: > > https://liberationschool.org/09-what-is-imperialism-html/ From karenaram at hotmail.com Fri Nov 5 23:39:29 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Fri, 5 Nov 2021 18:39:29 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: Daniel Hale, whistleblower's, address in jail References: Message-ID: > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karenaram at hotmail.com Sun Nov 7 18:54:31 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Sun, 7 Nov 2021 12:54:31 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: [GSJ] World Protests - New publication, website and invitation to launch/discussion next Tuesday, November 9, 9:30 ET/3:30 CET References: Message-ID: > Begin forwarded message: > > From: iortiz at globalsocialjustice.org (Isabel Ortiz) > Date: November 5, 2021 at 3:55:39 AM CDT > To: > Subject: [GSJ] World Protests - New publication, website and invitation to launch/discussion next Tuesday, November 9, 9:30 ET/3:30 CET > > Dear friends, > > We have just published a new book (free download), interactive website and invite you to the launch of: > World Protests:?A Study of Key Protest Issues in the 21st Century > > The start of the 21st century has seen the world shaken by protests, from the Arab Spring to the Yellow Vests, from the Occupy movement to the social uprisings in Latin America. There are periods in history when large numbers of people have rebelled against the way things are, demanding change, such as in 1848, 1917, and 1968. Today we are living in another time of outrage and discontent, a time that has already produced some of the largest protests in world history. > > This book analyzes almost three thousand protests that occurred between 2006 and 2020 in 101 countries covering over 93 per cent of the world population. The study focuses on the major demands driving world protests, such as those for real democracy, jobs, public services, social protection, civil rights, global justice, and those against austerity and corruption. It also analyzes who was demonstrating in each protest; what protest methods they used; who the protestors opposed; what was achieved; whether protests were repressed; and trends such as inequality and the rise of women?s and radical right protests. The book concludes that the demands of protestors in most of the protests surveyed are in full accordance with human rights and internationally-agreed UN development goals. The book calls for policy-makers to listen and act on these demands. > > Download the book: https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/10.1007%2F978-3-030-88513-7.pdf > Publisher: Palgrave Macmillan; Book details: https://link.springer.com/book/10.1007/978-3-030-88513-7#about > Check the World Protests website: https://worldprotests.org/ > > ONLINE DISCUSSION | TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 9, 9:30-11:00am ET > > Friedrich-Ebert-Stiftung New York and the Global Social Justice program at the Initiative for Policy Dialogue (IPD)invite you to a virtual panel discussion of World Protests: A Study of Key Protest Issues in the 21st Century, and its interactive website > > PRESENTATION OF WORLD PROTESTS STUDY > Isabel Ortiz, Global Social Justice Program, IPD, New York > Sara Burke, Friedrich-Ebert-Stiftung, New York > Mohamed Berrada, Economist and Data Analyst, Morocco > Hernan Saenz Cortes, International Relations Expert, Brussels > > PANELISTS > Walden Bello, Human Rights Activist; Co-Chair of the Board, Focus on the Global South > Owen Tudor, Deputy General Secretary, International Trade Union Confederation > Tinashe Mazala, Co-Founder and Chair of the Board, Centre for Young Leaders in Africa > Thomas Frank, Economic Historian; Author of The People, No: A Brief History of Anti-Populism > Alejandra Alayza Moncloa, Head of Office, Oxfam Peru > > MODERATOR > Ines Pohl, Washington, D.C. Bureau Chief, Deutsche Welle > Best regards, > Isabel Ortiz, Sara Burke, Mohamed Berrada and Hern?n Saenz Cort?s > > Isabel Ortiz | Director | Global Social Justice Program > Initiative for Policy Dialogue (IPD) | > iortiz at globalsocialjustice.org | http://www.isabelortiz.info > > ________________________________ > > About this e-discussion: After 10 years running the e-discussion Recovery with a Human Face (2010-20) at UNICEF and ILO, it was closed and replaced by this new discussion on Global Social Justice [GSJ]. Please share your inputs by e-mailing: gsj at list.globalsocialjustice.org . This e-discussion is intended to facilitate the exchange of knowledge and ideas; the views expressed by contributors do not necessarily reflect the policies of GSJ. The e-discussion continues being moderated by Isabel Ortiz, for comments, to subscribe or unsubscribe pls contact: iortiz at globalsocialjustice.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbn at forestfield.org Tue Nov 9 01:27:32 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Mon, 8 Nov 2021 19:27:32 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Recommended videos for AWARE on the Air, News from Neptune, and Labor's World View TV Message-ID: Here are the videos I recommended to run during AWARE on the Air, News from Neptune, and Labor's World View TV. As a reminder: If anyone else has anything to run, please feel free to get your pointers to Jason Liggett (jcliggett at urbanaillinois.us). I routinely ask him to prioritize AWARE members pointers over mine for AWARE on the Air, Carl Estabrook & David Green's pointers over mine for News from Neptune, and David Johnson's pointers over mine for Labor's World View TV. I might not be able to get to add more videos soon, so I hope this is sufficient to run for a while. -J Glenn Greenwald https://youtube.com/watch?v=cgo7JXgk_t4 (27m 3s) -- Why Aren't Democrats Protesting the Biden DOJ Over Lack of 1/6 Insurrection Charges? laborvideo https://youtube.com/watch?v=11cj6A9g0fE (34m 41s) -- IUOE Kaiser Striker "We're On Verge Of What Could Be Biggest Healthcare Strike In American History" More Perfect Union https://youtube.com/watch?v=NRTHDERxANA (6m) -- Small Town Residents Fight Back Against Google's Greed https://youtube.com/watch?v=hvNwvHjK_Vk (6m 25s) -- HelloFresh Workers EXPOSE Horrific Working Conditions https://youtube.com/watch?v=ZxWC4EBUS9k (6m) -- John Deere, Ford Workers Fight Against Corrupt Leadership https://youtube.com/watch?v=55pSQvy3YK8 (5m 24s) -- "Dollar General Workers EXPOSE Company's Illegal Union-Busting" https://youtube.com/watch?v=gpOlNkIwjZk (4m 33s) -- "EXCLUSIVE - Inside The Starbucks Anti-Union Campaign" RT https://youtube.com/watch?v=xPjgZI_4kqE (27m 50s) -- The Young Lords - A Radical History https://youtube.com/watch?v=4bsrrbT9eco (28m 29s) -- Sex, Women, Gender Identity https://youtube.com/watch?v=h3TCz8jPjHA (23m 58s) -- First Tortured CIA Prisoner Testifies Consortium News https://youtube.com/watch?v=G9nLqTLNVX4 (1h 18m 16s) -- Conference: 'Stop the Torture: Free Assange' MintPressNews https://youtube.com/watch?v=MeGnznDifEQ (46m 42s) -- Bob Gill On US Corporate Takeover of NHS With Lowkey https://youtube.com/watch?v=AkWMMb36kWA (1h 6m 41s) -- Shutting Down Israel's War Machine: Palestine Action w/ Lowkey World Socialist Web Site https://youtube.com/watch?v=T-bZ_9hn6_Q (5m 36s) -- Workers speak on the need to end the pandemic https://youtube.com/watch?v=PUm-6DDrvaQ (7m) -- London bus driver David O?Sullivan speaks on the ?war? on the working class From stuartnlevy at gmail.com Tue Nov 9 22:31:59 2021 From: stuartnlevy at gmail.com (Stuart Levy) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2021 16:31:59 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] old AWARE signs: anyone want them? Message-ID: <7e1c13fb-5afd-6a53-3cbc-1409b2a7858f@gmail.com> Hello people of AWARE, Karen and I are housecleaning.?? We have ~18 years' worth of AWARE signs in our garage and basement.?? I'm thinking to discard most of them, keeping maybe a tenth or so of the collection. If anyone is really interested in either (a) keeping some yourself or (b) going through the signs before we toss them, please respond in the next day or two. If we don't hear from anyone, they'll probably be mostly gone by next week. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbn at forestfield.org Wed Nov 10 01:21:53 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2021 19:21:53 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Recommended videos for AWARE on the Air, News from Neptune, and Labor's World View TV In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I wrote: > As a reminder: If anyone else has anything to run, please feel free to get your > pointers to Jason Liggett (jcliggett at urbanaillinois.us). An update on this from Jason Liggett: > My last day at the City will be November 30. In the future, go ahead and send > these to uptv at urbanaillinois.us > > UPTV Production Coordinator Bourema Ouedraogo will be taking over the full-time > day to day operations of UPTV. UPTV Production Assistant Brie Gaspar will be > working Tuesday and Thursday evenings and all day on Saturday to download these > programs and assist our other members as needed. Bourema will be in charge of > scheduling these for broadcast. The uptv email listed above sends an email to > both Bourema and Brie. Bourema's individual email is > bouedraogo at urbanaillinois.us. Brie's individual email is > bmgaspar at urbanaillinois.us. Many thanks to Jason for all these years of great service to us! My next batch and the subsequent batches will go to uptv at urbanaillinois.us. -J From carl at newsfromneptune.com Wed Nov 10 18:51:31 2021 From: carl at newsfromneptune.com (C. G. Estabrook) Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2021 12:51:31 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Chomsky on China, etc. Message-ID: <326878C6-18C7-422B-B50E-C5A3ED954FF3@newsfromneptune.com> Hugo Kruger interviews Noam Chomsky on China, vaccination, etc. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mve5NepeZCo ### From jbn at forestfield.org Fri Nov 12 03:41:06 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Thu, 11 Nov 2021 21:41:06 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] DN still carrying establishment water, now on Nicaraguan elections Message-ID: From Aaron Mat? in https://twitter.com/i/status/1457766073995087874: > This is how @democracynow "reported" the news of Nicaragua's presidential > elections today. It sounds like it's lifted from a State Department press > release: From https://www.democracynow.org/2021/11/08/headlines/#ortega_set_to_retain_nicaraguan_presidency_in_elections_marred_by_crackdown_on_opposition > In Nicaragua, President Daniel Ortega appears to have secured his victory in > Sunday?s election after unleashing a months-long crackdown on his opposition. An > early count shows Ortega receiving about three-quarters of the vote, with around > half of the ballots still to be counted. He?s seeking a fourth term as president. > Dozens of opposition figures, including seven presidential hopefuls, have been > arrested since June. That prompted international outcry and sanctions from the > U.S., European Union and other nations. This is an exiled Nicaraguan in San Jos?, > Costa Rica, at a protest denouncing Sunday?s election. > > Noemi Pav?n: ?In Nicaragua, there are no elections. In Nicaragua, there is an > electoral circus, where Ortega chose those who will accompany him in this > political circus. He let his political allies go free ? collaborationist parties, > as we call them. He imprisoned those candidates who formed a genuine opposition.? Aaron Mat? continues in subsequent posts to the aforementioned Twitter thread: > There's a whole int'l delegation, including from US, in Nicaragua observing the > vote. And there are journalists like @BenjaminNorton who live there and do > in-depth reporting, including on the US-backed right-wing opposition. DN once > elevated voices like these; not any longer. > For a corrective to the hegemonic US propaganda parroted by @democracynow, see the > reporting (on the ground in Nicaragua) by The Grayzone and @BenjaminNorton: See https://thegrayzone.com/2021/11/05/nicaragua-us-informant-dora-maria-tellez-mrs/ -- "From Nicaraguan revolutionaries to US embassy informants: How Washington recruited ex-Sandinistas like Dora Mar?a T?llez and her MRS party" Also see The Convo Couch's coverage of the Nicaraguan election such as https://twitter.com/theconvocouch/status/1457983793323823107 and reports on their YouTube channel such as: https://youtube.com/watch?v=GSZPFbOctZI -- Debunking the U.S Lies on Nicaragua?s Election Process - Our On-The-Ground Experience https://youtube.com/watch?v=C85sxtpOD4M -- Debunking Western Lies on Nicaraguan Elections https://youtube.com/watch?v=aEDvx2JIE2E -- LIVE Press Conf. Debunking MSM Lies - Managua, Nicaragua https://youtube.com/watch?v=4nSyqhWBItw -- LIVE 4th VOTING STATION in Bilwi, Nicaragua https://youtube.com/watch?v=kQlr0RoTrfg -- LIVE Nicaragua Elections - Loma Verde, Bilwi, Nicaragua https://youtube.com/watch?v=mdGnm6-6hY4 -- LIVE Debunking CNN, NYT - Polling Stations Open NICARAGUA Pres. Biden and VP Harris still have plenty of time left in their administration to foment a Nicaraguan coup. One wonders if Amy Goodman will stop serving establishment interests and make her show worth watching and hearing again. For now the best I can say about DN is that their best is behind them; I remember the high point of that show's history during the run-up to the 2003 Iraq war when DN was challenging the establishment with unembedded journalists and debunking NYT lies about Iraqi WMDs making DN a must-see show. DN was not repeating the establishment narrative or re-airing CNN without critique as DN apparently does now. From naiman.uiuc at gmail.com Fri Nov 12 15:01:00 2021 From: naiman.uiuc at gmail.com (Robert Naiman) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 10:01:00 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] DK: TeamBernie: Use JRD as Lever to Force Senate NDAA Vote to End Saudi War in Yemen In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: The Battle of Lexington was a Delaying Action. The real prize was in Concord. The Arsenal in Concord was the Crown Jewels. Lexington was on the road between Boston and Concord. The key purpose of the Battle of Lexington was to slow the march of British troops from Boston to Concord so that Minutemen from all over Massachusetts - mobilized by the Midnight Riders the night before - would have more time to get to Concord to reinforce the Concord Minutemen and protect the Concord Arsenal from the British troops. Protecting the WPR was Lexington. This is Concord. This is the real prize. This is for all the marbles. Please vote in the poll: ?I WANT THE SENATE TO VOTE ON ENDING THE SAUDI WAR IN YEMEN ON NDAA.? https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2021/11/12/2063874/-TeamBernie-Use-JRD-as-Lever-to-Force-Senate-NDAA-Vote-to-End-Saudi-War-in-Yemen TeamBernie: Use JRD as Lever to Force Senate NDAA Vote to End Saudi War in Yemen If we?ve learned one thing in our efforts in DC since early 2016 to end the Saudi war in Yemen, it is this: it?s all about forcing votes in Congress. That is the Alpha and Omega. That is Jesus, Mary, and the Saints. That is Moses and the Prophets. It?s all about forcing votes in Congress. Not counting the War Powers Resolution for the sake of this discussion, there are two paths to a floor vote right now in the Senate on ending the Saudi war in Yemen. One is, getting Leader Schumer and SASC Chair Reed to voluntarily agree out of the goodness of their hearts to allow a vote on the Sanders-Khanna NDAA amendment to shut down U.S. participation in the war. As recently as a month ago, the conventional wisdom in DC was that this was a long shot, and activists were preparing a new push for a new Yemen War Powers Resolution in anticipation of getting shut down on NDAA once again even though supposedly Democrats control everything now and the Democratic Platform commits Democrats to ending the Saudi war in Yemen. The other path to the Senate floor is, introducing a Joint Resolution of Disapproval in the Senate on the Biden-Saudi Bomb Deal pursuant to the Arms Export Control Act. Such a resolution would be privileged. It would force a vote. So here is a proposal for Team Bernie: introduce the JRD, and use it as leverage with Schumer and Reed to force an NDAA vote on Sanders-Khanna. Go to Schumer and say: ?We can do this the easy way, or we can do it the hard way. Allow a vote on NDAA on Sanders-Khanna with a 51 vote threshold for passage, and we will back down on the JRD.? Here?s why this would be a good deal for both sides. >From Schumer?s point of view, the JRD is more of a pain in the butt than the Sanders-Khanna amendment. It would take up more floor time. It would take up more focus, attract more media attention. >From the point of view of activists trying to end the Saudi war in Yemen, an NDAA vote with a 51 vote threshold on the Sanders-Khanna NDAA amendment would be more worthwhile than a JRD vote. The JRD vote would be flashier, attract more attention. But the Sanders-Khanna NDAA amendment is more biting. And that?s what matters more now. The flashy thing, we already did that. What matters now is how binding the legislation is, because the Biden Administration has now proved beyond any shadow of a doubt that it is absolutely determined to try to restore the Obama Administration status quo of maximum coziness with the Saudi regime to the maximum extent that they can get away with it. The Biden Administration is going to do good things on this front exactly to the extent to which they are forced to do so by Congress and not one iota more. Biden could veto a JRD. At this point, I wouldn?t put it past him. Biden is not going to veto the NDAA over Yemen, no way, no how. The NDAA is ?must pass legislation.? Introduce the JRD. Use it to force an NDAA vote on Sanders-Khanna. End the Saudi war in Yemen. ?We?re putting the Band back together.? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karenaram at hotmail.com Fri Nov 12 16:26:17 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2021 10:26:17 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] DN still carrying establishment water, now on Nicaraguan elections In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: J.B. Your analysis by way of Aaron Mate, Ben Norton, and so many others is spot on. Unfortunately those who only receive their news from NPR, Democracy Now, CNN or Fox are clueless as to what is taking place whether Nicaragua, Venezuela, Russia or China. We can now add Ethiopia to the list. Please see: https://blackagendareport.com/abraham-wodaje-kebede-ground-ethiopia. The below is a very interesting debate with conservatives and communists in agreement on the cause of so many problems related to our economy today. Please see: https://www.rt.com/shows/crosstalk/540015-economic-processes-great-reset/ On Nov 11, 2021, at 9:41 PM, J.B. Nicholson via Peace wrote: > From Aaron Mat? in https://twitter.com/i/status/1457766073995087874: > >> This is how @democracynow "reported" the news of Nicaragua's presidential >> elections today. It sounds like it's lifted from a State Department press >> release: > From https://www.democracynow.org/2021/11/08/headlines/#ortega_set_to_retain_nicaraguan_presidency_in_elections_marred_by_crackdown_on_opposition > >> In Nicaragua, President Daniel Ortega appears to have secured his victory in >> Sunday?s election after unleashing a months-long crackdown on his opposition. An >> early count shows Ortega receiving about three-quarters of the vote, with around >> half of the ballots still to be counted. He?s seeking a fourth term as president. >> Dozens of opposition figures, including seven presidential hopefuls, have been >> arrested since June. That prompted international outcry and sanctions from the >> U.S., European Union and other nations. This is an exiled Nicaraguan in San Jos?, >> Costa Rica, at a protest denouncing Sunday?s election. >> Noemi Pav?n: ?In Nicaragua, there are no elections. In Nicaragua, there is an >> electoral circus, where Ortega chose those who will accompany him in this >> political circus. He let his political allies go free ? collaborationist parties, >> as we call them. He imprisoned those candidates who formed a genuine opposition.? > Aaron Mat? continues in subsequent posts to the aforementioned Twitter thread: > >> There's a whole int'l delegation, including from US, in Nicaragua observing the >> vote. And there are journalists like @BenjaminNorton who live there and do >> in-depth reporting, including on the US-backed right-wing opposition. DN once >> elevated voices like these; not any longer. >> For a corrective to the hegemonic US propaganda parroted by @democracynow, see the >> reporting (on the ground in Nicaragua) by The Grayzone and @BenjaminNorton: > See https://thegrayzone.com/2021/11/05/nicaragua-us-informant-dora-maria-tellez-mrs/ -- "From Nicaraguan revolutionaries to US embassy informants: How Washington recruited ex-Sandinistas like Dora Mar?a T?llez and her MRS party" > > Also see The Convo Couch's coverage of the Nicaraguan election such as https://twitter.com/theconvocouch/status/1457983793323823107 and reports on their YouTube channel such as: > > https://youtube.com/watch?v=GSZPFbOctZI -- Debunking the U.S Lies on Nicaragua?s Election Process - Our On-The-Ground Experience > https://youtube.com/watch?v=C85sxtpOD4M -- Debunking Western Lies on Nicaraguan Elections > https://youtube.com/watch?v=aEDvx2JIE2E -- LIVE Press Conf. Debunking MSM Lies - Managua, Nicaragua > https://youtube.com/watch?v=4nSyqhWBItw -- LIVE 4th VOTING STATION in Bilwi, Nicaragua > https://youtube.com/watch?v=kQlr0RoTrfg -- LIVE Nicaragua Elections - Loma Verde, Bilwi, Nicaragua > https://youtube.com/watch?v=mdGnm6-6hY4 -- LIVE Debunking CNN, NYT - Polling Stations Open NICARAGUA > > Pres. Biden and VP Harris still have plenty of time left in their administration to foment a Nicaraguan coup. One wonders if Amy Goodman will stop serving establishment interests and make her show worth watching and hearing again. For now the best I can say about DN is that their best is behind them; I remember the high point of that show's history during the run-up to the 2003 Iraq war when DN was challenging the establishment with unembedded journalists and debunking NYT lies about Iraqi WMDs making DN a must-see show. DN was not repeating the establishment narrative or re-airing CNN without critique as DN apparently does now. > _______________________________________________ > Peace mailing list > Peace at lists.chambana.net > https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace From r-szoke at illinois.edu Sat Nov 13 19:20:48 2021 From: r-szoke at illinois.edu (Szoke, Ron) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 19:20:48 +0000 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Unacknowledged Airstrike Killed Dozens Message-ID: NYT online 111321 How the U.S. Hid an Airstrike That Killed Dozens of Civilians in Syria The military never conducted an independent investigation into a 2019 bombing on the last bastion of the Islamic State, despite concerns about a secretive commando force. By Dave Philipps and Eric Schmitt Nov. 13, 2021, Updated 1:33 p.m. ET In the last days of the battle against the Islamic State in Syria, when members of the once-fierce caliphate were cornered in a dirt field next to a town called Baghuz, a U.S. military drone circled high overhead, hunting for military targets. But it saw only a large crowd of women and children huddled against a river bank. Without warning, an American F-15E attack jet streaked across the drone?s high-definition field of vision and dropped a 500-pound bomb on the crowd, swallowing it in a shuddering blast. As the smoke cleared, a few people stumbled away in search of cover. Then a jet tracking them dropped one 2,000-pound bomb, then another, killing most of the survivors. It was March 18, 2019. At the U.S. military?s busy Combined Air Operations Center at Al Udeid Air Base in Qatar, uniformed personnel watching the live drone footage looked on in stunned disbelief, according to one officer who was there. ?Who dropped that?? a confused analyst typed on a secure chat system being used by those monitoring the drone, two people who reviewed the chat log recalled. Another responded, ?We just dropped on 50 women and children.? An initial battle damage assessment quickly found that the number of dead was actually about 70. The Baghuz strike was one of the largest civilian casualty incidents of the war against the Islamic State, but it has never been publicly acknowledged by the U.S. military. The details, reported here for the first time, show that the death toll was almost immediately apparent to military officials. A legal officer flagged the strike as a possible war crime that required an investigation. But at nearly every step, the military made moves that concealed the catastrophic strike. The death toll was downplayed. Reports were delayed, sanitized and classified. United States-led coalition forces bulldozed the blast site. And top leaders were not notified. ? ? From r-szoke at illinois.edu Sat Nov 13 19:20:48 2021 From: r-szoke at illinois.edu (Szoke, Ron) Date: Sat, 13 Nov 2021 19:20:48 +0000 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Unacknowledged Airstrike Killed Dozens Message-ID: NYT online 111321 How the U.S. Hid an Airstrike That Killed Dozens of Civilians in Syria The military never conducted an independent investigation into a 2019 bombing on the last bastion of the Islamic State, despite concerns about a secretive commando force. By Dave Philipps and Eric Schmitt Nov. 13, 2021, Updated 1:33 p.m. ET In the last days of the battle against the Islamic State in Syria, when members of the once-fierce caliphate were cornered in a dirt field next to a town called Baghuz, a U.S. military drone circled high overhead, hunting for military targets. But it saw only a large crowd of women and children huddled against a river bank. Without warning, an American F-15E attack jet streaked across the drone?s high-definition field of vision and dropped a 500-pound bomb on the crowd, swallowing it in a shuddering blast. As the smoke cleared, a few people stumbled away in search of cover. Then a jet tracking them dropped one 2,000-pound bomb, then another, killing most of the survivors. It was March 18, 2019. At the U.S. military?s busy Combined Air Operations Center at Al Udeid Air Base in Qatar, uniformed personnel watching the live drone footage looked on in stunned disbelief, according to one officer who was there. ?Who dropped that?? a confused analyst typed on a secure chat system being used by those monitoring the drone, two people who reviewed the chat log recalled. Another responded, ?We just dropped on 50 women and children.? An initial battle damage assessment quickly found that the number of dead was actually about 70. The Baghuz strike was one of the largest civilian casualty incidents of the war against the Islamic State, but it has never been publicly acknowledged by the U.S. military. The details, reported here for the first time, show that the death toll was almost immediately apparent to military officials. A legal officer flagged the strike as a possible war crime that required an investigation. But at nearly every step, the military made moves that concealed the catastrophic strike. The death toll was downplayed. Reports were delayed, sanitized and classified. United States-led coalition forces bulldozed the blast site. And top leaders were not notified. ? ? From karenaram at hotmail.com Mon Nov 15 22:46:37 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2021 16:46:37 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Call in and/or show up at the Champaign County Board Meeting Thurs. 11/18/21 Message-ID: In addition to calling your County Board members, you can also attend the County Board meeting this Thursday, 6:30 PM at the Brookens Center (1776 E Washington St, Urbana) and voice your opposition during the meeting?s public comments section. Your district?s County Board members? contact info is below. To find your district, please see these links: http://www.co.champaign.il.us/CountyBoard/cbmembers.php https://www.champaigncountyclerk.com/.../board-members ... -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbn at forestfield.org Wed Nov 17 01:58:18 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 19:58:18 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Glenn Greenwald has a principled examination of the recent searches of Project Veritas journalists Message-ID: Recently there was a "court-ordered search at the New York apartment of the Project Veritas founder [James O'Keefe] two days after searching the homes of his associates" according to the New York times (2021-11-06). NYT's language in a related article from 2021-11-11 is incredibly suspect, as should be expected of that outlet by now. Glenn Greenwald has a video on these articles and related articles showing how hypocritical the NYT and others are: Video https://rumble.com/vp9ozz-project-veritas-assange-and-the-authoritarian-decrees-of-who-is-and-is-not-.html https://youtube.com/watch?v=17rlhtzkcSQ Transcript (for subscribers only, as you'll see when you visit the page) https://systemupdate.substack.com/p/video-transcript-project-veritas The NYT's no-true-Scotsman argument is dangerous and harmful to our freedom under the 1st Amendment but they're not alone in trying to advance the idea that the 1st Amendment is only for an elite subset of Americans. That argument is part of the rationale used against journalist Julian Assange and seems to be the wave of the future where some journalists are worthy of 1st Amendment protection and other who do the work of a journalist aren't really journalists at all (someone who "likes to describe himself" as a journalist, as the 2021-11-11 NYT claimed about O'Keefe). For the NYT, Washington Post, CNN, and other outlets which repeat Russiagate lies, published Iraqi WMD claims during the run-up to the 2003 invasion of Iraq, and ran Douma gas attack lies to now reject undercover journalism because undercover work involves lying is hilarious hypocrisy. Greenwald also points out the telling terms used to separate who is and isn't a journalist (versus being an "activist", "agitator", or a "blogger"). Another example along that line came to my mind: On October 30, 2019 the establishment-serving Democracy Now did a comparable attempted reframing or minimization of journalist Max Blumenthal, initially called him a "blogger". After complaints DN later changed the title of their article to call him a journalist. DN tried to edit their archives to reflect this change but the URL they published the article under continues to give the game away. I covered this in https://lists.chambana.net/pipermail/peace-discuss/2019-December/051702.html and you can find that DN article in https://www.democracynow.org/2019/10/30/headlines/blogger_max_blumenthal_says_he_was_arrested_on_false_charges which still bears the old title where Max Blumenthal is merely a "blogger" in this division DN apparently agrees with. From rwhelbig at gmail.com Wed Nov 17 05:29:12 2021 From: rwhelbig at gmail.com (Roger Helbig) Date: Tue, 16 Nov 2021 21:29:12 -0800 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Glenn Greenwald has a principled examination of the recent searches of Project Veritas journalists In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Greenwald outright lied on the CitizenFour mocumentary so what do you expect - he never was a real journalist - he always has had a cause and agenda and finding the truth was secondary or tertiary to that. Roger Helbig On Tue, Nov 16, 2021 at 5:58 PM J.B. Nicholson via Peace-discuss < peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote: > Recently there was a "court-ordered search at the New York apartment of > the Project > Veritas founder [James O'Keefe] two days after searching the homes of his > associates" > according to the New York times (2021-11-06). NYT's language in a related > article > from 2021-11-11 is incredibly suspect, as should be expected of that > outlet by now. > > Glenn Greenwald has a video on these articles and related articles showing > how > hypocritical the NYT and others are: > > Video > > https://rumble.com/vp9ozz-project-veritas-assange-and-the-authoritarian-decrees-of-who-is-and-is-not-.html > https://youtube.com/watch?v=17rlhtzkcSQ > > Transcript (for subscribers only, as you'll see when you visit the page) > https://systemupdate.substack.com/p/video-transcript-project-veritas > > The NYT's no-true-Scotsman argument is dangerous and harmful to our > freedom under the > 1st Amendment but they're not alone in trying to advance the idea that the > 1st > Amendment is only for an elite subset of Americans. That argument is part > of the > rationale used against journalist Julian Assange and seems to be the wave > of the > future where some journalists are worthy of 1st Amendment protection and > other who do > the work of a journalist aren't really journalists at all (someone who > "likes to > describe himself" as a journalist, as the 2021-11-11 NYT claimed about > O'Keefe). > > For the NYT, Washington Post, CNN, and other outlets which repeat > Russiagate lies, > published Iraqi WMD claims during the run-up to the 2003 invasion of Iraq, > and ran > Douma gas attack lies to now reject undercover journalism because > undercover work > involves lying is hilarious hypocrisy. > > Greenwald also points out the telling terms used to separate who is and > isn't a > journalist (versus being an "activist", "agitator", or a "blogger"). > Another example > along that line came to my mind: On October 30, 2019 the > establishment-serving > Democracy Now did a comparable attempted reframing or minimization of > journalist Max > Blumenthal, initially called him a "blogger". After complaints DN later > changed the > title of their article to call him a journalist. DN tried to edit their > archives to > reflect this change but the URL they published the article under continues > to give > the game away. I covered this in > > https://lists.chambana.net/pipermail/peace-discuss/2019-December/051702.html > and you > can find that DN article in > > https://www.democracynow.org/2019/10/30/headlines/blogger_max_blumenthal_says_he_was_arrested_on_false_charges > which still bears the old title where Max Blumenthal is merely a "blogger" > in this > division DN apparently agrees with. > _______________________________________________ > Peace-discuss mailing list > Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net > https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbn at forestfield.org Wed Nov 17 23:51:02 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2021 17:51:02 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Glenn Greenwald has a principled examination of the recent searches of Project Veritas journalists In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <8440bcdb-a7ff-26f5-6ab1-97aa2047af7c@forestfield.org> Roger Helbig via Peace-discuss wrote: > Greenwald outright lied on the CitizenFour mocumentary so what do you > expect - he never was a real journalist - he always has had a cause and > agenda and finding the truth was secondary or tertiary to that. Please provide a quote of the alleged lie and a timestamp of when one can find it in the movie CitizenFour. From karenaram at hotmail.com Sun Nov 21 23:19:45 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Sun, 21 Nov 2021 17:19:45 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Protests taking place across the country, in opposition to the Rittenhouse verdict. Message-ID: Here?s one taking place now in Kenosha?. https://www.facebook.com/watch/live/?ref=notif&v=296211609178325¬if_id=1637475493870602¬if_t=live_video_explicit From brussel at illinois.edu Tue Nov 23 18:34:09 2021 From: brussel at illinois.edu (Brussel, Morton K) Date: Tue, 23 Nov 2021 18:34:09 +0000 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Madness Message-ID: <5C1921B1-E03C-4DBE-821B-2D206A267139@illinois.edu> Hostilities over Ukraine and Taiwan, outlined and analyzed in recent articles: https://original.antiwar.com/mbenjamin/2021/11/22/the-high-stakes-of-the-us-russia-confrontation-over-ukraine/ https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://carnegiemoscow.org/commentary/85827__;!!DZ3fjg!scLQDfq3VYbZv8msnc4dV3X548HB1yop_QQ70m49QbFPjPtsV7XZ-eXObxVzMtAqRA$ What many expect will happen if the US continues to provoke Russia an China in this manufactured cold war. Frightening. Stupid. Self destructive. Madness. ?mkb -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From r-szoke at illinois.edu Wed Nov 24 03:11:13 2021 From: r-szoke at illinois.edu (Szoke, Ron) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2021 03:11:13 +0000 Subject: [Peace-discuss] The Unfriendliest States In America Message-ID: MoneyWise Ranked: The Unfriendliest States In America Your state might have a reputation for housing the biggest jerks in the U.S. By Serah Louis Aug. 13, 2021 18. Illinois Rudeness score: 46.13 Rudest cities: Chicago Nearly 4 percent of Illinois residents are considered rude, says Best Life ? and it could be Chicagoans giving the rest of the state a bad rep. ?Chicago drivers are the worst I've seen. There?s the ole ?I'm gonna freaking drive in the middle of the street until the very last second then swerve back to my side after you slam on the brakes? move. It gives me a heart attack every time,? says Killgore-Trout on Reddit. There?s even a Chicago diner that pays its staff to be rude to customers ? at Ed Debevic?s, servers respond to your orders with insults, but visitors typically go there for the novelty. ? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: raised L mid finger.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4871 bytes Desc: raised L mid finger.jpg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: want to exist?.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 14212 bytes Desc: want to exist?.jpeg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Everybody sucks.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 190742 bytes Desc: Everybody sucks.jpg URL: From r-szoke at illinois.edu Wed Nov 24 03:11:13 2021 From: r-szoke at illinois.edu (Szoke, Ron) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2021 03:11:13 +0000 Subject: [Peace-discuss] The Unfriendliest States In America Message-ID: MoneyWise Ranked: The Unfriendliest States In America Your state might have a reputation for housing the biggest jerks in the U.S. By Serah Louis Aug. 13, 2021 18. Illinois Rudeness score: 46.13 Rudest cities: Chicago Nearly 4 percent of Illinois residents are considered rude, says Best Life ? and it could be Chicagoans giving the rest of the state a bad rep. ?Chicago drivers are the worst I've seen. There?s the ole ?I'm gonna freaking drive in the middle of the street until the very last second then swerve back to my side after you slam on the brakes? move. It gives me a heart attack every time,? says Killgore-Trout on Reddit. There?s even a Chicago diner that pays its staff to be rude to customers ? at Ed Debevic?s, servers respond to your orders with insults, but visitors typically go there for the novelty. ? -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: raised L mid finger.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4871 bytes Desc: raised L mid finger.jpg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: want to exist?.jpeg Type: image/jpeg Size: 14212 bytes Desc: want to exist?.jpeg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Everybody sucks.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 190742 bytes Desc: Everybody sucks.jpg URL: From jbn at forestfield.org Thu Nov 25 02:55:25 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2021 20:55:25 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Recommended videos for AWARE on the Air, News from Neptune, and Labor's World View TV Message-ID: Here are the videos I recommended to run during AWARE on the Air, News from Neptune, and Labor's World View TV. As a reminder: If anyone else has anything to run, please feel free to get your pointers to UPTV (UPTV at urbanaillinois.us), an address supplied to us by Jason Liggett who was our former, very helpful, UPTV contact. I routinely asked him to prioritize AWARE members pointers over mine for AWARE on the Air, Carl Estabrook & David Green's pointers over mine for News from Neptune, and David Johnson's pointers over mine for Labor's World View TV. I've asked UPTV to do the same with these suggestions. I might not be able to get to add more videos soon. Enjoy -J Labor's World View TV ================================================== More Perfect Union https://youtube.com/watch?v=HShhlFufzfk -- (4m 15s) Kaiser Workers EXPOSE Corporation's Greed https://youtube.com/watch?v=-lobOzhyMZk -- (3m 35s) Restaurant Workers Fight To End The Subminimum Wage https://youtube.com/watch?v=unK_1GImXW0 -- (4m 01s) Student Workers Take On Columbia University's Greed https://youtube.com/watch?v=9hPtnTVJq0w -- (4m 57s) PetSmart Workers EXPOSE Horrendous Conditions https://youtube.com/watch?v=mEK64vbVdmk -- (4m 21s) Walmart Workers Demand A $15 Minimum Wage laborvideo https://youtube.com/watch?v=11cj6A9g0fE -- (34m 41s) IUOE Kaiser Striker "We're On Verge Of What Could Be Biggest Healthcare Strike In American History" RT https://youtube.com/watch?v=A4CwX321J60 -- (13m 13s) Brick Slaves https://youtube.com/watch?v=xSweO9kKRt4 -- (6m 6s) The Return Of Child Labor In America News from Neptune & AWARE on the Air ================================================== Grayzone https://youtube.com/watch?v=DTRODfuRp6o -- (35m 51s) Nicaragua explains why it's leaving OAS, responds to US attacks on its elections https://youtube.com/watch?v=J_NKXtCH24s -- (42m 19s) Indictment of Steele dossier source humiliates its media, intel cheerleaders Glenn Greenwald https://youtube.com/watch?v=17rlhtzkcSQ -- (55m 40s) Project Veritas, Assange, and the Authoritarian Decrees of Who Is a "Real Journalist" MintPressNews https://youtube.com/watch?v=BAWHj9cfjkU -- (40m 54s) The British Role In The Hybrid War Against Venezuela RT https://youtube.com/watch?v=_5U3eSPvfMo -- (26m 50s) Business secrets of drug dealing https://youtube.com/watch?v=6gvJsZ-_DfM -- (26m 37s) Struggle against Industrial Agriculture https://youtube.com/watch?v=6neef2P_4bo -- (29m 16s) The second war on terror https://youtube.com/watch?v=53Ckm-e1LxQ -- (25m 20s) The nature of neoliberalism and its consequences. From carl at newsfromneptune.com Thu Nov 25 04:56:40 2021 From: carl at newsfromneptune.com (C. G. Estabrook) Date: Wed, 24 Nov 2021 22:56:40 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] =?utf-8?q?Fwd=3A_Impending_Planetary_Disaster_Sh?= =?utf-8?q?ould_Unite_Us=2C_Yet_We_Remain_More_Divided_Than=C2=A0Ever?= References: <20211125004550.2.bcee747476ea7aab.leuphb2b@mg2.substack.com> Message-ID: Sent from my iPhone Begin forwarded message: > From: Caitlin Johnstone from Caitlin?s Newsletter > Date: November 24, 2021 at 6:47:57 PM CST > To: cgestabrook at gmail.com > Subject: Impending Planetary Disaster Should Unite Us, Yet We Remain More Divided Than Ever > Reply-To: Caitlin Johnstone from Caitlin?s Newsletter > > ? > Impending Planetary Disaster Should Unite Us, Yet We Remain More Divided Than Ever > > Caitlin Johnstone > Nov 25 > > > > > Listen to a reading of this article: > > > > Impending Planetary Disaster Should Unite Us, Yet We Remain More Divided Than Ever by Going Rogue With Caitlin Johnstone > Going Rogue With Caitlin Johnstone > Charles Bukowski has a quote: ?We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.? Terrorized and flattened by trivialities, eaten up by nothing. I think about this quote a lot not just as pertains to the inevitability of our individual deaths, but to the looming death of the entire world. Reading by Tim Foley. > ? > > Charles Bukowski has a quote: ?We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.? > > Terrorized and flattened by trivialities, eaten up by nothing. I think about this quote a lot not just as pertains to the inevitability of our individual deaths, but to the looming death of the entire world. > > The website Antiwar.com has been doing a good job keeping track of all the many US cold war escalations against Russia and China, which seem to be coming out on a near-daily basis now. Just right off their front page today there's a story about how the US considering is putting more military aid in Ukraine on the allegation that Russia is plotting an invasion, another about Moscow claiming that US bombers just practiced a simulated nuclear strike on Russia and have have greatly increased their activity along its border, another about Beijing's anger over increased US war ship activity in the Taiwan Strait, another about Australian Defense Minister Peter Dutton's assurance that Australia would join the US in a war against China to defend Taiwan, and yet another about Beijing and China signing an agreement to deepen their military cooperation to counter hostilities from Washington. > > > Caitlin Johnstone ? > @caitoz > Erm I Know You're Busy But Nuclear War Is Getting Increasingly Likely > > Few people seem to believe the most pressing threat to humanity might be all those armageddon weapons we've stockpiled and how increasingly irresponsibly our leaders are treating them. > > Erm I Know You?re Busy But Nuclear War Is Getting Increasingly Likely > Listen to a reading of this article: ? While mainstream western media have been spending their time concern trolling about a ?missing? Chinese tennis player who is not actually missing, hardly any coverage has gone toward NATO?s announcement that if the new German government does not continue to all? > caitlinjohnstone.substack.com > November 23rd 2021 > > 260 Retweets582 Likes > This, along with the myriad symptoms our biosphere is showing us of impending collapse, and we still somehow manage to remain terrorized and flattened by trivialities. Eaten up by nothing. > > Divisions and hostilities are hotter than ever, even in those political sectors where people are fully aware of just how bad our ecological situation is and the horrifying realities of cold war nuclear brinkmanship. We should rationally all be coming together at this point in history. Our collective plight alone should make us love each other. But instead we're at each other's throats more than ever before. > > And it's not just this ideological faction versus that ideological faction. Even among socialists and anti-imperialists there are subfactions, sub-subfactions and sub-sub-subfactions, all of whom despise each other, and all of those divisions are far worse and far more inflamed in online forums. People will spend months on end engaging in online sniping at others over some perceived difference that would be undetectable by someone with a more mainstream perspective, like that episode of Star Trek where a group of aliens who are black on the right side and white on the left are warring with a group whose colors are the opposite and only they notice the difference. Our precious newfound ability as a species to network and share ideas with each other like never before gets bogged down in petty squabbling instead of organization toward a movement into health. > > > Part of it is information; because the only large-scale distributors of information in our society are controlled and manipulated by the powerful, most people see very little evidence of just how much trouble the systems sustained by the powerful have gotten us into. Part of it is perspective; because most human behavior is driven by ego, a lot more of our interest and attention goes toward the petty differences between ourselves and other humans than large-scale problems which threaten all of us. > > So you'll see even relatively lucid minds spending their time talking about obscure sectarian disagreements, or about the dangers of political "wokeness", or about the entirely empty theatrics of mainstream electoral politics, even as the destruction of our entire world dangles above our heads suspended by a rapidly eroding thread. > > That alone should make us love each other. That alone should make us focus on what matters. That alone should bring us together to move as one against the globe-dominating forces that are going to end us all if they are not stopped. > > _______________________________ > > My work is entirely reader-supported, so if you enjoyed this piece please consider sharing it around, following me on Facebook, Twitter, Soundcloud or YouTube, or throwing some money into my tip jar on Ko-fi, Patreon or Paypal. If you want to read more you can buy my books. The best way to make sure you see the stuff I publish is to subscribe to the mailing list for at my website or on Substack, which will get you an email notification for everything I publish. Everyone, racist platforms excluded, has my permission to republish, use or translate any part of this work (or anything else I?ve written) in any way they like free of charge. For more info on who I am, where I stand, and what I?m trying to do with this platform, click here. > > > Bitcoin donations:1Ac7PCQXoQoLA9Sh8fhAgiU3PHA2EX5Zm2 > > > > If you liked this post from Caitlin?s Newsletter, why not share it? > Share > ? 2021 Caitlin Johnstone Unsubscribe > 548 Market Street PMB 72296, San Francisco, CA 94104 > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From moboct1 at aim.com Thu Nov 25 16:28:53 2021 From: moboct1 at aim.com (Mildred O'brien) Date: Thu, 25 Nov 2021 16:28:53 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Peace-discuss] Charles Burowski In-Reply-To: References: <20211125004550.2.bcee747476ea7aab.leuphb2b@mg2.substack.com> Message-ID: <899974880.891461.1637857733438@mail.yahoo.com> Yeah, Charles,?? We're all going to die--but sooner for you if you keep on smokin' and pollutin' the world with the sot weed, both growin' & smokin' mo'b -----Original Message----- From: C. G. Estabrook via Peace-discuss To: Peace Discuss ; Peace Sent: Wed, Nov 24, 2021 10:57 pm Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: Impending Planetary Disaster Should Unite Us, Yet We Remain More Divided Than?Ever Sent from my iPhone Begin forwarded message: From: Caitlin Johnstone from Caitlin?s Newsletter Date: November 24, 2021 at 6:47:57 PM CST To: cgestabrook at gmail.com Subject: Impending Planetary Disaster Should Unite Us, Yet We Remain More Divided Than?Ever Reply-To: Caitlin Johnstone from Caitlin?s Newsletter ? Impending Planetary Disaster Should Unite Us, Yet We Remain More Divided Than?Ever at media all and ( _filtered_a )Listen to a reading of this article: ? Charles Bukowski has a quote: ?We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? | | | | | | Impending Planetary Disaster Should Unite Us, Yet We Remain More Divided Than?Ever | | Caitlin Johnstone | Nov 25 | | | | | | | | | Listen to a reading of this article: | | Impending Planetary Disaster Should Unite Us, Yet We Remain More Divided Than Ever by Going Rogue With Caitlin Johnstone Going Rogue With Caitlin Johnstone Charles Bukowski has a quote: ?We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.?Terrorized and flattened by trivialities, eaten up by nothing. I think about this quote a lot not just as pertains to the inevitability of our individual deaths, but to the looming death of the entire world.Reading by Tim Foley. | ? Charles Bukowski has a quote: ?We're all going to die, all of us, what a circus! That alone should make us love each other but it doesn't. We are terrorized and flattened by trivialities, we are eaten up by nothing.? Terrorized and flattened by trivialities, eaten up by nothing. I think about this quote a lot not just as pertains to the inevitability of our individual deaths, but to the looming death of the entire world. The website Antiwar.com has been doing a good job keeping track of all the many US cold war escalations against Russia and China, which seem to be coming out on a near-daily basis now. Just right off their front page today?there's a story about how the US considering is putting more military aid in Ukraine on the allegation that Russia is plotting an invasion, another about Moscow claiming that US bombers just practiced a simulated nuclear strike on Russia and have have greatly increased their activity along its border, another about Beijing's anger over increased US war ship activity in the Taiwan Strait, another about?Australian Defense Minister Peter Dutton's assurance that Australia would join the US in a war against China to defend Taiwan, and yet another about Beijing and China signing an agreement to deepen their military cooperation to counter hostilities from Washington.? Caitlin Johnstone ? @caitozErm I Know You're Busy But Nuclear War Is Getting Increasingly LikelyFew people seem to believe the most pressing threat to humanity might be all those armageddon weapons we've stockpiled and how increasingly irresponsibly our leaders are treating them.Erm I Know You?re Busy But Nuclear War Is Getting Increasingly LikelyListen to a reading of this article: ? While mainstream western media have been spending their time concern trolling about a ?missing? Chinese tennis player who is not actually missing, hardly any coverage has gone toward NATO?s announcement that if the new German government does not continue to all?caitlinjohnstone.substack.com November 23rd 2021 260 Retweets582 Likes This, along with the myriad symptoms?our biosphere is showing us of impending collapse, and we still somehow manage to remain terrorized and flattened by trivialities. Eaten up by nothing.? Divisions and hostilities are hotter than ever, even in those political sectors where people are fully aware of just how bad our ecological situation is and the horrifying realities of cold war nuclear brinkmanship. We should rationally all be coming together at this point in history. Our collective plight alone should make us love each other. But instead we're at each other's throats more than ever before. And it's not just this ideological faction versus that ideological faction. Even among socialists and anti-imperialists there are subfactions, sub-subfactions and sub-sub-subfactions, all of whom despise each other, and all of those divisions are far worse and far more inflamed in online forums. People will spend months on end engaging in online sniping at others over some perceived difference that would be undetectable by someone with a more mainstream perspective, like that episode of Star Trek where a group of aliens who are black on the right side and white on the left are warring with a group whose colors are the opposite and only they notice the difference. Our precious newfound ability as a species to network and share ideas with each other like never before gets bogged down in petty squabbling instead of organization toward a movement into health. Part of it is information; because the only large-scale distributors of information in our society are controlled and manipulated by the powerful, most people see very little evidence of just how much trouble the systems sustained by the powerful have gotten us into. Part of it is perspective; because most human behavior is driven by ego, a lot more of our interest and attention goes toward the petty differences between ourselves and other humans than large-scale problems which threaten all of us. So you'll see even relatively lucid minds spending their time talking about obscure sectarian disagreements, or about the dangers of political "wokeness", or about the entirely empty theatrics of mainstream electoral politics, even as the destruction of our entire world dangles above our heads suspended by a rapidly eroding thread. That alone should make us love each other. That alone should make us focus on what matters. That alone should bring us together to move as one against the globe-dominating forces that are going to end us all if they are not stopped. _______________________________ My work is?entirely reader-supported, so if you enjoyed this piece please consider sharing it around, following me on?Facebook,?Twitter,?Soundcloud?or?YouTube, or?throwing some money into my tip jar on?Ko-fi,?Patreon?or?Paypal. If you want to read more you can?buy my books. The best way to make sure you see the stuff I publish is to subscribe to the mailing list for at?my website?or?on Substack, which will get you an email notification for everything I publish.?Everyone, racist platforms excluded,?has my permission?to republish, use or translate any part of this work (or anything else I?ve written) in any way they like free of charge.?For more info on who I am, where I stand, and what I?m trying to do with this platform,?click here.? | | | | Bitcoin donations:1Ac7PCQXoQoLA9Sh8fhAgiU3PHA2EX5Zm2 | | | | If you liked this post from Caitlin?s Newsletter, why not share it? Share ? 2021 Caitlin Johnstone Unsubscribe 548 Market Street PMB 72296, San Francisco, CA 94104 | | _______________________________________________ Peace-discuss mailing list Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jbn at forestfield.org Sat Nov 27 00:30:08 2021 From: jbn at forestfield.org (J.B. Nicholson) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2021 18:30:08 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Looks like more people are seeing what Tulsi Gabbard stands for Message-ID: <6866f1d9-6d0c-ce2a-2b7f-ad48e6517fac@forestfield.org> https://www.mintpressnews.com/anti-war-progressive-militarist-tulsi-gabbard-political-trajectory/279101/ includes the following: > Perhaps the most surprising shift in her metamorphosis into boilerplate > conservative is her seemingly shifting stance on war. Appearing on Fox News just > after the Biden administration was forced to admit that a drone strike[1] it ordered > on ?terrorists? in Kabul actually targeted ten civilians, she vehemently defended > the policy. Clearly not expecting such an answer (the segment was titled ?Afghan > Disaster: Who Is Getting Fired??), host Tucker Carlson looked surprised as Gabbard > launched into a spirited defense of both drones and the endless war on terror. > > ?I think it?s important for the American people to understand that Islamist > jihadists are continuing to wage war against us,? she said[2]. Then, barely > acknowledging that the slain Afghan children were not terrorists, she added: > > We have to work to defeat them militarily and ideologically. And militarily, we > have two choices in how we do that. Number One: We can continue to invade and > occupy in nation-building [sic] countries around the world ? just as we did in > Afghanistan at great cost. Number Two: We can take a targeted approach using > airstrikes, using our special forces to go in and go after these terror cells.? [1] https://www.reuters.com/world/us/biden-supports-full-investigation-into-afghanistan-drone-strike-2021-09-20/ [2] https://www.foxnews.com/media/tulsi-gabbard-islamist-jihadists-wage-war Regarding this segment, I'm not sure why anyone would characterize Gabbard's support for drone war to be a "surprising shift" when in January 2018 she told The Intercept: > Jeremy Scahill: I?m wondering what your position, I know that in the past you have > said that you favor a small footprint approach with strike forces and limited use > of weaponized drones. Is that still your position that you think that?s the ? to > the extent that you believe the U.S. military should be used around the world for > counterterrorism, is that still your position? > > Rep. Tulsi Gabbard: Well, when we?re dealing with the unconventional threat of > terrorist groups like ISIS, al Qaeda and some of these other groups that are > affiliated with them, we should not be using basically what has been and continues > to be the current policy of these mass mobilization of troops, these long > occupations and trillions of dollars going in, really abusing the Authorization to > Use Military Force and taking action that expands far beyond the legal limitations > of those current AUMFs. > > So, with these terrorist cells, for example, yes, I do still believe that the > right approach to take is these quick strike forces, surgical strikes, in and out, > very quickly, no long-term deployment, no long-term occupation to be able to get > rid of the threat that exists and then get out and the very limited use of drones > in those situations where our military is not able to get in without creating an > unacceptable level of risk, and where you can make sure that you?re not causing, > you know, a large amount of civilian casualties. Audio of the above is available at https://digitalcitizen.info/2019/02/13/is-tulsi-gabbard-really-anti-war-no-shes-pro-drone-and-for-surgical-strikes/ in case you want to hear that excerpt from Scahill & Gabbard's own voices. What Tulsi Gabbard has been saying for some time is neither surprising nor much of a shift in her war policy views -- she's down with killing innocents via drones and has she been down with this for some time now. As I wrote about a year after that, "?Quick strike forces?, ?surgical strikes?, ?in and out, very quickly?, ?no long-term deployment, no long-term occupation? are all pro-war propaganda. This vague language (how long is ?long-term??) is indistinguishable from what any neo-con would say to make war seem more acceptable.". The MintPressNews.com article above makes some point of showing whom Gabbard has connections to. Perhaps this is why you're unlikely to hear about this from Jimmy Dore & co. -- there's footage of Dore being quite chummy (if not enamored) with Tulsi Gabbard during the time she said the above to the Intercept (which Dore & co. also ignored). I tried to warn Dore away from this path by sending him an email to info at jimmydorecomedy.com which his staff received and replied to as a formality. But I didn't see anything come of it in his behavior. Dore would go on to 'share a stage' (as the MintPressNews.com article put it) with Gabbard when Dore & his wife Stef Zamorano visited Hawaii. Tulsi Gabbard has demonstrated her loyalty to the neo-con Democratic Party in word and deed: Word: In her CBS (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzVSYBNgOeI) and Primo Nutmeg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkdl-QbtS1U) interviews you can hear her say that she's a loyal Democrat and would not run as an independent or with a third-party. In other words, she long ago committed to not run in any way that challenges the Democratic Party. I believe that she gave that CBS interview before she was falsely accused of running as an independent by Hillary Clinton. Deed: Tulsi Gabbard participated in a coordinated act (coordinated by former Pres. Obama, as far as I know) when he got all of the 2020 Democratic Party nominees to quit their campaigns and endorse Biden (Gabbard even confirmed to Jimmy Dore in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jka28F9ldBg that "supporting" and "endorsing" Biden's campaign were the same thing). Perhaps that's "collusion", a word the Democrats like to use for Russiagate accusations but never use to describe how neolib/neocon Joe Biden went from lackluster Democratic Party primary performance to becoming the sole nominee. Anyone who still thinks that Gabbard was an "anti-war" or "peace" representative of any kind after endorsing Biden for POTUS has some heavy explaining to do. Perhaps it's only a matter of time until Tulsi Gabbard replaces Bernie Sanders as the new sheepdog for the Democratic Party (see the late Bruce Dixon's prescient May 7, 2015 article https://blackagendareport.com/bernie-sanders-sheepdog-4-hillary for more on this concept of sheepdogging). From karenaram at hotmail.com Sat Nov 27 02:00:14 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2021 20:00:14 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] Looks like more people are seeing what Tulsi Gabbard stands for In-Reply-To: <6866f1d9-6d0c-ce2a-2b7f-ad48e6517fac@forestfield.org> References: <6866f1d9-6d0c-ce2a-2b7f-ad48e6517fac@forestfield.org> Message-ID: Great analysis J.B. In accordance with your final statement, Tulsi has always been a sheepdog for the Dems., for those who are anti-war and still think we can achieve peace with the Democrat Party. Yes, she said a lot of good things when running for office, a very smart lady, beautiful, eloquent, and articulate, the perfect candidate, a perfect sheepherder. I referred to her as just this some years ago, to me it was obvious given her support for drone warfare, Israel, and Modi. AOC is another one who said a lot of good things as a candidate and even now, but?.. As to Jimmy Dore, he has a good perspective on domestic politics, but he?s lacking in a comprehensive understanding of foreign policy, he is after all a comedian so we shouldn?t be too disappointed by his being impressed with Tulsi. It must be recognized peace will never be achieved with either the Democrat or Republican Party?s. > On Nov 26, 2021, at 6:30 PM, J.B. Nicholson via Peace wrote: > > https://www.mintpressnews.com/anti-war-progressive-militarist-tulsi-gabbard-political-trajectory/279101/ includes the following: > >> Perhaps the most surprising shift in her metamorphosis into boilerplate >> conservative is her seemingly shifting stance on war. Appearing on Fox News just >> after the Biden administration was forced to admit that a drone strike[1] it ordered >> on ?terrorists? in Kabul actually targeted ten civilians, she vehemently defended >> the policy. Clearly not expecting such an answer (the segment was titled ?Afghan >> Disaster: Who Is Getting Fired??), host Tucker Carlson looked surprised as Gabbard >> launched into a spirited defense of both drones and the endless war on terror. >> ?I think it?s important for the American people to understand that Islamist >> jihadists are continuing to wage war against us,? she said[2]. Then, barely >> acknowledging that the slain Afghan children were not terrorists, she added: >> We have to work to defeat them militarily and ideologically. And militarily, we >> have two choices in how we do that. Number One: We can continue to invade and >> occupy in nation-building [sic] countries around the world ? just as we did in >> Afghanistan at great cost. Number Two: We can take a targeted approach using >> airstrikes, using our special forces to go in and go after these terror cells.? > > [1] https://www.reuters.com/world/us/biden-supports-full-investigation-into-afghanistan-drone-strike-2021-09-20/ > [2] https://www.foxnews.com/media/tulsi-gabbard-islamist-jihadists-wage-war > > > Regarding this segment, I'm not sure why anyone would characterize Gabbard's support for drone war to be a "surprising shift" when in January 2018 she told The Intercept: > >> Jeremy Scahill: I?m wondering what your position, I know that in the past you have >> said that you favor a small footprint approach with strike forces and limited use >> of weaponized drones. Is that still your position that you think that?s the ? to >> the extent that you believe the U.S. military should be used around the world for >> counterterrorism, is that still your position? >> Rep. Tulsi Gabbard: Well, when we?re dealing with the unconventional threat of >> terrorist groups like ISIS, al Qaeda and some of these other groups that are >> affiliated with them, we should not be using basically what has been and continues >> to be the current policy of these mass mobilization of troops, these long >> occupations and trillions of dollars going in, really abusing the Authorization to >> Use Military Force and taking action that expands far beyond the legal limitations >> of those current AUMFs. >> So, with these terrorist cells, for example, yes, I do still believe that the >> right approach to take is these quick strike forces, surgical strikes, in and out, >> very quickly, no long-term deployment, no long-term occupation to be able to get >> rid of the threat that exists and then get out and the very limited use of drones >> in those situations where our military is not able to get in without creating an >> unacceptable level of risk, and where you can make sure that you?re not causing, >> you know, a large amount of civilian casualties. > Audio of the above is available at https://digitalcitizen.info/2019/02/13/is-tulsi-gabbard-really-anti-war-no-shes-pro-drone-and-for-surgical-strikes/ in case you want to hear that excerpt from Scahill & Gabbard's own voices. > > What Tulsi Gabbard has been saying for some time is neither surprising nor much of a shift in her war policy views -- she's down with killing innocents via drones and has she been down with this for some time now. > > As I wrote about a year after that, "?Quick strike forces?, ?surgical strikes?, ?in and out, very quickly?, ?no long-term deployment, no long-term occupation? are all pro-war propaganda. This vague language (how long is ?long-term??) is indistinguishable from what any neo-con would say to make war seem more acceptable.". > > > > > The MintPressNews.com article above makes some point of showing whom Gabbard has connections to. Perhaps this is why you're unlikely to hear about this from Jimmy Dore & co. -- there's footage of Dore being quite chummy (if not enamored) with Tulsi Gabbard during the time she said the above to the Intercept (which Dore & co. also ignored). I tried to warn Dore away from this path by sending him an email to info at jimmydorecomedy.com which his staff received and replied to as a formality. But I didn't see anything come of it in his behavior. Dore would go on to 'share a stage' (as the MintPressNews.com article put it) with Gabbard when Dore & his wife Stef Zamorano visited Hawaii. > > Tulsi Gabbard has demonstrated her loyalty to the neo-con Democratic Party in word and deed: > > Word: In her CBS (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzVSYBNgOeI) and Primo Nutmeg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkdl-QbtS1U) interviews you can hear her say that she's a loyal Democrat and would not run as an independent or with a third-party. In other words, she long ago committed to not run in any way that challenges the Democratic Party. I believe that she gave that CBS interview before she was falsely accused of running as an independent by Hillary Clinton. > > Deed: Tulsi Gabbard participated in a coordinated act (coordinated by former Pres. Obama, as far as I know) when he got all of the 2020 Democratic Party nominees to quit their campaigns and endorse Biden (Gabbard even confirmed to Jimmy Dore in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jka28F9ldBg that "supporting" and "endorsing" Biden's campaign were the same thing). Perhaps that's "collusion", a word the Democrats like to use for Russiagate accusations but never use to describe how neolib/neocon Joe Biden went from lackluster Democratic Party primary performance to becoming the sole nominee. Anyone who still thinks that Gabbard was an "anti-war" or "peace" representative of any kind after endorsing Biden for POTUS has some heavy explaining to do. > > Perhaps it's only a matter of time until Tulsi Gabbard replaces Bernie Sanders as the new sheepdog for the Democratic Party (see the late Bruce Dixon's prescient May 7, 2015 article https://blackagendareport.com/bernie-sanders-sheepdog-4-hillary for more on this concept of sheepdogging). > _______________________________________________ > Peace mailing list > Peace at lists.chambana.net > https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace From moboct1 at aol.com Sat Nov 27 02:26:59 2021 From: moboct1 at aol.com (Mildred O'brien) Date: Sat, 27 Nov 2021 02:26:59 +0000 (UTC) Subject: [Peace-discuss] Looks like more people are seeing what Tulsi Gabbard stands for In-Reply-To: <6866f1d9-6d0c-ce2a-2b7f-ad48e6517fac@forestfield.org> References: <6866f1d9-6d0c-ce2a-2b7f-ad48e6517fac@forestfield.org> Message-ID: <304765684.1360050.1637980019795@mail.yahoo.com> About "sheepdogging" (and this is ancient history to most of you), I have to say on behalf of Eugene J. McCarthy, my choice as Democrat candidate for POTUS in the 1968 Democratic primary (until the assassination of RFK), he refused to sheepdog for the Democratic nominee, Hubert H. Humphrey, his friend and fellow Senator from Minnesota, and did not endorse him for President over Nixon until the day before the election.? He took a lot of grief from liberals for not doing so earlier but knew that Democrats (as well as Nixon) would continue in office the Vietnam War.? Subsequently? he resigned his Senate seat as a Democrat and thereafter remained an Independent when he later ran for the Presidency several times. Midge O'Brien? ? -----Original Message----- From: J.B. Nicholson via Peace-discuss To: Peace Discuss ; Peace Sent: Fri, Nov 26, 2021 6:30 pm Subject: [Peace-discuss] Looks like more people are seeing what Tulsi Gabbard stands for https://www.mintpressnews.com/anti-war-progressive-militarist-tulsi-gabbard-political-trajectory/279101/ includes the following: > Perhaps the most surprising shift in her metamorphosis into boilerplate > conservative is her seemingly shifting stance on war. Appearing on Fox News just > after the Biden administration was forced to admit that a drone strike[1] it ordered > on ?terrorists? in Kabul actually targeted ten civilians, she vehemently defended > the policy. Clearly not expecting such an answer (the segment was titled ?Afghan > Disaster: Who Is Getting Fired??), host Tucker Carlson looked surprised as Gabbard > launched into a spirited defense of both drones and the endless war on terror. > > ?I think it?s important for the American people to understand that Islamist > jihadists are continuing to wage war against us,? she said[2]. Then, barely > acknowledging that the slain Afghan children were not terrorists, she added: > > We have to work to defeat them militarily and ideologically. And militarily, we > have two choices in how we do that. Number One: We can continue to invade and > occupy in nation-building [sic] countries around the world ? just as we did in > Afghanistan at great cost. Number Two: We can take a targeted approach using > airstrikes, using our special forces to go in and go after these terror cells.? [1] https://www.reuters.com/world/us/biden-supports-full-investigation-into-afghanistan-drone-strike-2021-09-20/ [2] https://www.foxnews.com/media/tulsi-gabbard-islamist-jihadists-wage-war Regarding this segment, I'm not sure why anyone would characterize Gabbard's support for drone war to be a "surprising shift" when in January 2018 she told The Intercept: > Jeremy Scahill: I?m wondering what your position, I know that in the past you have > said that you favor a small footprint approach with strike forces and limited use > of weaponized drones. Is that still your position that you think that?s the ? to > the extent that you believe the U.S. military should be used around the world for > counterterrorism, is that still your position? > > Rep. Tulsi Gabbard: Well, when we?re dealing with the unconventional threat of > terrorist groups like ISIS, al Qaeda and some of these other groups that are > affiliated with them, we should not be using basically what has been and continues > to be the current policy of these mass mobilization of troops, these long > occupations and trillions of dollars going in, really abusing the Authorization to > Use Military Force and taking action that expands far beyond the legal limitations > of those current AUMFs. > > So, with these terrorist cells, for example, yes, I do still believe that the > right approach to take is these quick strike forces, surgical strikes, in and out, > very quickly, no long-term deployment, no long-term occupation to be able to get > rid of the threat that exists and then get out and the very limited use of drones > in those situations where our military is not able to get in without creating an > unacceptable level of risk, and where you can make sure that you?re not causing, > you know, a large amount of civilian casualties. Audio of the above is available at https://digitalcitizen.info/2019/02/13/is-tulsi-gabbard-really-anti-war-no-shes-pro-drone-and-for-surgical-strikes/ in case you want to hear that excerpt from Scahill & Gabbard's own voices. What Tulsi Gabbard has been saying for some time is neither surprising nor much of a shift in her war policy views -- she's down with killing innocents via drones and has she been down with this for some time now. As I wrote about a year after that, "?Quick strike forces?, ?surgical strikes?, ?in and out, very quickly?, ?no long-term deployment, no long-term occupation? are all pro-war propaganda. This vague language (how long is ?long-term??) is indistinguishable from what any neo-con would say to make war seem more acceptable.". The MintPressNews.com article above makes some point of showing whom Gabbard has connections to. Perhaps this is why you're unlikely to hear about this from Jimmy Dore & co. -- there's footage of Dore being quite chummy (if not enamored) with Tulsi Gabbard during the time she said the above to the Intercept (which Dore & co. also ignored). I tried to warn Dore away from this path by sending him an email to info at jimmydorecomedy.com which his staff received and replied to as a formality. But I didn't see anything come of it in his behavior. Dore would go on to 'share a stage' (as the MintPressNews.com article put it) with Gabbard when Dore & his wife Stef Zamorano visited Hawaii. Tulsi Gabbard has demonstrated her loyalty to the neo-con Democratic Party in word and deed: Word: In her CBS (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LzVSYBNgOeI) and Primo Nutmeg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dkdl-QbtS1U) interviews you can hear her say that she's a loyal Democrat and would not run as an independent or with a third-party. In other words, she long ago committed to not run in any way that challenges the Democratic Party. I believe that she gave that CBS interview before she was falsely accused of running as an independent by Hillary Clinton. Deed: Tulsi Gabbard participated in a coordinated act (coordinated by former Pres. Obama, as far as I know) when he got all of the 2020 Democratic Party nominees to quit their campaigns and endorse Biden (Gabbard even confirmed to Jimmy Dore in https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jka28F9ldBg that "supporting" and "endorsing" Biden's campaign were the same thing). Perhaps that's "collusion", a word the Democrats like to use for Russiagate accusations but never use to describe how neolib/neocon Joe Biden went from lackluster Democratic Party primary performance to becoming the sole nominee. Anyone who still thinks that Gabbard was an "anti-war" or "peace" representative of any kind after endorsing Biden for POTUS has some heavy explaining to do. Perhaps it's only a matter of time until Tulsi Gabbard replaces Bernie Sanders as the new sheepdog for the Democratic Party (see the late Bruce Dixon's prescient May 7, 2015 article https://blackagendareport.com/bernie-sanders-sheepdog-4-hillary for more on this concept of sheepdogging). _______________________________________________ Peace-discuss mailing list Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From r-szoke at illinois.edu Sun Nov 28 21:48:41 2021 From: r-szoke at illinois.edu (Szoke, Ron) Date: Sun, 28 Nov 2021 21:48:41 +0000 Subject: [Peace-discuss] T-day reflections Message-ID: A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 1 cat:turkey impr copy.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 23077 bytes Desc: 1 cat:turkey impr copy.jpg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Name: 2 T-day irony copy.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 69479 bytes Desc: 2 T-day irony copy.jpg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 3 thanks,workers .... copy.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 83175 bytes Desc: 3 thanks,workers .... copy.jpg URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 4 .jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 93387 bytes Desc: 4 .jpg URL: From naiman.uiuc at gmail.com Mon Nov 29 19:04:56 2021 From: naiman.uiuc at gmail.com (Robert Naiman) Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2021 14:04:56 -0500 Subject: [Peace-discuss] =?utf-8?b?QERLOiBMZXTigJlzIFF1aXQgU21va2luZyAm?= =?utf-8?q?_Drinking_the_Day_Congress_Ends_the_Yemen_War?= Message-ID: Please vote in the poll. I promise you'll enjoy it. https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2021/11/29/2066657/-Let-s-Quit-Smoking-Drinking-the-Day-Congress-Finally-Ends-the-Yemen-War Let?s Quit Smoking & Drinking the Day Congress Finally Ends the Yemen War I?m sure you remember the movie ?High Hopes? by the acclaimed British film director Mike Leigh. The two central characters were a youngish British working class leftist couple. The kind of people who ride their motorcycle to Highgate Cemetery so they can put flowers on the grave of Karl Marx. And then talk wistfully to each other about the Revolution. Could it ever happen here? Maybe. They try to look after the guy?s mom, who lives in public housing - ?council housing,? they call it there - who doesn?t seem to appreciate their attention much, and doesn?t seem to respect her son at all. She seems to see him as an unkempt, good for nothing, no account, ne?er-do-well. She?s got some circumstantial evidence for her case. Remember that iconic, canonical picture of Bernie being carried away by Chicago?s Finest who ?Serve and Protect? for protesting against school segregation? Remember how thick and wild and unruly Bernie?s hair was in that picture? That?s this guy?s hair, only blond. Remember how Abbie Hoffman and Alan Ginsburg and Bob Dylan sported that big, bushy rabbinical Yippie beard? That?s this guy?s beard, only blond. So his mother saw him as unkempt. Go figure. No accounting for tastes. So one day she says to him contemptuously: ?Why don?t you smarten yourself up?? To which he replies, unfazed: ?The day they machine gun the royal family, I?ll comb me hair and put a tie on.? I?m sure you remember the ?Pledge of Resistance? against Reagan?s illegal wars in Central America. When you signed the Pledge, you were agreeing to commit civil disobedience and get arrested if Reagan invaded Nicaragua. If you were an advanced student, if you were a high achiever, you got arrested even before that, getting arrested every time Congress gave more money to the CIA-organized terrorists who were killing civilians in Nicaragua for Freedom so that Nicaraguan Communists wouldn?t sneak into Texas from Nicaragua and fluoridate our water. Let?s put peanut butter and chocolate together again. Let?s make a Pledge that the day that Congress finally shuts down the unconstitutional Saudi war and blockade on Yemen and makes it stick, we?re all going to quit smoking and drinking. We?ll leave it up to the conscience of the individual parishioner exactly what meaning the word ?quit? should have in this context at this time. Some congregants may choose to quit smoking and drinking for the rest of their lives. Other congregants may choose to quit smoking and drinking for a single day. It?s a group project. Nobody is ?in charge.? Everybody helps, doing what they can. The Day of Atonement may be closer than you think. Representative Ilhan Omar and Senator Dr. Rand Paul are teaming up to finally shut this world-historical atrocity down, at long last. It?s the ultimate crime-fighting Dynamic Duo. It?s the ultimate Dream Team. It?s the ultimate Hollywood buddy movie. It?s Batman & Robin, it?s Morpheus & Neo, it?s Thelma & Louise. It?s Speed Racer and Racer X. It?s Frodo and Sam, trudging to Mordor to drop the Ring of Power in Mount Doom. It?s Ian Paisley and Martin McGuinness, together at last. It?s Jake and Elwood Blues. ?We?re putting the Band back together.? They?re on a mission from God. Omar & Paul have introduced ?Resolutions of Disapproval? in the House and Senate against the latest Biden-Saudi Bomb Deal. Representatives standing with Omar in the House so far include Progressive Caucus Chair Pramila Jayapal, Jim McGovern, Ro Khanna, Andy Levin, Earl Blumenauer, Chuy Garcia, Rashida Tlaib, and Eleanor Holmes Norton. Senators standing with Paul so far include Bernie Sanders and Mike Lee. These Senators and Representatives are Calling the Question on continued U.S. participation in one of the greatest atrocities on Earth today. Now every Senator is going to have to vote yes or no on whether they want to continue U.S. participation in the atrocity. When 51 Senators vote to end U.S. participation - it?s a privileged resolution pursuant to the Arms Export Control Act, so it can?t be filibustered - then every Member of the House is going to have to vote yes or no. The Omar-Paul Resolution of Disapproval will pass through the House like a hot knife through butter. Then the Omar-Paul Resolution will be on Biden?s desk, and Biden will have to sign it or veto it. That?s win-win for War Powers Club and the Forces of Progress. Either Biden ends the Saudi war in Yemen, like he promised in the debates, like he promised in the Democratic Platform, like he promised in his ?America is back!? speech at the State Department in February. Or else Biden owns the Saudi war and blockade in Yemen, lock, stock and barrel. And that?s exactly as it should be. As a candidate for President, Biden promised to end the war. If he reneges on his promise, the heavens should cry out. Here?s the version of Biden?s promise in the Democratic Platform : Democrats will end support for the Saudi-led war in Yemen and help bring the war to an end. This war is responsible for the world?s worst humanitarian crisis, and it amplifies threats to the region and to our interests. If Biden vetoes the Omar-Paul Resolution of Disapproval, then let fall the deluge. Let Justice Democrats roll down like waters. For the three transgressions of Biden, and for four, we will not revoke the Arms Export Control Act, nor the War Powers Resolution. The storm is up, and all is on the hazard. The sea is behind us, and the enemy in front. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From karenaram at hotmail.com Tue Nov 30 14:57:56 2021 From: karenaram at hotmail.com (karen aram) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2021 08:57:56 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: The destruction of Yugoslavia References: Message-ID: > November?28,?2017 ? > The decimation of Yugoslavia became the script the USA has used to implement its imperialist agenda. The following are excerpts from an essay by Michael Parenti: > The Rational Destruction of Yugoslavia 25/11/2017 by Michael Parenti ( via email from David Alpert ) > In 1999, the U.S. national security state ? which has been involved throughout the world in subversion, sabotage, terrorism, torture, drug trafficking, and death squads ? launched round-the-clock aerial attacks against Yugoslavia for 78 days, dropping 20,000 tons of bombs and killing thousands of women, children, and men. All this was done out of humanitarian concern for Albanians in Kosovo. > Or so we were asked to believe. In the span of a few months, President Clinton bombed four countries: Sudan, Afghanistan, Iraq repeatedly, and Yugoslavia massively. At the same time, the U.S. was involved in proxy wars in Angola, Mexico (Chiapas), Colombia, East Timor, and various other places. And U.S. forces are deployed on every continent and ocean, with some 300 major overseas support bases ? all in the name of peace, democracy, national security, and humanitarianism. > While showing themselves ready and willing to bomb Yugoslavia on behalf of an ostensibly oppressed minority in Kosovo, U.S. leaders have made no moves against the Czech Republic for its mistreatment of the Romany people (gypsies), or Britain for oppressing the Catholic minority in Northern Ireland, or the Hutu for the mass murder of a half million Tutsi in Rwanda ? not to mention the French who were complicit in that massacre. Nor have U.S. leaders considered launching ?humanitarian bombings? against the Turkish people for what their leaders have done to the Kurds, or the Indonesian people because their generals killed over 200,000 East Timorese and were continuing such slaughter through the summer of 1999, or the Guatemalans for the Guatemalan military?s systematic extermination of tens of thousands of Mayan villagers. In such cases, U.S. leaders not only tolerated such atrocities but were actively complicit with the perpetrators ? who usually happened to be faithful client-state allies dedicated to helping Washington make the world safe for the Fortune 500. > After World War II, socialist Yugoslavia became a viable nation and an economic success. Between 1960 and 1980 it had one of the most vigorous growth rates: a decent standard of living, free medical care and education, a guaranteed right to a job, one-month vacation with pay, a literacy rate of over 90 percent, and a life expectancy of 72 years. > Yugoslavia also offered its multi-ethnic citizenry affordable public transportation, housing, and utilities, with a not-for-profit economy that was mostly publicly owned. This was not the kind of country global capitalism would normally tolerate. The dismemberment and mutilation of Yugoslavia was part of a concerted policy initiated by the United States and the other Western powers in 1989. Yugoslavia was the one country in Eastern Europe that would not voluntarily overthrow what remained of its socialist system and install a free-market economic order. > The U.S. goal has been to transform the Yugoslav nation into a Third-World region, a cluster of weak right-wing principalities with the following characteristics: > ...incapable of charting an independent course of self-development; a shattered economy and natural resources completely accessible to multinational corporate exploitation, including the enormous mineral wealth in Kosovo; > ...an impoverished, but literate and skilled population forced to work at subsistence wages, constituting a cheap labor pool that will help depress wages in western Europe and elsewhere; > ...dismantled petroleum, engineering, mining, fertilizer, and automobile industries, and various light industries, that offer no further competition with existing Western producers. > ...U.S. policymakers also want to abolish Yugoslavia?s public sector services and social programs ? for the same reason they want to abolish our public sector services and social programs. > That U.S. leaders have consciously sought to dismember Yugoslavia is not a matter of speculation but of public record. In November 1990, the Bush administration pressured Congress into passing the 1991 Foreign Operations Appropriations Act, which provided that any part of Yugoslavia failing to declare independence within six months would lose U.S. financial support. The law demanded separate elections in each of the six Yugoslav republics, and mandated U.S. State Department approval of both election procedures and results as a condition for any future aid. Aid would go only to the separate republics, not to the Yugoslav government, and only to those forces whom Washington defined as ?democratic,? meaning right-wing, free-market, separatist parties. > In 1992, another blow was delivered against Belgrade: international sanctions. Led by the United States, a freeze was imposed on all trade to and from Yugoslavia, with disastrous results for the economy: hyperinflation, mass unemployment of up to 70 percent, malnourishment, and the collapse of the health care system. > While pretending to work for harmony, U.S. leaders supported the most divisive, reactionary forces from Croatia to Kosovo. In Croatia, the West?s man-of-the-hour was Franjo Tudjman, who claimed in a book he authored in 1989, that ?the establishment of Hitler?s new European order can be justified by the need to be rid of the Jews,? and that only 900,000 Jews, not six million, were killed in the Holocaust. > =================================== > It is important to know the history in order to see current events in context. What we are experiencing today with the US and NATO at war with several countries are not isolated events but part of an ongoing imperialist agenda. > Over 20 million people have died at the hands of the US since WW2 and the US has attempted to justify this by claiming that "we" want to bring freedom and democracy to the rest of the world. > David Alpert [ via email ] -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From carl at newsfromneptune.com Tue Nov 30 15:05:26 2021 From: carl at newsfromneptune.com (C. G. Estabrook) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2021 09:05:26 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: The NATOstan Clown Show References: <20211130150114.1.D9BDD2BC8CC38820@mg.unz.com> Message-ID: > Begin forwarded message: > > From: Pepe Escobar / The Unz Review > Subject: The NATOstan Clown Show > To: carl at newsfromneptune.com > > The Unz Review ? An Alternative Media Selection Subscribe > A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media > The NATOstan Clown Show Pepe Escobar ? November 29, 2021 ? 1,300 Words > > American hysteria over the ?imminent? Russian invasion of Ukraine has exploded every geopolitical Stupid-o-Meter in sight ? and that?s quite an accomplishment. > > What a mess. Sections of the U.S. Deep State are in open revolt against the combo that remote controls Crash Test Dummy, who impersonates POTUS. The neocon-neoliberal axis is itching for a war ? but has no idea how to sell it to an immensely fractured public opinion. > > UKUS, which de facto controls the Five Eyes spy scam, excels only in propaganda. So in the end it?s up to the CIA/MI6 intel axis and their vast network of media chihuahuas to accelerate Fear and Loathing ad infinitum. > > Russophobic U.S. Think Tankland would very much cherish a Russian ?invasion?, out of the blue, and could not give a damn about the inevitable trouncing of Ukraine. The problem is the White House ? and the Pentagon ? must ?intervene?, forcefully; otherwise that will represent a catastrophic loss of ?credibility? for the Empire. > > So what do these people want? They want to provoke Moscow by all means available to exercise ?Russian aggression?, resulting in a lightning fast war that will be a highway to hell for Ukraine, but with zero casualties for NATO and the Pentagon. > > Then the Empire of Chaos will blame Russia; unleash a tsunami of fresh sanctions, especially financial; and try to shut off all economic links between Russia and NATOstan. > > Reality dictates that none of the above is going to happen. > > All exponents of Russian leadership, starting with President Putin, have already made it clear, over and over again, what happens if the Ukro-dementials start a blitzkrieg over Donbass: Ukraine will be mercilessly smashed ? and that applies not only to the ethno-fascist gang in Kiev. Ukraine will cease to exist as a state. > > Defense Minister Shoigu, for his part, has staged all manner of not exactly soft persuasion, featuring Tu-22M3 bombers or Tu-160 White Swan bombers. > > The inestimable Andrei Martyanov has conclusively explained , over and over again, that ?NATO doesn?t have forces not only to ?counter-act? anything Russia does but even if it wanted to it still has no means to fight a war with Russia.? > > Martyanov notes, ?there is nothing in the U.S. arsenal now and in the foreseeable future which can intercept Mach=9-10+, let alone M=20-27, targets. That?s the issue. Same analytical method applies to a situation in 404. The only thing U.S. (NATO) can hope for is to somehow provoke Russia into the invasion of this shithole of a country and then get all SIGINT it can once Russia?s C4ISR gets into full combat mode.? > > Translation: anything the Empire of Chaos and its NATO subsidiary try in Donbass, directly or indirectly, the humiliation will make the Afghanistan ?withdrawal? look like a House of Gucci dinner party. > > No one should expect clueless NATO puppets ? starting with secretary-general Stoltenberg ? to understand the military stakes. After all, these are the same puppets who have been building up a situation which might ultimately leave Moscow with a single, stark choice: be ready to fight a full scale hot war in Europe ? which could become nuclear in a flash. And ready they are. > > It?s all about Minsk > > In a parallel reality, ?meddling in 404? ? a delightful Martyanov reference to a hellhole that is little more than a computer error ? is a totally different story. That perfectly fits American juvenilia ethos. > > At least some of the adults in selected rooms are talking. The CIA?s Burns went to Moscow to try to extract some assurance that in the event NATO Special Forces were caught in the cauldrons ? Debaltsevo 2015-style ? that the People?s Republics of Donetsk and Lugansk, with Russian help, will concoct, they would be allowed to escape. > > His interlocutor, Patrushev, told Burns ? diplomatically ? to get lost. > > Chief of the General Staff, Gen Valery Gerasimov, had a phone call with Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Gen Mark Milley, ostensibly to ensure, in Pentagonese, ?risk-reduction and operational de-confliction?. No substantial details were leaked. > > It remains to be seen how this ?de-confliction? will happen in practice when Defense Minister Shoigu revealed U.S. nuclear-capable bombers have been practicing, in their sorties across Eastern Europe, ?their ability to use nuclear weapons against Russia?. Shoigu discussed that in detail with Chinese Defense Minister Wei Fenghe: after all the Americans will certainly pull the same stunt against China. > > The root cause of all this drama is stark: Kiev simply refuses to respect the February 2015 Minsk Agreement. > > In a nutshell, the deal stipulated that Kiev should grant autonomy to Donbass via a constitutional amendment, referred to as ?special status?; issue a general amnesty; and start a dialogue with the people?s republics of Donetsk and Lugansk. > > Over the years, Kiev fulfilled exactly zero commitments ? while the proverbial NATOstan media machine incessantly pounded global opinion with fake news, spinning that Russia was violating Minsk. Russia is not even mentioned in the agreement. > > Moscow in fact always respected the Minsk Agreement ? which translates as regarding Donbass as an integral, autonomous part of Ukraine. Moscow has zero interest in promoting regime change in Kiev. > > This charade has come to a point that ? diplomatically ? is quite unprecedented: Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov lost his Taoist patience. > > Lavrov was forced, under the circumstances, to publish 28 pages of correspondence between Moscow on one hand, and Berlin and Paris on the other, evolving around the preparation of a high-level meeting on Ukraine. > > Moscow was in fact calling for one of the central points of the agreement to be implemented: a direct dialogue between Kiev and Donbass. Berlin and Paris said this was unacceptable. So yes: both, for all practical purposes, destroyed the Minsk Agreement. Public opinion across NATOstan has no idea whatsoever this actually happened. > > Lavrov did not mince his words: ?I am sure that you understand the necessity of this unconventional step, because it is a matter of conveying to the world community the truth about who is fulfilling, and how, the obligations under international law that have been agreed at the highest level.? > > So it?s no wonder that the leadership in Moscow concluded it?s an absolute waste of time to talk to Berlin and Paris about Ukraine: they lied, cheated ? and then blamed Russia. This ?decision? at the EU level faithfully mirrors NATO?s campaign of stoking the flames of imminent ?Russian aggression? against Ukraine. > > Armchair warriors, unite! > > Across NATOstan, the trademark stupidity of U.S. Think Tankland rules unabated, congregating countless acolytes spewing out the talking points of choice: ?relentless Russian subversion?, ?thug? Putin ?intimidation? of Ukraine, Russians as ?predators?, and everything now coupled with ?power-hungry China?s war on Western values.? > > Some Brit hack, in a twisted way, actually managed to sum up the overall impotence ? and insignificance ? by painting Europe as a victim, ?a beleaguered democratic island in an anarchic world, which a rising tide of authoritarianism, impunity and international rule-breaking threatens to inundate?. > > The answer by NATOstan Defense Ministers is to come up with a Strategic Compass ? essentially an anti-Russia-China scam ? complete with ?rapid deployment forces?. Led by who, General Macron? > > As it stands, poor NATOstan is uncontrollably sobbing, accusing those Russian hooligans ? scary monsters, to quote David Bowie ? of staging an anti-satellite missile test and thus ?scorning European safety concerns?. > > Something must have got lost in translation. So here?s what happened: Russia conclusively demonstrated it?s capable of obliterating each and every one of NATO?s satellites and blind ?all their missiles, planes and ships, not to mention ground forces? in case they decide to materialize their warmongering ideas. > > Obviously those deaf, dumb and blind NATOstan armchair warrior clowns ? fresh from their Afghan ?performance? ? won?t get the message. But NATOstan anyway was never accused of being partial to reality. > > > Unsubscribe From This Mailing List -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From carl at newsfromneptune.com Tue Nov 30 15:12:22 2021 From: carl at newsfromneptune.com (C. G. Estabrook) Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2021 09:12:22 -0600 Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: The NATOstan Clown Show References: <20211130150114.1.D9BDD2BC8CC38820@mg.unz.com> Message-ID: <0D96C152-45A3-4CA9-B75F-2E67328FFFE9@newsfromneptune.com> > Begin forwarded message: > > From: Pepe Escobar / The Unz Review > Subject: The NATOstan Clown Show > To: carl at newsfromneptune.com > > The Unz Review ? An Alternative Media Selection Subscribe > A Collection of Interesting, Important, and Controversial Perspectives Largely Excluded from the American Mainstream Media > The NATOstan Clown Show Pepe Escobar ? November 29, 2021 ? 1,300 Words > > American hysteria over the ?imminent? Russian invasion of Ukraine has exploded every geopolitical Stupid-o-Meter in sight ? and that?s quite an accomplishment. > > What a mess. Sections of the U.S. Deep State are in open revolt against the combo that remote controls Crash Test Dummy, who impersonates POTUS. The neocon-neoliberal axis is itching for a war ? but has no idea how to sell it to an immensely fractured public opinion. > > UKUS, which de facto controls the Five Eyes spy scam, excels only in propaganda. So in the end it?s up to the CIA/MI6 intel axis and their vast network of media chihuahuas to accelerate Fear and Loathing ad infinitum. > > Russophobic U.S. Think Tankland would very much cherish a Russian ?invasion?, out of the blue, and could not give a damn about the inevitable trouncing of Ukraine. The problem is the White House ? and the Pentagon ? must ?intervene?, forcefully; otherwise that will represent a catastrophic loss of ?credibility? for the Empire. > > So what do these people want? They want to provoke Moscow by all means available to exercise ?Russian aggression?, resulting in a lightning fast war that will be a highway to hell for Ukraine, but with zero casualties for NATO and the Pentagon. > > Then the Empire of Chaos will blame Russia; unleash a tsunami of fresh sanctions, especially financial; and try to shut off all economic links between Russia and NATOstan. > > Reality dictates that none of the above is going to happen. > > All exponents of Russian leadership, starting with President Putin, have already made it clear, over and over again, what happens if the Ukro-dementials start a blitzkrieg over Donbass: Ukraine will be mercilessly smashed ? and that applies not only to the ethno-fascist gang in Kiev. Ukraine will cease to exist as a state. > > Defense Minister Shoigu, for his part, has staged all manner of not exactly soft persuasion, featuring Tu-22M3 bombers or Tu-160 White Swan bombers. > > The inestimable Andrei Martyanov has conclusively explained , over and over again, that ?NATO doesn?t have forces not only to ?counter-act? anything Russia does but even if it wanted to it still has no means to fight a war with Russia.? > > Martyanov notes, ?there is nothing in the U.S. arsenal now and in the foreseeable future which can intercept Mach=9-10+, let alone M=20-27, targets. That?s the issue. Same analytical method applies to a situation in 404. The only thing U.S. (NATO) can hope for is to somehow provoke Russia into the invasion of this shithole of a country and then get all SIGINT it can once Russia?s C4ISR gets into full combat mode.? > > Translation: anything the Empire of Chaos and its NATO subsidiary try in Donbass, directly or indirectly, the humiliation will make the Afghanistan ?withdrawal? look like a House of Gucci dinner party. > > No one should expect clueless NATO puppets ? starting with secretary-general Stoltenberg ? to understand the military stakes. After all, these are the same puppets who have been building up a situation which might ultimately leave Moscow with a single, stark choice: be ready to fight a full scale hot war in Europe ? which could become nuclear in a flash. And ready they are. > > It?s all about Minsk > > In a parallel reality, ?meddling in 404? ? a delightful Martyanov reference to a hellhole that is little more than a computer error ? is a totally different story. That perfectly fits American juvenilia ethos. > > At least some of the adults in selected rooms are talking. The CIA?s Burns went to Moscow to try to extract some assurance that in the event NATO Special Forces were caught in the cauldrons ? Debaltsevo 2015-style ? that the People?s Republics of Donetsk and Lugansk, with Russian help, will concoct, they would be allowed to escape. > > His interlocutor, Patrushev, told Burns ? diplomatically ? to get lost. > > Chief of the General Staff, Gen Valery Gerasimov, had a phone call with Chairman of the Joint Chiefs, Gen Mark Milley, ostensibly to ensure, in Pentagonese, ?risk-reduction and operational de-confliction?. No substantial details were leaked. > > It remains to be seen how this ?de-confliction? will happen in practice when Defense Minister Shoigu revealed U.S. nuclear-capable bombers have been practicing, in their sorties across Eastern Europe, ?their ability to use nuclear weapons against Russia?. Shoigu discussed that in detail with Chinese Defense Minister Wei Fenghe: after all the Americans will certainly pull the same stunt against China. > > The root cause of all this drama is stark: Kiev simply refuses to respect the February 2015 Minsk Agreement. > > In a nutshell, the deal stipulated that Kiev should grant autonomy to Donbass via a constitutional amendment, referred to as ?special status?; issue a general amnesty; and start a dialogue with the people?s republics of Donetsk and Lugansk. > > Over the years, Kiev fulfilled exactly zero commitments ? while the proverbial NATOstan media machine incessantly pounded global opinion with fake news, spinning that Russia was violating Minsk. Russia is not even mentioned in the agreement. > > Moscow in fact always respected the Minsk Agreement ? which translates as regarding Donbass as an integral, autonomous part of Ukraine. Moscow has zero interest in promoting regime change in Kiev. > > This charade has come to a point that ? diplomatically ? is quite unprecedented: Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov lost his Taoist patience. > > Lavrov was forced, under the circumstances, to publish 28 pages of correspondence between Moscow on one hand, and Berlin and Paris on the other, evolving around the preparation of a high-level meeting on Ukraine. > > Moscow was in fact calling for one of the central points of the agreement to be implemented: a direct dialogue between Kiev and Donbass. Berlin and Paris said this was unacceptable. So yes: both, for all practical purposes, destroyed the Minsk Agreement. Public opinion across NATOstan has no idea whatsoever this actually happened. > > Lavrov did not mince his words: ?I am sure that you understand the necessity of this unconventional step, because it is a matter of conveying to the world community the truth about who is fulfilling, and how, the obligations under international law that have been agreed at the highest level.? > > So it?s no wonder that the leadership in Moscow concluded it?s an absolute waste of time to talk to Berlin and Paris about Ukraine: they lied, cheated ? and then blamed Russia. This ?decision? at the EU level faithfully mirrors NATO?s campaign of stoking the flames of imminent ?Russian aggression? against Ukraine. > > Armchair warriors, unite! > > Across NATOstan, the trademark stupidity of U.S. Think Tankland rules unabated, congregating countless acolytes spewing out the talking points of choice: ?relentless Russian subversion?, ?thug? Putin ?intimidation? of Ukraine, Russians as ?predators?, and everything now coupled with ?power-hungry China?s war on Western values.? > > Some Brit hack, in a twisted way, actually managed to sum up the overall impotence ? and insignificance ? by painting Europe as a victim, ?a beleaguered democratic island in an anarchic world, which a rising tide of authoritarianism, impunity and international rule-breaking threatens to inundate?. > > The answer by NATOstan Defense Ministers is to come up with a Strategic Compass ? essentially an anti-Russia-China scam ? complete with ?rapid deployment forces?. Led by who, General Macron? > > As it stands, poor NATOstan is uncontrollably sobbing, accusing those Russian hooligans ? scary monsters, to quote David Bowie ? of staging an anti-satellite missile test and thus ?scorning European safety concerns?. > > Something must have got lost in translation. So here?s what happened: Russia conclusively demonstrated it?s capable of obliterating each and every one of NATO?s satellites and blind ?all their missiles, planes and ships, not to mention ground forces? in case they decide to materialize their warmongering ideas. > > Obviously those deaf, dumb and blind NATOstan armchair warrior clowns ? fresh from their Afghan ?performance? ? won?t get the message. But NATOstan anyway was never accused of being partial to reality. > > > Unsubscribe From This Mailing List -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: