<html><head><style type="text/css"><!-- DIV {margin:0px;} --></style></head><body><div style="font-family:times new roman,new york,times,serif;font-size:12pt">Hi David,<br><br>I think Rachel said that she wasn't writing from a position within the university, so I think it's unfair to continue to claim that she is still doing so. She stated that she isn't writing to represent the university, so I think to put the burden on her to defend the actions of others in the academic community is unfair. I also think it's unfair and in fact not representative of other feminists to claim that she represents all feminists and women on this campus.<br><br>I'm also speaking from a position of being a feminist, a student, and an anti-war activist. I've been involved in the anti-war movement since I came on this campus. While I understand your claim that there is a lack of events being organized in response to racism in local institutions and your frustration in having
confronted Dr. Pipes in the past, I also don't think we should let Dr. Pipes speak unchallenged. I don't understand what you say when you talk about an "academic exercise". I think your suggestion of a panel, though critical, is an intellectual exercise and is less effective if we don't invite academics to participate or attend. Could you clarify if this interpretation is incorrect, because I'd like to work with you on an intervention that addresses racism in this community.<br><br>I would also like to say that members of Campus Antiwar Network are going to be in attendance at this talk to challenge the claims of Dr. Pipes and other conservative folks in attendance. I understand and support what you say when you say that we should confront racism in our own backyard. However, I also think that to let Dr. Pipes speak unchallenged by progressive voices would only allow him to perpetuate myths about the "War" on Terror, myths I believe we should
confront.<br><br>Thank you for your thoughts and criticism. If you would like to continue this conversation, I propose we move it off the listserve because I'm not sure how this conversation relates to building the anti-war movement in this campus and community.<br><br>Best,<br>-Susan<br><div> </div>------<br>Radical Education for Autonomous Persons<br><span><a target="_blank" href="http://cuareading.blogspot.com/">http://cuareading.blogspot.com/</a></span><br><span><a target="_blank" href="http://wiki.infoshop.org/Anarchist_Neighborhood:Champaign-Urbana">http://wiki.infoshop.org/Anarchist_Neighborhood:Champaign-Urbana</a></span><br><span><a target="_blank" href="http://www.naasn.org/">http://www.naasn.org/</a></span><br><br><div>"Whatever doesn't kill power is killed by it."<div><br></div><div style="font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt"><br><div style="font-family:times new roman, new york, times,
serif;font-size:12pt"><font face="Tahoma" size="2"><hr size="1"><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> David Green <davegreen84@yahoo.com><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Rachel Storm <rstorm2@illinois.edu><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Cc:</span></b> Shantel Martinez <uiuc.martinez@gmail.com>; Jason C. Romero <jasoncromero@gmail.com>; hardcore@iresist.org; peace@anti-war.net; mister garza <mistergarza@gmail.com>; iaah-discussion-list@googlegroups.com; Brian Dolinar <briandolinar@gmail.com>; Peace Discuss <peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net>; Teresa Ramos <tramosuiuc@gmail.com><br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wed, October 13, 2010 3:15:42 PM<br><b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Peace] Fwd: Does the "War on Terror" Still Exist. Controversial Speaker at 7pm TONIGHT in Follinger Auditorium!!! PLEASE
ATTEND!!!<br></font><br>
<div style="font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt;"><div>Rachel, my conern, in case I wasn't clear, is about the contrast between the lack of any clear response to racism in our own backyard--Hillel, etc.--that has real consequences in relation to our wars; as opposed to the haste with which--for example--a demonstration is organized after the murder of Dr. Tiller. These characterizations say a lot about the meaning of "human rights" in the academic community, and among those whose job it is to "advocate" for such rights. It seems to me that when it comes to something like "human rights," we aren't or shouldn't be wearing different hats at work and in the community. That would seem to undermine the sincerity and effectiveness of the whole project. </div>
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<div>So Rachel, let's address the issue: when has the Women's Resource Center ever shown any concern for the women around the world who are having bombs dropped on them?</div>
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<div>As you may know, I recently commented on the military flyover and subsequent "U.S.A." chants at a football game. It was quite a masculine sounding chant, I must say, both literally and figuratively, meaning bellicosity-wise, and potentially violence-against-women-wise. Any word from the WRC about how young women sitting in the stands might feel about this? How such belliocse conformity among men might relate to violence against women? Do you really feel that women on this campus could possibly feel comfortable in speaking their minds against war, if they would be so inclined to want to do so?</div>
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<div>What is the WRC doing about it?</div>
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<div>Just asking.</div>
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<div>David<br></div>
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<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">From:</span></b> Rachel Storm <rstorm2@illinois.edu><br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">To:</span></b> David Green <davegreen84@yahoo.com><br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">Cc:</span></b> Jason C. Romero <jasoncromero@gmail.com>; Teresa Ramos <tramosuiuc@gmail.com>; Shantel Martinez <uiuc.martinez@gmail.com>; mister garza <mistergarza@gmail.com>; iaah-discussion-list@googlegroups.com; hardcore@iresist.org; peace@anti-war.net; Brian Dolinar <briandolinar@gmail.com>; Peace Discuss <peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net><br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wed, October 13, 2010 2:49:34 PM<br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: [Peace] Fwd: Does the "War on Terror" Still Exist. Controversial Speaker at 7pm TONIGHT in Follinger Auditorium!!! PLEASE ATTEND!!!<br></font><br>
<font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span style="BORDER-COLLAPSE:collapse;FONT-SIZE:13px;" class="Apple-style-span">I apologize for being careless and leaving my signature in my last e-mail. I was writing not in my position at the University, but rather as someone with individual concerns. I sent that e-mail quickly and carelessly and it wont happen again.</span><br></font><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Oct 13, 2010 at 2:32 PM, David Green <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:davegreen84@yahoo.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:davegreen84@yahoo.com">davegreen84@yahoo.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
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<div>Respectfully,</div>
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<div>I wouldn't want to discourage anyone from attending, out of curiosity, outrage, or whatever. But what can this accomplish?</div>
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<div>Here's how I feel. We have a quiescent campus in regard to Israel-Palestine, anti-Long War, and other related issues. We have an addled right-wing economics professor, Fred Gottheil, claiming to stand up for women and gays in the Muslim world in order to silence criticism of Israel (for those who don't know, this was reflected in an article and subsequent letters in the N-G; the DI has refused to publish a letter I sent regarding this affair, and has covered it in no other way). </div>
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<div>So what does the Women's Resource Center, etc., have to say about all of this? There has to be a better way than to simply react to the appearnce of Daniel Pipes.</div>
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<div>How about this? Let's document the violations to women's rights, gay rights, etc. in the Muslim world that pertain to our wars (and Israel's) against them. Put along side that, if you want, a concern with honor killings, suppression of gays, etc. Put along side that a concern with the murder of women in this country by their husbands. I mean, some context and perspective, if you want to make this about women, gays, or whomever (not that plain old men don't matter). Then let's think about a political analysis that makes some sense.</div>
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<div>Then how about getting a panel organized to address the various issues raised by Islamophobia, Zionism on campus, Gottheil, his targets, etc. Shouldn't be too hard to attract an audience. But please, don't make an academic exercise out of it. We might address the racism of the institutions supporting this event, especially Hillel. Are you up for it? Can you handle being called an anti-Semite? It carries a little more wallop than being called a radical feminist.</div>
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<div>For example, you might want to ask Matti Bunzl, the anthropologist (sic) who is head of the Program for Jewish Culture and Society, to talk about being a gay man and a Zionist, how that all works together in relation to human rights for Palestinians, etc., not to mention academic piety. Lots to talk about, hypocritically or otherwise.</div>
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<div>Or, we could just sit and fume at Daniel Pipes, as if this just started yesterday, when I've been talking about him for well over a decade, including before he visited here in 2003.</div>
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<div>David Green<br></div>
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<b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">From:</span></b> Rachel Storm <<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:rstorm2@illinois.edu" target="_blank" href="mailto:rstorm2@illinois.edu">rstorm2@illinois.edu</a>><br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">To:</span></b> Jason C. Romero <<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:jasoncromero@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:jasoncromero@gmail.com">jasoncromero@gmail.com</a>>; Teresa Ramos <<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:tramosuiuc@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:tramosuiuc@gmail.com">tramosuiuc@gmail.com</a>>; Shantel Martinez <<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:uiuc.martinez@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:uiuc.martinez@gmail.com">uiuc.martinez@gmail.com</a>>; mister garza <<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:mistergarza@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:mistergarza@gmail.com">mistergarza@gmail.com</a>>; <a rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:iaah-discussion-list@googlegroups.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:iaah-discussion-list@googlegroups.com">iaah-discussion-list@googlegroups.com</a>; <a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:hardcore@iresist.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:hardcore@iresist.org">hardcore@iresist.org</a>; <a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:peace@anti-war.net" target="_blank" href="mailto:peace@anti-war.net">peace@anti-war.net</a>; Brian Dolinar <<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:briandolinar@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:briandolinar@gmail.com">briandolinar@gmail.com</a>><br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wed, October 13, 2010 1:41:18 PM<br><b><span style="FONT-WEIGHT:bold;">Subject:</span></b> [Peace] Fwd: Does the "War on Terror" Still Exist. Controversial Speaker at 7pm TONIGHT in Follinger Auditorium!!! PLEASE ATTEND!!!<br></font>
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<div class="h5"><br><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">See below. I don't know much about Daniel Pipes, but <a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHmapCXl_Bo&feature=related">he's all over Youtube </a> and and well, <a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,95181,00.html">Fox News digs him</a>. Anyone want to attend?</font>
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<div class="gmail_quote">---------- Forwarded message ----------<br>From: <b class="gmail_sendername">Campus Antiwar Network [U of I]</b> <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" ymailto="mailto:can.uiuc@gmail.com" target="_blank" href="mailto:can.uiuc@gmail.com">can.uiuc@gmail.com</a>></span><br>Date: Wed, Oct 13, 2010 at 1:23 PM<br>Subject: Does the "War on Terror" Still Exist. Controversial Speaker at 7pm TONIGHT in Follinger Auditorium!!! PLEASE ATTEND!!!<br>To: <br><br><br>Hello all. I just was made aware of this event. Dr. Daniel Pipes is being brought here to give a talk tonight at 7pm in Follinger. It is being cosponsored by Hillel, the Åmerican-Israeli Coalition, and other Pro-Israel, Islamophobic groups. Following is more information. Please join us in making sure the hatred and Islamophobic sentiments that will be spread tonight is not welcome on our campus!!!<br><br>
<div>The event is on the Hillel calendar, and also has a Facebook page, on which it says this:</div>
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<div>"Does the "War on Terror" still exist? Dr. Daniel Pipes, Middle East scholar, author, and lecturer, will address this question, and shed light on a tumultuous struggle which extends from distant deserts to academic halls, from the sheep farm to the metropolis. You won't want to miss this amazing opportunity to hear Dr. Pipes' message, and ask him your questions directly!<br><br>Dr. Pipes studies, writes, and lectures nationwide on the <span>...</span><span>conflict between radical Islam and the West. He knows Arabic, and has his doctorate in medieval Islamic history; his studies have led him to conclude that "It's a mistake to blame Islam, a religion 14 centuries old, for the evil that should be ascribed to militant Islam, a totalitarian ideology less than a century old. Militant Islam is the problem, but moderate Islam is the solution." He has taught world history at the University of Chicago, history at Harvard, and policy strategy at the Naval
War College, in addition to directing the Foreign Policy Research Institute serving at the U.S. Institute of Peace. Today he directs the thinktank he founded, the Middle East Forum, and oversees Campus Watch, a project that critiques academic literature published by North American Middle East departments. His personal website is at <a rel="nofollow" target="_blank" href="http://www.danielpipes.org/"><font color="#3b5998">www.DanielPipes.org</font></a>.<br><br>This event is cosponsored by Stand With Us, the David Project, the Jewish Community Relations Council, the Hillel Foundation at the University of Illinois, the Chabad Jewish Center at the University of Illinois & Champaign-Urbana, the American-Israeli Student Coalition, Great News Radio (WGNN/WGNJ), the Orange and Blue Observer, and the Illini Conservative Union."</span></div>
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<p><span>Certainly, speakers and organizations like this are promoting hate and Islamophobia. Hillel should be taken to task for this, let's make that clear. Nevertheless, I'm not at all sure what response is merited to what will most likely--in this era--be a poorly attended event.</span></p><br clear="all"><font color="#888888"><br>-- <br>University of Illinois Campus Antiwar Network<br><span><a target="_blank" href="http://www.campusantiwar.net/">http://www.campusantiwar.net/</a></span><br><span><a target="_blank" href="http://uiuccan.blogspot.com/">http://uiuccan.blogspot.com/</a></span><br></font></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><font face="'times new roman', serif"><i><font color="#000099">
<div><font face="'times new roman', serif"><i><font color="#000099">_____________________________________________</font></i></font></div><span style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);">Kind regards,</span><br style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);"><br style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);FONT-SIZE:large;"><b>Rachel Storm </b></span><br style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);">Program Coordinator, Illinois Women's Resources Center</span><br style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);">The Women's Resources Center, University of Illinois</span></font></i></font><font face="garamond, serif"><font face="'times new
roman', serif"><i><font color="#3366ff"><font style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);" color="#000099"><br>Student Affairs--Office of Inclusion and Intercultural Relations<br>703 S. Wright Street, Champaign, IL 61820<br>MC-302<br>(217) 333-3137 (office phone)<br>(217) 244-3167 (fax)<br>(630) 677-7219 (cell)<br><br><br><span style="COLOR:rgb(255,204,102);">"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." -Groucho Marx</span></font></font></i></font></font><br><br><br><br><br><br></div></div></div></div></div></div><br></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><font face="'times new roman', serif"><i><font color="#000099">
<div><font face="'times new roman', serif"><i><font color="#000099">_____________________________________________</font></i></font></div><span style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);">Kind regards,</span><br style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);"><br style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);FONT-SIZE:large;"><b>Rachel Storm </b></span><br style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);">Program Coordinator, Illinois Women's Resources Center</span><br style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);"><span style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);">The Women's Resources Center, University of Illinois</span></font></i></font><font face="garamond, serif"><font face="'times new
roman', serif"><i><font color="#3366ff"><font style="FONT-FAMILY:times new roman, serif;COLOR:rgb(102,102,204);" color="#000099"><br>Student Affairs--Office of Inclusion and Intercultural Relations<br>703 S. Wright Street, Champaign, IL 61820<br>MC-302<br>(217) 333-3137 (office phone)<br>(217) 244-3167 (fax)<br>(630) 677-7219 (cell)<br><br><br><span style="COLOR:rgb(255,204,102);">"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read." -Groucho Marx</span></font></font></i></font></font><br><br><br><br><br><br>
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