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I have tonnes of respect for Chomsky.<br>
<br>
I had read this before including the part about "navi" ( איבנ)<br>
being poorly translated as "prophet". <br>
<br>
It doesn't seem to be all that difficult to me. To prophesy is nava אבנ<br>
and one who speaks under divine inspiration is איבנ navi.<br>
<br>
I dont really think it is the same thing as intellect but it's<br>
not anti-intellectual exactly. It's speaking under divine influence<br>
directly or from revelation knowledge. There are a few modern day<br>
prophets around today (many evangelicals deny this vehemently).<br>
<br>
One well-known example most would agree about would be MLK jr.<br>
<br>
King Saul hung out with the prophets navi'im and got close enough to<br>
the influence of the divine spirit that he prophesied nava too.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 11/28/12 11:58, Carl G. Estabrook wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:DF8BA95C-EEF4-43FB-AF3D-D290A04CF12B@illinois.edu"
type="cite">
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Nov. 12, 2010: <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/50260/qa-noam-chomsky">http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-news-and-politics/50260/qa-noam-chomsky</a>>.
<div><br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 9:47 PM, "Brussel, Morton K" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu">brussel@illinois.edu</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
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<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">
What is the date of the Chomsky quotes?
<div><br>
</div>
<div>--mkb</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 8:17 PM, Carl G. Estabrook wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">It would be interesting to
see what the Israeli government would do if the US were to
withdraw military, economic, ideological, and diplomatic support.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Perhaps they'd be forced to make some regional arrangement
with their neighbors.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Chomsky has noted that their "threat to 'go crazy'
('nishtagea') – that is, launch a tough response – is deeply rooted,
stretching back to the Labor governments of the 1950s, along with the
related 'Samson Complex': 'If crossed, we will bring down the Temple
walls around us.'"</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>But the government that we're responsible for is in
Washington, and that's the one we and other US citizens can influence
directly, as we did during Vietnam.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Chomsky said recently - correctly, it seems to me - </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>"Part of American national culture is that we don’t look at
ourselves. In fact if you look at what I write about Israel, it’s
overwhelmingly about the United States. It’s about U.S. support for the
Israelis, not what Israel does. What Israel does is not nice, but no
state is nice.</div>
<br>
"But it’s quite different for us. We don’t support killings in the
eastern Congo. Or Chinese repression of dissidents. But
we’re completely responsible for what Israel does. Israel isn’t
entirely an American satellite, but pretty close to it. They couldn’t
do what they’re doing if it weren’t for the decisive support of the
United States...<br>
<br>
"The United States destroyed Iraq. Of course that should be
harshly condemned. In fact I do it much more than I talk about Israel.
In the case of the Vietnam war, we basically destroyed three countries.
They’ll never recover. Same with Nicaragua. Same with Cuba. Go on and
on. Same with Chile. That’s what we ought to be concentrating on.
Israel happens to be a subcase of a larger problem."
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It's the "larger problem" that AWARE should primarily be
concerned with. It certainly shouldn't accept the administration's
invitation to look away from what the US has done and is doing. <br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 6:42 PM, "Brussel, Morton K" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu">brussel@illinois.edu</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">The Israeli designs on a
"Greater Israel" do not depend on the U.S.. That is a major ingredient
behind Israeli aggression and repression of the Palestinians. Israel,
with its Zionist ideology, will continue its repression. The U.S. is
not likely to interfere, perhaps unable to interfere, even if it
reduces its support. Yes, you are deflecting criticism of Israeli
actions by this one-sided position. As I've stated, both issues need
to be emphasized.
<div><br>
<div> --mkb </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 6:13 PM, Carl G. Estabrook wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">
<div>It's hardly excusing Israeli actions/aggression to point
out that those crimes would be impossible without US support. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>And that's what Americans need to know.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Israeli crimes are different in that regard from, say,
crimes by China, Russia, or France. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 5:41 PM, "Brussel, Morton K" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu">brussel@illinois.edu</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">Are you excusing
Israeli actions/aggression? Should not U.S. citizens be so informed? I
find this reply hollow.
<div>--mkb</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 5:23 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">We're writing a flyer
for US - not Israeli - citizens.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>"The fundamental issue is quite simple: Every U.S.
taxpayer is responsible for Israeli crimes. They can’t carry them out
without the decisive military, economic, ideological, and
diplomatic support of the United States" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.zcommunications.org/q-and-a-with-noam-chomsky-by-noam-chomsky">http://www.zcommunications.org/q-and-a-with-noam-chomsky-by-noam-chomsky</a>>.
<br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 4:13 PM, "Brussel, Morton K" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu">brussel@illinois.edu</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">What is obvious is
that Carl's preferences lie with Ron Paul's piece, which exclusively
emphasizes U.S. responsibility/culpability. Cole's piece exclusively
emphasizes Israel's responsibility/culpability.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Both should be emphasized. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>--mkb</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 3:44 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">If we're looking
for a primer on Israel/Gaza, I almost think this would be better:
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/11/27/how-to-end-the-gaza-tragedy/">http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/11/27/how-to-end-the-gaza-tragedy/</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div>On Nov 27, 2012, at 8:35 AM, Stuart Levy <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:stuartnlevy@gmail.com">stuartnlevy@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">At AWARE on
Sunday we talked about having a flyer for this Saturday's demonstration
which talked about Israel/Palestine.<br>
<br>
Carl had found a good one from Max Ajl, but here's another, from <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.juancole.com/2012/11/top-ten-myths-about-israeli-attack-on-gaza.html">
Juan Cole on 11/17</a>, which may be a better introduction to people
who haven't been paying close attention to the subject. (See the
original article too - there's an interesting map summarizing
Palestinian refugee migrations.)<br>
<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.juancole.com/2012/11/top-ten-myths-about-israeli-attack-on-gaza.html">http://www.juancole.com/2012/11/top-ten-myths-about-israeli-attack-on-gaza.html</a><br>
<br>
<b>Top Ten Myths about Israeli Attack on Gaza</b><br>
<br>
Posted on 11/17/2012 by Juan<br>
<br>
1. Israeli hawks represent themselves as engaged in a ‘peace process’
with the Palestinians in which Hamas refuses to join. In fact, Israel
has refused to cease colonizing and stealing Palestinian land long
enough to engage in fruitful negotiations with them.
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/06/us-palestinians-israel-settlements-idUSBRE8A50I820121106?feedType=RSS&feedName=topNews">Tel
Aviv routinely announces new, unilateral house-building on the
Palestinian West Bank</a>. There is no peace process. It is an Israeli
and American sham. Talking about a peace process is giving cover to
Israeli nationalists who are determined to grab everything the
Palestinians have and reduce them to penniless refugees (again).<br>
<br>
2. Actions such as the assault on Gaza can achieve no genuine long-term
strategic purpose. They are being launched to ensure that
Jewish-Israelis are the first to exploit key resources. Rattling sabers
at the Palestinians creates a pretext for further land-grabs and
colonies on Palestinian land. That is, the military action against the
people of Gaza is a diversion tactic;
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.lrb.co.uk/blog/2012/11/16/john-mearsheimer/a-pillar-built-on-sand/">the
real goal is Greater Israel, an assertion of Israeli sovereignty</a>
over all the territory once held by the British Mandate of Palestine.<br>
<br>
3. Israeli hawks represent their war of aggression as in
‘self-defense.’ But the UK Israeli chief rabbi admitted on camera that
that
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/nov/16/bbc-apologises-chief-rabbi-jonathan-sacks-gaza">the
Gaza attack actually ‘had something to do with Iran.’</a><br>
<br>
4. Israeli hawks demonize the Palestinians of Gaza as “bad neighbors”
who don’t accept Israel. But 40% of the people in Gaza are refugees,
mostly living in refugee camps, from families in pre-1948 Palestine
that had lived there for millennia.<br>
<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://suite101.com/article/gaza-refugee-camps-1948-present-a211374">They
were expelled from what is now Israel in the 1948 Zionist ethnic
cleansing campaign</a>. Israelis are now living in their homes and
farming their land, and they were never paid any reparations for the
crimes done to them. <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.fmreview.org/FMRpdfs/FMR26/FMR2624.pdf">
[pdf] “Israel’s failure to provide reparations to Palestinian refugees
over the past six decades is in blatant violation of international law.”</a>
Israel does not accept Palestine’s right to exist, even though it is
constantly demanding that everyone, including the displaced and
occupied Palestinians, recognize Israel’s right to exist.<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
5. Israeli hawks and their American clones depict Gaza as a foreign,
hostile state with which Israel is at war. In fact,
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=9&ved=0CG8QFjAI&url=https%3A%2F%2Fopenaccess.leidenuniv.nl%2Fbitstream%2F1887%2F13159%2F2%2FWhat%2BConstitutes%2BOccupation.pdf&ei=KDenUNOoMM6EygHbwYHYAQ&usg=AFQjCNFEJ_8IvIn6alResmt0iVO6Q-hFrg&sig2=IaQzbH1IV5V3KlnaR9F5Jw&cad=rja">the
Gaza strip is a small territory of 1.7 million people militarily
occupied by Israel</a> (something in which the UN and other
international bodies concur). Israelis do not allow it to have a port
or airport, nor to export most of what it produces. Palestinians cannot
work about a third of its land, which is reserved by Israel as a
security buffer. As an occupied territory, it is covered by the Hague
Regulations of 1907 and the Fourth Geneva Convention of 1949 on the
treatment of occupied populations by their military occupier.
Indiscriminate bombing of occupied territories by the occupier is
clearly illegal in international law.<br>
<br>
6. Israeli hawks see themselves as innocent victims of bewildering
Palestinian rage from Gaza. But Israel not only has kept Palestinians
of Gaza in the world’s largest outdoor penitentiary, they have them
under
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.juancole.com/2012/10/creepy-israeli-planning-for-palestinian-food-insecurity-in-gaza-revealed.html">an
illegal blockade</a> that for some years aimed at limiting their
nutrition without altogether starving them to death. I wrote earlier:<br>
<br>
“The <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.ibtimes.com/israels-blockade-gaza-puts-palestinian-childrens-health-risk-report-702821">
food blockade had real effects. About ten percent of Palestinian
children in Gaza under 5</a> have had their growth stunted by
malnutrition. A recent
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.map-uk.org/files/1052_gaza_health_report_web_version.pdf">report
[pdf] by Save the Children and Medical Aid for Palestinians found that</a>,
in addition, anemia is widespread, affecting over two-thirds of
infants, 58.6 percent of schoolchildren, and over a third of pregnant
mothers. “<br>
<br>
If any foreign power surrounded Israel, destroyed Haifa port and Tel
Aviv airport, and prevented Israeli exports from being exported, what
do you think Israelis would do? Oh, that’s right, it is rude to see
both Palestinians and Israelis as equal human beings.<br>
<br>
7. Israeli hawks demonize the Palestinian residents of Gaza as
followers of Hamas, a party-militia of the Muslim religious right. But
half of Palestinians in Gaza are minors, who never voted for Hamas and
cannot be held collectively responsible for that party.<br>
<br>
8. Israeli hawks justify their aggression on the Palestinians on
grounds of self-defense. But Israel is a country of 7.5 million people
with tanks, armored vehicles, artillery, helicopter gunships and F-16s
and F-18s, plus 400 nuclear warheads. Gaza is a small occupied
territory of 1.7 million which has no heavy weaponry, just some old
guns and some largely ineffectual rockets. (Israelis cite hundreds of
rockets fired into Israel from Gaza in 2012; but until Israel’s recent
attack they had killed not a single Israeli, though they did wound a
few last March when fighting between Palestinians and Israelis
escalated.) Gaza is a threat to Israel the way the Transkei Bantustan
was a threat to Apartheid South Africa. As for genuine asymmetrical
threats from Gaza to Israel, they could be dealt with by giving the
Palestinians a state and ceasing the blockade imposed on them, or in
the worst case scenario counter-terrorism targeted at terrorists rather
than indiscriminate bombing campaigns.<br>
<br>
9. Israeli hawks maintain that they were provoked into the attack. <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/israeli-peace-activist-hamas-leader-jabari-killed-amid-talks-on-long-term-truce.premium-1.478085">
But actually Ahmad Jabari, the Hamas leader the Israelis assassinated
earlier this week, had been engaged in talks with the Israelis about a
truce</a>. Assassinations achieved by the ruse of openness to peace
talks are guarantees of no further peace talks.<br>
<br>
10. Although most American media is a cheering section for the Likud
Party, <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://www.lrb.co.uk/blog/2012/11/16/john-mearsheimer/a-pillar-built-on-sand/">
in fact the world is increasingly done out with Israel’s aggressiveness</a>.
Boycotts and sanctions will likely grow over time, leaving Israeli
hawks with a deficit…<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
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