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<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>The fractal geometric properties of
the water's edge and the size distributions of the little bubbles it
makes as it flows around the rocks and pebbles and sand drifts are all very
interesting. But the big waves are the only thing that make a big
difference and the big waves can undo all of the little stuff
efforts.</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=ewj@pigs.ag href="mailto:ewj@pigs.ag">E.Wayne Johnson</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=davegreen84@yahoo.com
href="mailto:davegreen84@yahoo.com">David Green</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A
title=peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace Discuss</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, May 01, 2010 9:38
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Peace-discuss] ron paul -
we can do better with peace</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>What Carl and Chomsky have noted, in my opinion,
is that the Tea Party has (or had) some life in it. It may be a dog in
many ways, but it was noted a little while ago that a live dog has
more opportunity than a dead lion.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>It is quite unfortunate that those who could be
allies so quickly want to dismiss the "populist uprising" as "astroturf"
without any consideration of what is actually going on. Its pretty easy
to make accusations of the movement being</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>white and affluent. Most Americans are
white, and most of the Americans who have a stake in changing the system
are</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>white. So what? Its a granfalloon.
The race card is pretty flimsy, but it could be said that for many
blacks, they have a stake in keeping the system the way that it is, even
though many of us whites think they would be better off if the D/R system
didnt buy them out as it does. </FONT><FONT size=2 face=Arial>(I can
anticipate tonnes of well-earned flaming from that comment. Have at it,
but it would be a diversionary thread.)</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>There are some good reasons to lump the Tea Party
movement with the Liberty movement. and while one is at it, it works to lump
the progressives kicking and screaming into the same pile.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>The original Tea Party movement was not
astroturfed, although it has indeed been Heavily Co-opted by the R
establishment in much the same way as the Peace Movement has been
co-opted by the D establishment. In both cases there is a remnant
that has not bowed to Baal.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>The thinks that the manipulators of the Tea Party
and the manipulators of the Peace movement and the manipulators of the
Progressive movement (and yea, the manipulators of the Liberty movement)
do to diffuse away the enthusiasm and frustrate the higher ends of those
movements do not change the fact that there is indeed a potentially unifying
thread running through all of those. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>That unifying thread is that the American
Democracy (call it a Republic if that
suits one's dialectical blindnesses more comfortably) is
a lousy joke and people ought to be mad as hell about the way they are
manipulated, lied to, cheated, and robbed. </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>The Frank Luntzes of the world and similarly sick
genii scan the mindscape of the "movements" and try to find ways to drain off
the political capital, censor the message, and give the masses a pretty lace
doily for their mind. The Dems have their Frank Luntzes and their
willing supplicants and sycophants too. The R's and the D's are quite
simply two different arms of the same octopus who want you to keep thinking
that Buicks and Oldsmobiles are somehow different and that a Lincoln is any
other than a damn Ford.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>I heard Sarah Palin give her speech in St; Paul
in 2008 and I dont like her much at all. But people relate to her
because they think that she is "one of us" (wrong or right). Actually W
had the same sort of appeal. Whether she or W or any of the other
cartoon characters are real people or just electrons in a machine is
irrelevant. The people identify with the character just like the kids
relate to Mighty Mouse, Mickey Mouse, or XiYangYang. Ideology is
bunk. Manipulation of the masses is the only thing that
matters.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=davegreen84@yahoo.com href="mailto:davegreen84@yahoo.com">David
Green</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=ewj@pigs.ag
href="mailto:ewj@pigs.ag">E.Wayne Johnson</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A
title=peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace Discuss</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, May 01, 2010 5:16
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Peace-discuss] ron paul -
we can do better with peace</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times, serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt">
<DIV>I think Paul Street and Anthony DiMaggio have done pretty well in
explaining that the Tea Party, as an organized phenomenon, is a Republican
creation</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><A
href="http://www.zcommunications.org/what-populist-uprising-part-ii-further-reflections-on-an-astroturf-movement-by-anthony-dimaggio">http://www.zcommunications.org/what-populist-uprising-part-ii-further-reflections-on-an-astroturf-movement-by-anthony-dimaggio</A></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>An analogy might be made to MoveOn and the Democrats.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>The purpose of both is to avoid the fundamental issues--war, the
economy, etc. There's a synergy--the Republican base gets aroused, and the
Democrats look left and point right--"See what you'd have if you didn't have
us?" </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>What problems I have with the Liberty message, I wouldn't lump it with
the TPers.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>DG<BR></DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT-FAMILY: times new roman, new york, times, serif; FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><BR>
<DIV
style="FONT-FAMILY: arial, helvetica, sans-serif; FONT-SIZE: 13px"><FONT
size=2 face=Tahoma>
<HR SIZE=1>
<B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">From:</SPAN></B> E.Wayne Johnson
<ewj@pigs.ag><BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B>
Stuart Levy <slevy@ncsa.uiuc.edu>; peace-discuss
<peace-discuss@anti-war.net><BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Fri, April 30, 2010 1:57:56
PM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re:
[Peace-discuss] ron paul - we can do better with peace<BR></FONT><BR>There
are a lot of what I would call "peripheral" issues that get mingled in
<BR>with the Tea Party/Liberty message,<BR>and it is too often at the
expense of the core issues. For me, the war has <BR>always been a core
issue, and the inability of the people to overcome the <BR>ruling class's
insistence on imperialism around the world is a major <BR>frustration with
the system.<BR><BR>We had invited Cindy Sheehan and Bill Kauffman to the
Liberty Fest but Cindy <BR>was unavailable and Bill had a family-based
commitment to keep after <BR>initially saying he would be there.<BR><BR>I
see the healthcare issue as being one of an undersupply of medical care
<BR>persons and an unreasonable "standard of care" that isnt really a
standard <BR>of care ideology but rather an ideology of greed. The US
doesnt make enough <BR>health care providers to meet the needs of its
population.<BR><BR>----- Original Message ----- <BR>From: "Stuart Levy"
<<A href="mailto:slevy@ncsa.uiuc.edu"
ymailto="mailto:slevy@ncsa.uiuc.edu">slevy@ncsa.uiuc.edu</A>><BR>To:
"E.Wayne Johnson" <<A href="mailto:ewj@pigs.ag"
ymailto="mailto:ewj@pigs.ag">ewj@pigs.ag</A>>; "peace-discuss" <BR><<A
href="mailto:peace-discuss@anti-war.net"
ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@anti-war.net">peace-discuss@anti-war.net</A>><BR>Sent:
Thursday, April 22, 2010 3:03 PM<BR>Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] ron paul -
we can do better with peace<BR><BR><BR>> On Thu, Apr 22, 2010 at
08:17:45AM +0800, E.Wayne Johnson wrote:<BR>>> interesting video clip
with some joker from Indiana and disturbing <BR>>> message and
response,<BR>>> followed by Ron Paul.<BR>>><BR>>> <A
href="http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2010/04/ron-paul-we-can-do-better-with-peace.html"
target=_blank>http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2010/04/ron-paul-we-can-do-better-with-peace.html</A><BR>><BR>>
Yes. "We stand with Israel", says Rep. Mike Pence of Muncie,
IN,<BR>> to resounding cheers. Ron Paul, talking about military
bases around the<BR>> world and other good stuff, got cheers too though
not so resounding.<BR>><BR>><BR>> Definitely not all, but a fair
part of Mike Shedlock's written commentary<BR>> on the above page could
have been heard at an AWARE meeting --<BR>> "The US cannot afford to
waste trillions of dollars keeping<BR>> troops in 140 countries around
the world." or "The reason '95% of the<BR>> Political Class support
Obama' over Ron Paul is the political class<BR>> in both parties
are mostly war mongers. Enough already!" or<BR>> "[T]he military
complex has a vested interest in perpetual war."<BR>> Encouraging to
see.<BR>><BR>> Also very interesting is the Rasmussen poll linked-to
from that page:<BR>> <BR>> <A
href="http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections2/election_2012/election_2012_barack_obama_42_ron_paul_41"
target=_blank>http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections2/election_2012/election_2012_barack_obama_42_ron_paul_41</A><BR>>
Don't just read the headline.<BR>><BR>> We read, for example, that
*almost a quarter* of likely US voters now<BR>> consider themselves part
of the Tea Party movement. That's a lot.<BR>><BR>> Of those,
almost all believe that Americans are overtaxed, and trust<BR>> the
opinions of the American people more than their political leaders.<BR>>
(Gary Trudeau said it: "We want to take our country back! -- From
who?<BR>> -- From the people we elected to lead us! Will you join
us?")<BR>><BR>> When Tea-Party-identified voters were asked about
a<BR>> hypothetical Republican-vs-Democrat (two-way) race for
President,<BR>> most said they'd vote Republican.<BR>><BR>> But if
the Tea Party were a party and ran in a hypothetical three-way<BR>>
Tea-Democrat-Republican presidential race, and asking *all* (not just
TP)<BR>> voters this time, the Democrat would win, but a Tea Party
candidate would<BR>> draw almost a fifth of (hypothetical)
votes.<BR>><BR>> Just over half of Republican voters say the average
Republican congressman<BR>> is *more liberal* than they are. Just
20% believe the average Republican<BR>> congressman is more conservative
than the average Republican voter.<BR>> That's a frightening
thought.<BR>><BR>> Of Republican voters, most (59%) think Sarah Palin
shares the values<BR>> of most Republican voters. 19% of all voters
think that Ron Paul<BR>> shares the values of most Republican voters (but
about half of all<BR>> voters weren't sure whether he did or
not).<BR>><BR>><BR>> So: if the Tea Party were a party and did run
a candidate,<BR>> would it prefer a Palin (or a Pence), or a
Paul?<BR>><BR>><BR>> Some questions would be easy. Little
need for social spending.<BR>> Equalizing inequality isn't something the
government should have<BR>> a role in, I expect they'd comfortably
agree.<BR>><BR>> No "amnesty" for "illegal" immigrants -- even though,
as one<BR>> immigration rights activist has pointed out, the history of
this<BR>> country is *all about* amnesty, about escaping the shackles of
the<BR>> past and heading freely into someplace new.<BR>><BR>> But,
what portion of the Tea Party's soul is anti-war and <BR>>
anti-imperialist?<BR>><BR>> At last fall's Liberty Fest (thanks,
Wayne!) I talked briefly with<BR>> the manager for IVAW member Adam
Kokesh's run for US Congress,<BR>> hoping to gauge how important the
anti-war message was for his campaign.<BR>> Even though I spoke
admiringly of his IVAW connection, and mentioned<BR>> being happy about
our Tim Johnson's turn against the war, it sounded as <BR>>
though<BR>> Kokesh's opposition to war was something they felt the New
Mexico campaign<BR>> had to downplay.<BR>><BR>> Altogether I heard
very little at that meeting about opposition to war<BR>> (though I did
miss the gubernatorial debate on the first day).<BR>> Some did raise it,
and not only the Green-party candidates,<BR>> but war and US empire
seemed low on the lists of most speakers I heard.<BR>><BR>> This
despite the fact that the $trillion we've spent, and trillions<BR>> we've
committed, in Iraq and Afghanistan, are at least comparable to the<BR>>
total cost (additional $1T over 10 years) of the health insurance
bill<BR>> that's been the object of so much of the Tea Partiers'
fury.<BR>><BR>> Where's the fury over our violent pursuit of power
around the world?<BR>> Was it there in the Tax Day tea parties, above the
level of whispers?<BR>><BR>> Stuart<BR>> <BR><BR><BR>--
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