<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:garamond, new york, times, serif;font-size:14pt"><div><span>Phony liberal-conservative debate about the common core distracts us from both economic issues and legitimate educational issues, just as Bill Gates wants us to be.</span></div><div class="yahoo_quoted" style="display: block;"> <br> <br> <div style="font-family: garamond, new york, times, serif; font-size: 14pt;"> <div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> On Sunday, January 26, 2014 7:30 PM, David Johnson <davidjohnson1451@comcast.net> wrote:<br> </font> </div> <blockquote style="padding-left: 5px; margin-top: 5px; margin-left: 5px; border-left-color: rgb(16, 16, 255); border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid;"> <div class="y_msg_container"><div id="yiv2551668386"><style>#yiv2551668386
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<div><b><font face="Arial">Interesting discussion on " Common Core " and
educational policy.</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial"></font></b> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">I did some research about " Common Core " and it
appears that the Bill and Melinda Gates foundation are big promoters of Common
</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">Core, including a $ 160 Million dollar
donation.</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial"></font></b> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">That alone makes me suspicious of Common Core,
since Bill Gates is a big promoter of privatized corporate charter
schools.</font></b></div>
<div><b><font face="Arial"></font></b> </div>
<div><b><font face="Arial">David Johnson</font></b></div>
<div> </div>
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<div class="yiv2551668386yqt9109975961" id="yiv2551668386yqt01712"><div style="font: 10pt/normal arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;">----- Original Message ----- </div>
<div style="background: rgb(228, 228, 228); font: 10pt/normal arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>From:</b>
<a title="lynn.stuckey@hotmail.com" href="mailto:lynn.stuckey@hotmail.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:lynn.stuckey@hotmail.com">Lynn
Stuckey</a> </div>
<div style="font: 10pt/normal arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>To:</b> <a title="davegreen84@yahoo.com" href="mailto:davegreen84@yahoo.com" target="_blank" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:davegreen84@yahoo.com">David Green</a> ; <a title="peace-discuss@anti-war.net" href="mailto:peace-discuss@anti-war.net" target="_blank" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:peace-discuss@anti-war.net">Peace Discuss</a> ; <a title="discuss-communitycourtwatch@lists.chambana.net" href="mailto:discuss-communitycourtwatch@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank" rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:discuss-communitycourtwatch@lists.chambana.net">discuss list</a>
</div>
<div style="font: 10pt/normal arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Sent:</b> Sunday, January 26, 2014 6:02
PM</div>
<div style="font: 10pt/normal arial; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><b>Subject:</b> Re: [Discuss] Common Core</div>
<div><br clear="none"></div>
<div dir="ltr"><b><span><font face="garamond, new york, times, serif" size="4">On
a genuinely democratic basis, without pressure and harassment, parents,
teachers, administrators, citizens, and developing children can make sound
decisions in accordance with their local proclivities and genuine concern
about their children's futures. On the basis of consensual school/community
standards in various disciplines, teachers, parents, and children can make
choices that consider the gifts and talents of each child, as well as the
labor market. These gifts and talents may have vocational possibilities or
otherwise, but it will be up to children, in consultation with their parents
and teachers, to make choices with various implications for their development
and their future.</font></span></b><br clear="none"><br clear="none">Sorry, David, but you've just made
it clear that you've always lived in places where adults regard it as their
responsibility to educate children. I must unfortunately inform you that
not every community thinks that way (many rural communities are good places of
the thinking that drives their underinvestment in education), and your
proposed solution will leave these children undereducated and consigned to
lower earnings and achievement throughout their life. While it may make
the adults feel good, how does it help the children develop into productive
adults? How does this further your goal of a progressive, more just
society?<br clear="none"><br clear="none">As a person who grew up in one of those communities that takes
pride in undereducating their children, it is not a pleasant place to be in,
and there is a reason I refused to subject my own child to that type of
education. I do not appreciate your willingness to throw so many
children away. Not every child gets the chance to grow up in a community
like Champaign-Urbana.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Lynn<br clear="none"><br clear="none">
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Date: Sun, 26 Jan 2014 15:30:10 -0800<br clear="none">From:
davegreen84@yahoo.com<br clear="none">Subject: Re: [Discuss] Common Core<br clear="none">To:
lynn.stuckey@hotmail.com; peace-discuss@anti-war.net;
discuss-communitycourtwatch@lists.chambana.net<br clear="none"><br clear="none">
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Courier New, courier, monaco, monospace, sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">
<div><font face="garamond, new york, times, serif" size="4">Hi
Lynn,</font></div>
<div><font face="garamond, new york, times, serif" size="4"><br clear="none"></font></div>
<div><span><font face="garamond, new york, times, serif" size="4">So long as
schools are accorded the role of sorting out students for their assigned
places in brutal capitalism with its radical inequality, then there is not
much the schools can do one way or the other. Once we've addressed economic
issues as economic issues, then we can address educational issues as
educational issues, and let the chips fall where they may. We can have
national or state standards, but these should not be mandatory. On a genuinely
democratic basis, without pressure and harassment, parents, teachers,
administrators, citizens, and developing children can make sound decisions in
accordance with their local proclivities and genuine concern about their
children's futures. On the basis of consensual school/community standards in
various disciplines, teachers, parents, and children can make choices that
consider the gifts and talents of each child, as well as the labor market.
These gifts and talents may have vocational possibilities or otherwise, but it
will be up to children, in consultation with their parents and teachers, to
make choices with various implications for their development and their future.
On this basis schools can come to address the needs of the individual in the
community, rather than groups whose interests, while worthy of consideration,
should have no bearing on the development and choices of the
child/adolescent/young adult.</font></span></div>
<div><font face="garamond, new york, times, serif" size="4"><br clear="none"></font></div>
<div><font face="garamond, new york, times, serif" size="4">Best,</font></div>
<div><font face="garamond, new york, times, serif" size="4"><br clear="none"></font></div>
<div><font face="garamond, new york, times, serif" size="4">David</font></div>
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<div style="font-family: HelveticaNeue, Helvetica Neue, Helvetica, Arial, Lucida Grande, sans-serif;">
<div dir="ltr"><font face="Arial">On Sunday, January 26, 2014 12:53 PM, Lynn
Stuckey <lynn.stuckey@hotmail.com> wrote:<br clear="none"></font></div>
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<div dir="ltr"> <b>School districts (parents, teachers, students,
citizens) need to develop their own standards.</b> "Developing their
own standards" is what gives us one set of textbooks for Texas and another
for the rest of the country. Is this a path you would like to continue
on? Do you really think the science books that teach about creationism
are doing those children any favors?<br clear="none"><b> Standards don't
have to be uniform, even among schools or classrooms. </b>And if the
standards are not uniform, how can we be certain that all children in a
particular grade level are able to read, write, or do arithmetic at a
particular level? A high school diploma is no longer a guarantee that
you can read or write; it has devolved into a marker that you can show up
for enough classes and stay out of enough trouble to make it through.
Hence "credential inflation", best symbolized by the drapery company in town
that expects its receptionist to possess a four-year degree, yet will only
pay her minimum wage. Any questions as to why this job is constantly
in the want ads?<br clear="none"><b>They should result from communities
developing an educational identity.</b> I can't remember where you're
from, David, but I know you've lived in C-U for almost as long as I
have. I grew up on a farm almost 70 miles south of here, in a county
of 14,000 residents (2010 census: 11,400; about 98% white) that is
economically depressed and in (proud) possession of bad schools. You
need to understand that many small and rural school districts don't place a
high premium on educational achievement, but the Republican-dominated school
boards expect and agitate for state payments. Do you realize how many
school districts in Illinois don't have Advanced Placement or Honors
classes? Do you realize how many of the voting citizens of those
counties are more concerned about how their high school football or
basketball team is doing, but don't care about the kids who are below
average on reading or math tests? Then they wonder why they can't
attract economic development, and why their population keeps declining and
getting poorer. <br clear="none"><br clear="none">"Developing an
educational identity" sounds great on paper and may work well in a
university town, where folks recognize the need for all children to be
achieving to the best of their abilities. But it is a
<u><b>disaster</b></u> for children from areas like the one I grew up in,
where the interest is not on educating children, but rather on making sure
they show up so the district can collect the maximum payment from the
State.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">And I'm not a huge fan of Common
Core--while the initial idea was good, the back-mapping of what children
need to learn, when they need to learn it (often not based on when their
developing brains are ready to do it), and the execution of its rollout are
horrible, and it's going to fail as badly as pretty much any other education
"reform" propogated in American schools since the early 1900's.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">What's the answer, you ask? Well, I'm a fan
of the money following the child. I would abolish attendance
boundaries and allow parents and children to flee the schools that are
failing children. And yes, some schools will close, but why shouldn't
you be out of business when you won't even bother to make the effort to
ensure all children are achieving to the best of their abilities? Why
should a family held be captive to the board's disinterest in and
unwillingness to educate children to necessary levels, simply because of
their address? Mine was, and let me tell you, it was not a pleasant
experience to be told that my school would not be willing to pay for
independent studies in Chemistry II and Physics II my senior year of high
school, and that I must round up 12 children to take Calculus (the 9 I had
found were considered to be an "insufficient number", out of a class of 78
seniors). But I was welcome to take P.E. for an additional period, and
had I considered Woodworking or Automotive class? Really? This
is what you want to continue paying for? Do you have any reason to
wonder why the four siblings who got a chance to go to the Illinois Math and
Science Academy fled there instead?<br clear="none"><br clear="none">"Money
following the child" is the model we use for college in the U.S. I
don't buy the argument that parents are incapable of making decisions for
the best education for their child from ages 5-17, but once that child hits
18, s/he can make a good decision about what college and career path they
are best suited for. Just check out the statistics on how many people
complete college in six years or less, or the rates of degree attainment in
community colleges. Just because some parents make educational
decisions you might not agree with does not make them wrong.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Lynn Stuckey<br clear="none"><br clear="none">
<div>
<div class="yiv2551668386hr" style="padding: 0px; border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); border-image: none; height: 0px; line-height: 0;"></div>Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2014 07:24:56 -0800<br clear="none">From:
davegreen84@yahoo.com<br clear="none">To: peace-discuss@anti-war.net;
discuss-communitycourtwatch@lists.chambana.net<br clear="none">Subject:
[Discuss] Common Core<br clear="none"><br clear="none">
<div class="yiv2551668386ecxyiv0366918088yqt0097528602" id="yiv2551668386ecxyiv0366918088yqt16085">
<div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Courier New, courier, monaco, monospace, sans-serif; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">
<div><a href="http://www.commondreams.org/view/2014/01/24-10" target="_blank" rel="nofollow" shape="rect">http://www.commondreams.org/view/2014/01/24-10</a></div>
<div><br clear="none"></div>
<div>Indispensable for an understanding how corrupted the "liberal vs.
conservative" debate is regarding school "reform". School districts
(parents, teachers, students, citizens) need to develop their own standards.
Standards don't have to be uniform, even among schools or classrooms. They
should result from communities developing an educational identity.</div>
<div><br clear="none"></div>
<div>DG</div></div></div><br clear="none">_______________________________________________ Discuss mailing
list Discuss@lists.chambana.net
https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/discuss-communitycourtwatch</div></div></div></div><br clear="none"><br clear="none"></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>
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