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David, er, "Plague",<br>
<br>
I think this outburst was in response to your rejection of <br>
his offer to be stalked by you.<br>
<br>
Now that you mention it, he does seem a bit Hoosier-ish.<br>
<br>
wj<br>
<br>
On 08/29/13 9:15, Gregg Gordon wrote:
<blockquote
cite="mid:1377738957.26765.YahooMailNeo@web120702.mail.ne1.yahoo.com"
type="cite">
<div
style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;">
<div>Thank you. I forgot plague. Also Harpies. And Les Mouches.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div dir="ltr">
<hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> <b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> David Johnson
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net"><davidjohnson1451@comcast.net></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Peace-discuss
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"><peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net></a>; Gregg Gordon
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com"><ggregg79@yahoo.com></a> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday,
August 28, 2013 7:25 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day<br>
</font> </div>
<div class="y_msg_container"><br>
<div id="yiv16613542">
<div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">WOW !</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">How interesting that your outburst of hate
was a result of me asking you if you are involved in the community !</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div>:" I've been to your meetings."</div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial"><b>Which meetings are you talking about ?</b></font></div>
<div> </div>
<div> " I've seen your tv show. Alex Jones without the
entertainment "</div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Alex Jones ?? How interesting.</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">What would you say that Alex Jones and I
have in common as far as program content ?</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">I would be REALLY curious to know.</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div>" Am I now or have I ever been a communist? "</div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">I don't know, are you ?</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Or are you implying ( again ) that I am a
Communist instead of a racist....</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Make up your mind !</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">The answer is no, but I have been called
worse.</font></b> </div>
<div> </div>
<div>"You're a virus. You're cancer. You're death to anything
you've ever been involved with. If you think I would expose my friends
to that, add insane to virus</div>
<div>and cancer ".<br>
</div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Is that the best ( worse ) you can say
about me ?</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Again nothing specific from you.</font></b></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
<span></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span>"Man,
you so missed your chance at civility. You want respect? You're a
loose tooth. You're a canker sore. You're a barnacle, but not so
easily gotten rid of. You're dog shit on my shoe."</span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span></span> </div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><font
face="Arial"><b>In general, it seems I hit some nerve that set you off.</b></font></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">As I stated in my last e-mail, I ( nor anyone else on
this list ) ; cursed you ar disrespected you. </font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">If you think I was not being civil just becasue i
disagreed with you about something, I truely don't know what to tell
you, except that sometimes the truth hurts.</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">But you shouldn't feel that way...the truth can set you
free.</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span></span> </div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">Obviously there is more to this than the initial e-mail
exchange on peace discuss.</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">And funny how I have never seen you post to Peace Discuss
prior, nor have I ever heard of you before, and except for a
few encounters with C-U Occupy , nobody I know who is involved in the
community in regards to social activism has ever heard of you.</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">So what type of editing and writting do you do ?</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">Where do you work ?</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">Are you originally from Bloomington Indiana or did you
just go to school there ?</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span></span> </div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">David Johnson</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span><b><font
face="Arial">aka. The Plague</font></b></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span></span> </div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span></span> </div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-left: 5px; padding-right: 0px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;"
dir="ltr">
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;">-----
Original Message ----- </div>
<div
style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none; -moz-background-clip: border; -moz-background-origin: padding; -moz-background-inline-policy: continuous;"><b>From:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" title="ggregg79@yahoo.com"
ymailto="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com" target="_blank"
href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com">Gregg Gordon</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>To:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="davidjohnson1451@comcast.net"
ymailto="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net">David Johnson</a> ; <a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"
ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Sent:</b>
Wednesday, August 28, 2013 6:16 PM</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div><span>"Respectfully" Really? Who am I talking to? A
3-year-old? No, I've known 3-year-olds. They're more convincing.</span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
<span></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span>Are
you insincere, or just obtuse? You tell me. The only thing more
transparent than your insincerity is your ineffectiveness. I've been
to your meetings. My one word description -- LONELY. I've seen your
tv show. Alex Jones without the entertainment. My God, you're a
joke. Am I now or have I ever been a communist? Are you serious? Why
would I tell you? You're a virus. You're cancer. You're death to
anything you've ever been involved with. If you think I would expose
my friends to that, add insane to virus and cancer.<br>
</span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
<span></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span>Man,
you so missed your chance at civility. You want respect? You're a
loose tooth. You're a canker sore. You're a barnacle, but not so
easily gotten rid of. You're dog shit on my shoe.</span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
<span></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span>I'm
out of your sandbox now. It's all yours.<br>
</span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div dir="ltr">
<hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"><b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> David Johnson
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net"><davidjohnson1451@comcast.net></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Peace-discuss
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"><peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net></a>; Gregg Gordon
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com"><ggregg79@yahoo.com></a> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday,
August 28, 2013 5:05 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day<br>
</font></div>
<div class="yiv16613542y_msg_container"><br>
<div id="yiv16613542">
<div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Calm down Greg,</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">I could say something smart ass like </font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">" your not my type ",</font></b></div>
<div><font face="Arial"><b> but seriously, I was just curious to
see if you are involved in the community or not </b></font><font
face="Times New Roman">.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial"><b>No need to be so paranoid just becasue
we may disagree on something.</b></font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">David Johnson</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Times New Roman">----- Original Message ----- </font></div>
<blockquote
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-left: 5px; padding-right: 0px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;"
dir="ltr">
<div
style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none; -moz-background-clip: border; -moz-background-origin: padding; -moz-background-inline-policy: continuous;"><b>From:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="ggregg79@yahoo.com" ymailto="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com"
target="_blank" href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com">Gregg Gordon</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>To:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="davidjohnson1451@comcast.net"
ymailto="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net">David Johnson</a> ; <a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"
ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Sent:</b>
Wednesday, August 28, 2013 12:27 PM</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">Why?
Do you want to stalk me?<br>
<div><span><br>
</span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div dir="ltr">
<hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"><b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> David Johnson <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net">davidjohnson1451@comcast.net</a>><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> Peace-discuss
<<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>>;
Gregg Gordon <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com" target="_blank"
href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com">ggregg79@yahoo.com</a>> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday,
August 28, 2013 10:33 AM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day<br>
</font></div>
<div class="yiv16613542y_msg_container"><br>
<div id="yiv16613542">
<div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Well Greg,</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">I am truely sorry that you feel that
way.</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Discussion / debate are at
times necessary for understanding.</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">No one threatened you or cursed at you
or disrespected you, so I am not certain what you mean when you stated
that " Its' impossible to have a peaceful discussion about peace .."</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Some of us stated our views and wanted
clarification of some of your statements, so I really do not understand
why you feel the way you do.</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">What organizations are you involved
with locally ?</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Respectfully</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">David Johnson</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-left: 5px; padding-right: 0px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;">
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;">-----
Original Message ----- </div>
<div
style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none; -moz-background-clip: border; -moz-background-origin: padding; -moz-background-inline-policy: continuous;"><b>From:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="ggregg79@yahoo.com" ymailto="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com"
target="_blank" href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com">Gregg Gordon</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>To:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="galliher@illinois.edu" ymailto="mailto:galliher@illinois.edu"
target="_blank" href="mailto:galliher@illinois.edu">Carl G. Estabrook</a>
; <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" title="brussel@illinois.edu"
ymailto="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu" target="_blank"
href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu">Brussel, Morton K</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Cc:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"
ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Sent:</b>
Wednesday, August 28, 2013 9:54 AM</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">Well,
I see it's impossible to have a peaceful discussion about peace, even
on Peace-discuss. That's a shame. It's not just the unnecessary and
uncalled for hostility, unpleasant but manageable. But you won't even
argue with me. You put words in my mouth that I never said, and then
you argue with that. That's pointless.<br>
<br>
But you've made your points, and you've made mine as well. When you
might have convinced me, instead you alienated me. I don't know in what
school of activism you learned that tactic, but I question its
effectiveness. All you succeeded in doing is in making me marvel at
the lack of mental discipline required to obtain a Ph.D.<br>
<br>
As to the other questions hanging out there, there are any number of
websites you can go to -- freerepublic.com, redstate.com. I find the
stuff too sickening to quote myself, but you'll see that you fit right
in. And yes, I do belong to some groups here. I would probably belong
to yours, if only you weren't in it.<br>
<div><span><br>
</span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div dir="ltr">
<hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"><b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> Carl G. Estabrook
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:galliher@illinois.edu"><galliher@illinois.edu></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> "Brussel,
Morton K" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu"><brussel@illinois.edu></a> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Cc:</span></b> Gregg Gordon
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com"><ggregg79@yahoo.com></a>; Peace-discuss
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"><peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net></a> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Tuesday,
August 27, 2013 9:47 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day<br>
</font></div>
<div class="yiv16613542y_msg_container"><br>
<div id="yiv16613542">
<div>I've thought for a while that the fall-back position of
American liberalism, as it surrendered to the neoliberal onslaught, was
a sort of hysterical anti-racism.<br>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Walter Benn Michaels argued for something like that in his
"The Trouble with Diversity: How We Learned to Love Identity and Ignore
Inequality" (2005).</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>He refined the argument in subsequent articles. "...Well,
I wrote the book four or five years ago and I know more about it now
than I did then. So yeah, that’s true, the book is in a certain sense a
response to what seemed to me very visible on the surface, but I had
much less of a sense of how that situation came about. One of the
things that’s been useful—I know it’s been useful for me, but I think
it’s actually be useful in general for at least some people on the Left
in thinking about these issues—has been the popularization of the
concept of neoliberalism, which has given us a better ability to
periodize the history of capitalism and especially of events since
World War II." - [See more at: <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
href="http://jacobinmag.com/2011/01/let-them-eat-diversity/#sthash.ArGHlaip.dpuf">http://jacobinmag.com/2011/01/let-them-eat-diversity/#sthash.ArGHlaip.dpuf</a>>]</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Mr. Gordon is not untypical. --CGE</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>On Aug 27, 2013, at 9:36 PM, "Brussel, Morton K" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu" target="_blank"
href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu">brussel@illinois.edu</a>> wrote:</div>
<br class="yiv16613542Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div style="word-wrap: break-word;">From someone who is on
this anti-war, anti-imperialist list, this argument is sick!! I.e.,
that one should not slam the current despicable president because he is
black (somewhat).
<div><br>
</div>
<div>--mkb<br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Aug 27, 2013, at 5:34 PM, Gregg Gordon wrote:</div>
<br class="yiv16613542Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div
style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span>Well, not exactly the reasoned responses that
might lead to a meeting of the minds that I was hoping for, but as
Lincoln said, "We must use the tools we have." At least it allows me
to be brief.</span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
<span></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span>No,
I was not trying to imply that, and I did not imply that. My purpose
was not to discuss Obama's policies, foreign or domestic, or what
constitutional amendments our (in other contexts) racist Founding
Fathers left us he may or may not have violated. That's another
discussion.</span></div>
<br>
<div>But in your own ways, you illustrate my point
perfectly. Because I also read right-wing blogs, just to try to figure
out how they think, and take my word, they're some pretty vicious
racists. And I find the tone and even the language you two have
employed here indistinguishable from what I find there. I find that
amazing. And to the extent those blogs remind me of nothing so much as
a lynch mob, I find it more than amazing. I find it appalling. I know
the enemy of my enemy is my friend, but for an anti-racism group, that
seems to be taking it too far.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">Cornell
West notwithstanding, most of the black people I know like Obama and
are proud that he is president, and black turnout in the most recent
election tells me my friends are not outliers. It seems to me an
anti-racism effort would be wise to take that into account. That's the
only thing I wanted to discuss.</div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
</div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div dir="ltr">
<hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"><b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> David Johnson <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net">davidjohnson1451@comcast.net</a>><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b>
Peace-discuss <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>>;
Gregg Gordon <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com" target="_blank"
href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com">ggregg79@yahoo.com</a>> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b>
Tuesday, August 27, 2013 3:13 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day<br>
</font></div>
<div class="yiv16613542y_msg_container"><br>
<div id="yiv16613542">
<style></style>
<div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="4">Gee Greg,</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="4">I hope your not trying to
imply that becasue Obama is African American that he should be given a
blank check to commit war crimes and impoverish Working Americans,
especially African American Workers ?</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="4">This is EXACTLEY what the
1% ruling class of this country hoped for when they recruited and
helped get Obama elected.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="4">Frankly, while we are on
the subject, some of the harshest critics of Obama have been Cornell
West and Black Agenda Report.</font></div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="4">Not to mention that if you
research Obama's REAL history, you will see that he has NO common
experience with the average African American in the U.S.. or for that
matter any Working American.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font face="Arial" size="4">David Johnson</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote
style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(0, 0, 0); padding-left: 5px; padding-right: 0px; margin-left: 5px; margin-right: 0px;">
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;">-----
Original Message ----- </div>
<div
style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none; -moz-background-clip: border; -moz-background-origin: padding; -moz-background-inline-policy: continuous;"><b>From:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="ggregg79@yahoo.com" ymailto="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com"
target="_blank" href="mailto:ggregg79@yahoo.com">Gregg Gordon</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>To:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="brussel@illinois.edu" ymailto="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu"
target="_blank" href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu">Brussel, Morton K</a>
; <a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="galliher@illinois.edu" ymailto="mailto:galliher@illinois.edu"
target="_blank" href="mailto:galliher@illinois.edu">Estabrook, Carl G</a>
</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Cc:</b>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
title="Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"
ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net%20List"
target="_blank" href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net%20List">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net
List</a> </div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Sent:</b>
Tuesday, August 27, 2013 12:38 PM</div>
<div
style="font-family: arial; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><b>Subject:</b>
Re: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] AWARE flyer for Quad Day</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div><span>I realize I'm probably opening a can of worms
with this, but I've been wondering for a long time and all the March on
Washington stuff this weekend brought it back to mind.</span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
<span></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span>Why
does an organization whose purpose is to fight racism so often speak
with such hostility toward our first black president? It's obviously
counter-intuitive, but I wonder if it also might not be
counterproductive.</span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><br>
<span></span></div>
<div
style="background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; font-size: 16px; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;"><span>Gregg
Gordon<br>
</span></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div
style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman','new york',times,serif;">
<div dir="ltr">
<hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"><b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> "Brussel, Morton K" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu" target="_blank"
href="mailto:brussel@illinois.edu">brussel@illinois.edu</a>><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b>
"Estabrook, Carl G" <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:galliher@illinois.edu" target="_blank"
href="mailto:galliher@illinois.edu">galliher@illinois.edu</a>> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Cc:</span></b> "<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>
List" <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>>;
"<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:peace@anti-war.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:peace@anti-war.net">peace@anti-war.net</a>" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
ymailto="mailto:peace@anti-war.net" target="_blank"
href="mailto:peace@anti-war.net">peace@anti-war.net</a>> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b>
Sunday, August 25, 2013 9:39 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b>
Re: [Peace] [Peace-discuss] AWARE flyer for Quad Day<br>
</font></div>
<div class="yiv16613542y_msg_container"><br>
<div id="yiv16613542">
<div>I would add that this administration is now
specifically threatening, and waging covert activities against, Iran
and Syria, two countries of no threat to the U.S., but who are seen by
this administration as a threat to "our national interests", that of
corporate America and its clients.
<div><br>
</div>
<div>--kb<br>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>But in any case a useful statement. </div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Aug 25, 2013, at 10:00 AM, Carl G. Estabrook
wrote:</div>
<br class="yiv16613542Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<div>
<div class="yiv16613542BodyFragment"><font size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt;">
<div class="yiv16613542PlainText">[The flyer is
attached. Comments are welcome. The text is as follows.]<br>
<br>
<br>
The Anti-War Anti-Racism Effort of Champaign-Urbana (AWARE)<br>
<br>
AWARE was founded immediately after the attacks of September 11, 2001,
by residents of Champaign-Urbana and members of the University of
Illinois, who saw that the U.S. government would use those crimes as an
excuse to carry on and expand its wars for the control of Middle East
energy resources. For a dozen years members and friends of AWARE have
worked to end the killing by informing their fellow citizens of the
real nature of the "war on terrorism," in opposition to the largest and
most sophisticated propaganda campaign in history, conducted by the
Bush and Obama administrations, and directed at the American people.<br>
<br>
Today the U.S. government is threatening, invading, and occupying
countries in a vast circle with a 2500-mile radius around the Persian
Gulf, from north Africa to the borders of India and China, a region
sometimes called the "Greater Middle East." (The U.S. military calls it
"Central Command.") This region has the world's greatest concentration
of oil and natural gas, and our government is spending hundreds of
billions of dollars, month after month, to control it. Control and not
just access to these energy resources is what our government demands.
We in fact import little of our own oil supplies from the Mideast -
most of our imported oil comes from the western hemisphere, notably
Canada and Venezuela - but control of world energy supplies gives the
U.S. an unparalleled advantage over our economic rivals in Europe and
Asia.<br>
<br>
President Obama is killing men, women, and children around the world to
"fight terrorism," he claims, but as Noam Chomsky explains, “The Obama
administration is dedicated to increasing terrorism ... it’s doing it
all over the world. Obama ... is running the biggest terrorist
operation that exists ... The drone assassination campaigns ... are
just part of it; special forces operations and so on, all of these
operations, they are terror operations.” The U.S. Special Operations
Command - in fact a 25,000-member private army run by the president -
are American death squads, who by their own account are operating in
more than a hundred countries around the world. No wonder we are hated
in those countries.<br>
<br>
If you object to the Obama administration's conducting illegal and
unjustified war - and lying about the reasons for it - join us. AWARE
meets every Sunday evening 5-6pm at the White Horse Inn on in
Champaign, near the UIUC campus. We discuss the war and plan activities
like the following:<br>
~ Street demonstrations. For more than a decade AWARE has conducted
demonstrations and distributed information about the war; they now
occur on the first Saturday of every month, 2-4pm, at Main and Neil
Streets in downtown Champaign. All are welcome to join us.<br>
~ Information tables. At the Urbana Farmers' Market and other public
events, like the Sweet Corn Festival and the Taste of Champaign, AWARE
has tables with free printed information on the war and books,
t-shirts, buttons and bumper stickers at cost.<br>
~ Television programs. AWARE produces a weekly hour of discussion on
the war, "AWARE on the Air," seen Tuesdays at 10pm on Urbana Public
Television <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
href="http://www.urbanapublictelevision.org/">http://www.urbanapublictelevision.org/</a>>.
The program is recorded unrehearsed at noon on Tuesdays in the UPTV
studios. Members and friends of AWARE are invited to attend and
participate in the discussion.<br>
~ Articles in the local media. Letters to the Editor in the
Champaign-Urbana News-Gazette and even the Daily Illini are one of the
few ways to join a general political discussion locally.<br>
~ Demands to elected representatives. People in Champaign-Urbana are
represented in Congress by Senators Dick Durbin and Mark Kirk, and by
Representative Rodney Davis. All three support the administration's
wars and assassinations - and are in fact urging Obama to expand the
killing. You can register your opinion by calling their Washington DC
offices, which can be reached at 202-224-3121. (Say that you are
calling from Illinois' 13th Congressional District.)<br>
~ Internet presence. AWARE conducts two email mailing lists, which you
can join on the websites: <<a moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow"
target="_blank"
href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace</a>>
for announcements, and, for discussion of the war, <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss</a>>.
You can join the discussion on our Facebook page: <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" rel="nofollow" target="_blank"
href="https://www.facebook.com/groups/305897426305/">https://www.facebook.com/groups/305897426305/</a>>.<br>
<br>
AWARE honors the whistleblowers - Manning, Assange, Snowden<br>
and others - persecuted by the Obama administration<br>
<br>
###<br>
<br>
</div>
</span></font></div>
<div class="yiv16613542BodyFragment"><font size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt;">
<div class="yiv16613542PlainText"><br>
<br>
</div>
</span></font></div>
<div class="yiv16613542BodyFragment"><font size="2"><span
style="font-size: 10pt;">
<div class="yiv16613542PlainText">_______________________________________________<br>
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</div>
<span><aware-flyer.doc></span></blockquote>
</div>
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