I tend to agree with Robert at this point. Well, actually at the point where the actual proposal was pointed out to me. I think this is the best of the 3 proposals that were on the table early in the year in that it would be harder to gerrymander. <div>
<br></div><div>I'm still interested in what Carol might say.</div><div><br></div><div>-karen medina<br><div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 12:49 PM, Robert Naiman <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:naiman@justforeignpolicy.org">naiman@justforeignpolicy.org</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div class="im">On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 12:27 PM, Jenifer Cartwright <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:jencart13@yahoo.com" target="_blank">jencart13@yahoo.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
</div><div class="im"><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top" style="font:inherit">I'm still confused -- If more districts are added, can we be sure those won't be gerrymandered to advantage the advantaged? </td>
</tr></tbody></table></blockquote><div><br></div></div><div>You can't be "sure," but the smaller the districts are, the harder they are to gerrymander, so, "all other things being equal," the concern stated indicates that one should support smaller districts.</div>
<div class="im">
<div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top" style="font:inherit">And if there are fewer reps from ea district, it again seems that the advantaged will be advantaged. <div>
</div></td></tr></tbody></table></blockquote><div><br></div></div><div>Why? In my experience, it's the opposite. In some of the more conservative, Republican, rural areas, it's hard to field 3 vigorous progressive candidates. Maybe you find one or two progressive people who are willing to run. The other side runs as a slate. So, it's one against three or two against three; moreover, your people go into the poll, it says "vote for three," and some of your people vote for you and one or two of the people you're running against, resulting in a net zero vote for you if that happens to include the lowest vote-getter of the opposing slate. All of this makes it hard for dissident voices to break in with 3 member districts.</div>
<div class="im">
<div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top" style="font:inherit"><div>On the other hand, 22 vs 27 members would be more efficient when it comes to making decisions and getting things done, all things being equal. But ARE they equal?? Bambi's pro and Carol's anti, if those are still their stands, makes it a no for me.</div>
<div> --Jenifer</div></td></tr></tbody></table></blockquote><div><br></div></div><div>I'm not a fan of Bambi, but the claim that he supports this proposal is no argument.</div><div><div></div><div class="h5"><div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<table cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0" border="0"><tbody><tr><td valign="top" style="font:inherit"><div><br><div>--- On <b>Tue, 11/2/10, Robert Naiman <i><<a href="mailto:naiman@justforeignpolicy.org" target="_blank">naiman@justforeignpolicy.org</a>></i></b> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="border-left:2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255);margin-left:5px;padding-left:5px"><br>From: Robert Naiman <<a href="mailto:naiman@justforeignpolicy.org" target="_blank">naiman@justforeignpolicy.org</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] reduction in size of the Champaign County Board?<br>To:
"Karen Medina" <<a href="mailto:kmedina67@gmail.com" target="_blank">kmedina67@gmail.com</a>><br>Cc: "Peace-discuss List" <<a href="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>><br>
Date: Tuesday, November 2, 2010, 12:08 PM<div><div></div><div><br><br><div>Here is the exact question which appears on the ballot:<br><br><a href="http://champaigncountyclerk.com/elections/docs/2010/11_02_2010_Full_Specimen.pdf" target="_blank">http://champaigncountyclerk.com/elections/docs/2010/11_02_2010_Full_Specimen.pdf</a><br>
<br>"Size of Champaign County Board<br><br>Shall the CHAMPAIGN COUNTY BOARD SIZE BE REDUCED from 27 MEMBERS<br>elected from nine multi-member districts with 3 members elected from<br>each district, to 22 MEMBERS elected from eleven multi-member<br>
districts with 2 members elected from each district?"<br><br>So, assuming that what we are voting on is the question that actually<br>appears on the ballot, the argument for not diluting poor and minority<br>representation would appear to support the proposal. If you
increase<br>the number of districts, the resulting districts will be smaller, and<br>all other things being equal, poor and minority voters will be less<br>diluted in their representation.<br><br>I'm not familiar with the recent history that led to this proposal,<br>
but I can tell you that based on my experience as a County Board<br>member from 1992-6, I definitely thought that the size of the County<br>Board should be reduced, because my experience was that the size of<br>the Board made it hard to organize other County Board members, with<br>
the result that most of the time the Board was a rubber stamp for the<br>staff and the Board Chair.<br><br><br><br>On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 10:42 AM, Karen Medina <<a href="http://mc/compose?to=kmedina67@gmail.com" target="_blank">kmedina67@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> Can someone comment on the issue of the reduction in size of the<br>> Champaign County Board?<br>> The following is what I
understand of the situation.<br>><br>>> why would certain groups get no representation?<br>><br>> Diluted representation. i.e. the poor and minorities would be diluted<br>> by being mixed with rich white people and having fewer seats to fill.<br>
> Right now the poor have enough of a say that a representative can get<br>> on the board. With fewer seats to fill, there is an easier chance that<br>> one of the removed chairs would be the voice of the poor.<br>
><br>>> they're moving from 9 districts to 11, right?<br>> Not necessarily. I think there are 3 proposals on the table of how<br>> they would move from 27 to 17 board members.<br>><br>> The current situation is 9 districts with 3 reps from each.<br>
><br>> In May, 2010, there were 3 proposals:<br>> 17 members, 17 single-member districts<br>> 18 members, from 9 multi-member districts<br>> 22 members, from 11 multi-member
districts<br>><br>> I'm still looking for more information on this.<br>> John Bambanic is for the reduction of county board members.<br>> Carol Ammons is against (I think). and I think Jan Anderson was<br>
> against (I think).<br>> But I have not talked to either of these women recently on the issue.<br>> _______________________________________________<br>> Peace-discuss mailing list<br>> <a href="http://mc/compose?to=Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a><br>
> <a href="http://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss" target="_blank">http://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss</a><br>><br><br><br><br>-- <br>Robert Naiman<br>Policy Director<br>Just Foreign Policy<br>
<a href="http://www.justforeignpolicy.org" target="_blank">www.justforeignpolicy.org</a><br><a href="http://mc/compose?to=naiman@justforeignpolicy.org" target="_blank">naiman@justforeignpolicy.org</a><br><br>Urge Congress to Support a Timetable for Military Withdrawal from Afghanistan<br>
<a href="http://www.justforeignpolicy.org/act/feingold-mcgovern" target="_blank">http://www.justforeignpolicy.org/act/feingold-mcgovern</a><br>_______________________________________________<br>Peace-discuss mailing list<br>
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<br></blockquote></div></div></div><div><div></div><div class="h5"><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Robert Naiman<br>Policy Director<br>Just Foreign Policy<br><a href="http://www.justforeignpolicy.org" target="_blank">www.justforeignpolicy.org</a><br>
<a href="mailto:naiman@justforeignpolicy.org" target="_blank">naiman@justforeignpolicy.org</a><br>
<br>Urge Congress to Support a Timetable for Military Withdrawal from Afghanistan<br><a href="http://www.justforeignpolicy.org/act/feingold-mcgovern" target="_blank">http://www.justforeignpolicy.org/act/feingold-mcgovern</a><br>
<br> <br>
</div></div></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>karen medina<br><~~~~~~~~~~~~~><br>"In this universe, we are given two gifts: the ability to love, and the ability to ask questions." (Mary Oliver, American poet)<br>
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