[Peace-discuss] [Peace] 3pm today: "EMERGENCY: Is the US going to war with Russia over Ukraine?" Code Pink webinar

[Storm, Rachel]

I thought I exited this list a very long time ago. Can someone help remove me?

And since I just read that thread I'll say this before I go:

There's both room and necessity in considering the urgency of many issues simultaneously--one doesn’t actually have to choose. Conserve your time and don't fret over webinar attendance--trust me, it's hardly indicative of much.

Name-calling, really? That's where we are?

This may be as good a time as any to reflect upon why an anti-war listserv is so frequently seduced into waring with itself. The revolution starts at home after all.

Take care.



On Jan 25, 2022 8:08 PM, karen aram via Peace <peace at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
LOL



On Jan 25, 2022, at 8:03 PM, Robert Naiman <naiman.uiuc at gmail.com<mailto:naiman.uiuc at gmail.com>> wrote:


What's hilarious is how insistently stupid you are.

It's like you're genetically addicted to being stupid.

According to Medea, there were more than 500 people on the Ukraine call.

There were 70 people on the Yemen call.

You would acknowledge that I proved my point, if you weren't genetically addicted to being stupid, like a slavish follower of Jim Jones, who refused to stop drinking the Green Party Kool-Aid.


On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 8:35 PM karen aram <karenaram at hotmail.com<mailto:karenaram at hotmail.com>> wrote:
Robert

You’re really funny, you just learned about it today, based upon your previous emails.
 Your insistence, "it’s a distraction, your insistence the USG isn’t insane," on and on

Your insistence we listen to the webinar related to Yemen, which we’ve known about for seven years with no change in direction from the US, our government representatives, and our proxy the KSA in their goal of total destruction, and control.

But "oh my," you know more about this than I and I’m the one who is "stupid and evil.” Come on, you can do better than that, threaten me with bodily harm, as you have in the past.
Your misogyny betrays you. I’ll stop taunting you, when you stop with the lies and propaganda, and stop addressing me.

We should all thank Stuart for his email invitation to Code Pink’s webinar enlightening Robert and hopefully others.



On Jan 25, 2022, at 6:57 PM, Robert Naiman <naiman.uiuc at gmail.com<mailto:naiman.uiuc at gmail.com>> wrote:

Karen,

I know more about this than you do.

Why do you taunt me with your evil stupidity?


On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 5:40 PM karen aram <karenaram at hotmail.com<mailto:karenaram at hotmail.com>> wrote:
Robert

You couldn’t be more wrong about the USG, we’ve destroyed how many nations in how many years? You’re right and they're not insane, they're just greedy, hegemonies, imperialists looking at profits and they don’t care how many lives they destroy.

Obviously you haven’t been paying attention related to what is taking place in Ukraine, Russia and Nato. I’m referring to going beneath the surface, not just skimming the headlines.

For starters: read Morton Brussel’s second paragraph below, he knows exactly what is taking place.

Read or listen to the links I provided by experts in the field.

Just listen to what "The Nation’s,” Katrina Vandenheuval has to say, on "Democracy Now," both of which are liberal Democrat media’s, not socialists nothing to be feared. Ray McGovern former CIA Analyst and advisor to the Reagan government, now retired and reformed. They are just two people who focus on what is taking place in the world, specifically the targets of US imperialism since at least 1917.

And, if you think our nuclear missiles and Nato being spread across Europe isn’t dangerous, please understand: it takes only one, only one accident, and accidents do happen.


On Jan 25, 2022, at 3:08 PM, Robert Naiman <naiman.uiuc at gmail.com<mailto:naiman.uiuc at gmail.com>> wrote:


I'm not denigrating being concerned about what the U.S. is doing in Ukraine. I'm denigrating the scaremongering about "World War 3." That's nonsense. It's not how the U.S. behaves. It's not how Russia behaves. Proxy war is not the same thing as direct war. That doesn't mean that proxy war is ok. Proxy war is not ok. Proxy war is monstrous. It has destroyed country after country. But it's not a threat to Americans, which is why they do it and mostly get away with it. We should be honest about this. We should tell the truth about this. Lying about it isn't going to improve anything. You can temporarily get people excited. But you can't sustain activism like this. Nobody will stick with concern about Ukraine once they cut a deal and it's out of the headlines. It's ephemeral. It's a Shiny Object. It's not building anything. It's not doing anything about the big harms that U.S. foreign policy is causing. Millions of human beings on the brink of starvation in Yemen. Millions of human beings on the brink of starvation in Afghanistan. What is Ukraine compared to that? It's a nothingburger. How does jumping up and down about Ukraine help with that? It doesn't help with that. It doesn't do anything.

Look at Syria. The U.S. was happy to mess around in Syria, promote sectarian civil war to undermine the regime. But when the Russians intervened directly, the U.S. said: "Oh, ok." They weren't going to fight Russia over Syria.

They are not going to fight the Russians over Ukraine.


On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 2:24 PM karen aram <karenaram at hotmail.com<mailto:karenaram at hotmail.com>> wrote:
Robert,

You’re right about Yemen, it’s a terrible situation, one which was created in 2015 by the Obama Administration, along with the destruction of Libya and Syria.

That doesn’t negate what is taking place in Ukraine on the borders of Russia, which began during the Reagan Administration, became obvious during the Obama Administration, and now has us on the verge of WW3.

For those so certain the US isn’t insane, and won’t go to war with Russia, you need to recognize the USG uses proxy’s and having Ukraine destroyed in a proxy war doesn’t bother them at all.

The provocations of Russia by Nato is urging regime change for another Yeltsin, or force Russia to annex portions of Ukraine, the Donbass region specifically, which could result in war with the potential for WW3.

When experts on "foreign policy" are even more concerned now than ever over this issue, denigrating those in this community showing the same concern, is insulting.

So here, be my guest, and educate yourself:

I have more articles if anyone is interested.

https://popularresistance.org/ukraine-crisis-us-toolboxes-are-empty/<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://popularresistance.org/ukraine-crisis-us-toolboxes-are-empty/__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVHtiE-XQ$>

https://raymcgovern.com/.../perfidious-albion-giving.../<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https*3A*2F*2Fraymcgovern.com*2F2022*2F01*2F23*2Fperfidious-albion-giving-grist-to-nyt*2F*3Ffbclid*3DIwAR2ILirkN93s1nZcckTPemRbTBXvU3f5SLJo-PcQDrpprE2lRdhGMFqqvtA&h=AT3KLz-SU_m0WuubsmLju_TtI0y67N02zQD8KrotYF56k4liIQmfme8fNHrZ_E-DznBsr42QA4nEUmCdNjfM5aO_g7VUtdSFSJX5aLo8EuTZixwIBZH-PdQO0NRb6QwQ7pStJmk&__tn__=-UK-R&c*0*=AT3I2vkorbr6_pGXS0Avxt-MWOiY2nDtm4mvshP_InAS7XQW3hdvFKbYT6urDmFDsLtrnCaPoIWGozg2lf_UemxZBDRejHaHUGaD0UuGOU2s5sBob0KtT0gNytd5VSszFXMSD2ANnmdrVU6urm9iW7fflNfwlc9JWU8E-6nIEeCI49Cg8jZ5_IG6iuNQSHuHPBh0sX10MVqUJwd7G8Tw__;JSUlJSUlJSUlJVtd!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVO6NMPUQ$>

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkYgXQo2aQs<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zkYgXQo2aQs__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVWShk9ug$>

https://www.rt.com/shows/news-on-rt-america/547244-head-of-german-navy-forced/<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.rt.com/shows/news-on-rt-america/547244-head-of-german-navy-forced/__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVAnDpuTw$>

https://www.rt.com/shows/news-on-rt-america/546815-ben-norton-americans-dont-want/<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.rt.com/shows/news-on-rt-america/546815-ben-norton-americans-dont-want/__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVWSD9naQ$>





On Jan 25, 2022, at 11:19 AM, Robert Naiman via Peace <peace at lists.chambana.net<mailto:peace at lists.chambana.net>> wrote:


If you believe that the United States is going to war with Russia over Ukraine, please raise your hand.

This is not how the U.S. Empire works. Did the U.S. go to war with Russia over Syria? If the U.S. wasn't willing to go to war with Russia over Syria, why would the U.S. be willing to go to war with Russia over Ukraine? This is all Blob hype in the media to pressure Biden to be more aggressive. But whatever Biden does, it's not going to be war with Russia. Biden is not insane. They'll send some more military stuff, they'll deploy a few thousand more troops to NATO countries in Eastern Europe, they'll impose more economic sanctions on Russia, though not any that would badly hurt the German economy, which means that they're not going to get carried away.

Do you remember in grade school, when they said: "Pick on someone your own size"? That's something the U.S. Empire NEVER does. Reagan talked tough on the Soviet Union. Then he invaded Grenada, a country the size of Champaign-Urbana.

Here's why this matters. There is an "emergency" Codepink webinar today at 8pm ET on the U.S.-Saudi war-blockade-famine-genocide in Yemen. How many people are going to go to both? Which is the real emergency, the Blob media hype that can never result in a war with Russia because the people running the U.S. are not insane, or Yemeni children starving to death because the U.S. is helping the Saudi regime blockade Yemen, in violation of Article I of the U.S. Constitution and the War Powers Resolution of 1973?

Here is the real emergency Codepink webinar today for the people who don't want to chase Shiny Objects in the Blob-dominated U.S. media:

"Please join CODEPINK for #YemenCan'tWait Emergency On-Line Action with a briefing from Yemenis.
Tues., Jan. 25, 5 PM (PT), 8 PM (ET)
RSVP HERE.<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.codepink.org/yemenemergencyaction__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVIm8BJsA$>
The Saudi-UAE coalition recently attacked Yemen's communication infrastructure, leaving all of Yemen without connection to the internet. Initial reports of Saudi-led strikes have high civilian casualties. People in the U.S. need to take action now. Join us on January 25 at 8PM ET to engage on social media and call our members of Congress. Attendees will be briefed on the situation on the ground at the beginning & given all the tools and language for taking action. Please RSVP and invite friends. We need all hands on deck."


On Tue, Jan 25, 2022 at 9:04 AM Stuart Levy via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net<mailto:peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>> wrote:
Biden has just ordered 8500 US troops to be on alert for possible deployment to Eastern Europe... "lethal aid" has already been delivered to Ukraine.

US politicians across the spectrum are expressing their "support" for Ukraine, and the US media have been preparing us for war.

At 3PM Central Time today, Jan. 25th, CODE PINK will hold an emergency webinar:

Click Here to sign up for the webinar -- www.codepink.org/092522<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.codepink.org/092522?recruiter_id=428144__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVFc8QxPQ$>
Join an emergency webinar discussion between CODEPINK'S Medea Benjamin and retired Army Colonel Larry Wilkerson today at 3:00 PM Central time. Larry Wilkerson is a professor at the College of William & Mary and was chief of staff to U.S Secretary of State Colin Powell. After ending his military career, Wilkerson publicly criticized the Iraq War and has been a vocal opponent of U.S. policies that put militarism before diplomacy.

RSVP FOR THE WEBINAR HERE!<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.codepink.org/092522?recruiter_id=428144__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVFc8QxPQ$>

The U.S. and NATO, whose Response Force is composed of some 40,000 international troops, are exacerbating a conflict that could easily result in war between the world’s two most heavily armed nuclear states – the United States and Russia. We must immediately demand that NATO, the U.S., Russia and Ukraine pursue vigorous diplomacy for a negotiated solution. There is every reason to believe that a compromise can be made with Russia, including a guarantee that Ukraine will not become a member of NATO.

RSVP for today’s webinar and send a message to your representatives in Congress, telling them to pressure Biden not to go to war with Russia over Ukraine. Tell Congress that you want negotiations, not escalation.

Since 2015, the Minsk II Accord has successfully prevented a new escalation of the civil war in Ukraine. But the United States and NATO have encouraged the Ukrainian government to ignore its obligations under Minsk II, and to instead reassert absolute sovereignty over the Donbas region. They have supplied powerful weapons, which Ukraine has deployed and used in Eastern Ukraine.

Russia has always been opposed to NATO’s eastern expansion to its borders, and it is determined to stop Ukraine from entering NATO. In 2008, when Ukrainian President Viktor Yushchenko first applied for NATO membership, President Putin called Ukrainian membership "a direct threat" to Russia. NATO is a military alliance that should have dissolved with the dissolution of the Soviet Union and the Warsaw Pact. It should certainly not be expanding to include Ukraine.


Rather than NATO dissolving with the Warsaw Pact, as it should have done, it has violated the agreements that brought the original Cold War to an end and reunified Germany. Instead of keeping its promise not to expand eastward, it has added 11 member countries that were once either Soviet republics or members of the Warsaw Pact.

Now the situation is teetering on the brink of a massive war. The time to speak out is now!

Join the webinar<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.codepink.org/092522?recruiter_id=428144__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVFc8QxPQ$> on the crisis in Ukraine and tell Congress not to let Biden send troops to Eastern Europe!<https://urldefense.com/v3/__https://www.codepink.org/ukraine_congress?e=38045e0b248b322e5a3a8b9d6b8774fb&utm_source=codepink&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=ukraine_emergency_3&n=11__;!!DZ3fjg!qG0nq68ed9CsxYmrKx0Y5Q8mW4-NZeDDBUIw1j41A5BNTLlwz4NwH3jQkBVJdMWKuQ$>

Towards peace,
Medea and the entire CODEPINK team: Alice, Allison, Ann, Ariel, Carley, Danaka, Emily, Farida, Jodie, Justina, Kelly, Lauren, Leonardo, Madison, Marcy, Marissa, Mark, Michelle, Nancy, Olivia, Paki, Teri, Shea, and Suzie

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