<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">
<html>
<head>
<meta content="text/html; charset=UTF-8" http-equiv="Content-Type">
</head>
<body bgcolor="#ffffff" text="#000000">
With the demize of Windows as a reasonable option for new computer
hardware,<br>
we have been looking at Slackware GNU/Linux as a possible alternative.
I bring it up in <br>
command line mode rather that as a gui, and it greets one with random
pithy quotes-<br>
<br>
Got this one a couple of days ago:<br>
<br>
"If the Government doesn't like the People, <br>
it should get rid of all of them,<br>
and elect new people."<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On 2/11/2014 11:58 PM, Karen Aram wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:BAY177-W9DD0963DD47975CED6AB1A3930@phx.gbl"
type="cite">
<style><!--
.hmmessage P
{
margin:0px;
padding:0px
}
body.hmmessage
{
font-size: 12pt;
font-family:Calibri
}
--></style>
<div dir="ltr">Excuse my ignorance of local affairs please, but as
someone who supports Carol Ammons, given her pro-labor, pro-choice,
etc. platform, I am a bit perplexed at the personal attacks on Carl for
asking a question related to "enterprise and/or technology zones". I am
attempting to understand this issue and how it relates to taxation and
use of public funds in support of corporations. However, its difficult
given the accusations of racism, etc., for simply asking the question
and pointing out that some of us believed in our current President
because he supported anti-war, and appeared to support the poor etc.
Carls point should be taken as a lesson, in that perhaps we were
blinded by Obama being the first African American to have a chance
at holding such a powerful position, assuming he would be as we
imagined, only to be sadly disappointed that he is not MLK. Perhaps if
we had looked closer at his policies related to issues and not been
dazzled by his charm and charisma we might have supported someone
who better represented our views, if the Party were to allow it. <br>
Public figures policy stands need to be examined thoroughly.<br>
<br>
<div>
<hr id="stopSpelling">Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 00:22:27 -0800<br>
From: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:jencart13@yahoo.com">jencart13@yahoo.com</a><br>
To: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:mkbrussel@comcast.net">mkbrussel@comcast.net</a>; <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com">carl@newsfromneptune.com</a><br>
CC: <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:jrbarret@uiuc.edu">jrbarret@uiuc.edu</a>; <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>;
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:sf-core@yahoogroups.com">sf-core@yahoogroups.com</a>; <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net">occupycu@lists.chambana.net</a><br>
Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] [sf-core] Re: [OccupyCU] AMMONS vs.
ROSENBERG Debate Results<br>
<br>
<div
style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: verdana,helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 10pt; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">The
principal objector's thinking about women's issues is well known, so
regardless of the excuses he's come up with, I'm guessing the real
reason is that Carol Ammons supports Planned Parenthood.
<div
style="font-family: verdana,helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 10pt;">
<div
style="font-family: HelveticaNeue,Helvetica Neue,Helvetica,Arial,Lucida Grande,sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">
<div dir="ltr">
<hr size="1"> <font face="Arial" size="2"> <b><span
style="font-weight: bold;">From:</span></b> Brussel Morton K.
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:mkbrussel@comcast.net"><mkbrussel@comcast.net></a><br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> C. G. Estabrook
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com"><carl@newsfromneptune.com></a> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Cc:</span></b> "Barrett, James R"
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:jrbarret@uiuc.edu"><jrbarret@uiuc.edu></a>; Peace-discuss
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"><peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net></a>; sf-core
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:sf-core@yahoogroups.com"><sf-core@yahoogroups.com></a>; <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net">"occupycu@lists.chambana.net"</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net"><occupycu@lists.chambana.net></a> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Thursday,
February 6, 2014 3:01 PM<br>
<b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re:
[Peace-discuss] [sf-core] Re: [OccupyCU] AMMONS vs. ROSENBERG Debate
Results<br>
</font> </div>
<div class="ecxy_msg_container"><br>
I find it curious that you appear to be putting all " progressive,
ostentatiously pro-labor viable Black candidate(s)" into the same bag
(as M. Obama). What do you have against Carol Ammons (as against her
opponents) aside from the fact that she has the same color as Obama
(which could mislead us in our choice). <br>
<br>
--mkb<br>
<br>
On Feb 6, 2014, at 12:33 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:<br>
<br>
> The national Democrats offered "a progressive, ostentatiously
pro-labor viable Black candidate who is willing to speak in Terms of
class inequality" for president, and his mendacity got us an
administration of assassination and austerity. <br>
> <br>
> Doesn't that suggest that we should ask what "progressive,
ostentatiously pro-labor viable Black candidate[s]" on the local level
actually propose, rather than voting for them out of debased identity
politics?<br>
> <br>
> --CGE<br>
> <br>
> On Feb 6, 2014, at 12:22 PM, Barrett, James R <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:jrbarret@uiuc.edu">jrbarret@uiuc.edu</a>>
wrote:<br>
> <br>
>> Very discouraging. I doubt anyone agrees with all of her<br>
>> views, but we have a progressive, ostentatiously <br>
>> pro-labor viable Black candidate who is willing to speak in <br>
>> Terms of class inequality and we're supposed<br>
>> to invest our limited time into attacking her? That's sick.<br>
>> <br>
>> Jim Barrett<br>
>> ________________________________________<br>
>> From: <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:sf-core@yahoogroups.com">sf-core@yahoogroups.com</a> [<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:sf-core@yahoogroups.com">sf-core@yahoogroups.com</a>]
on behalf of C. G. Estabrook [<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com">carl@newsfromneptune.com</a>]<br>
>> Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 9:39 AM<br>
>> To: David Johnson<br>
>> Cc: sf-core; Peace-discuss; <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net">occupycu@lists.chambana.net</a><br>
>> Subject: Re: [sf-core] Re: [OccupyCU] AMMONS vs. ROSENBERG
Debate Results [1 Attachment]<br>
>> <br>
>> [Attachment(s) from C. G. Estabrook included below]<br>
>> <br>
>> David--<br>
>> <br>
>> As you know, "enterprise zones" are a neoliberal technique,
originally proposed by 'supply-side' economists. Their current
proponents acknowledge successful criticism by looking for newer, more
marketable names - e.g., "technology zones."<br>
>> <br>
>> It's not clear that states and municipalities should be
competing to give breaks to corporate entities on the threat that they
might move away and take jobs - or on the promise to bring them. See
e.g., Durl Kruse' letter (attached) regarding the Champaign City
Council's "Tax Increment Financing District" that will give Kraft "a
$3.6 million tax subsidy to build a new warehouse."<br>
>> <br>
>> Durl writes, "One must wonder if this TIF project represents
the flexing of corporate muscle by threatening the community 'not to
build if not approved,' and when given the opportunity, to directly
manipulate TIF laws for corporate gain at taxpayers' expense."<br>
>> <br>
>> Clearly, the supposed benefits of such a program should
generalize. You can make an argument for "an across the board corporate
tax cut" to promote trade and employment. Such business taxes should be
replaced with taxes on concentrated wealth and speculation - i.e.,
taxes on investable assets, and Tobin taxes.<br>
>> <br>
>> Given the entrenched (non-democratic) political power of
capital, wealth taxes and Tobin taxes are not on the horizon in
Illinois, unfortunately. (The Democrats should of course be opposed on
this point.) The best we can do in the near future seems to be a
progressive income tax and social subsidies, including perhaps the
state single-payer system that you've been working for.<br>
>> <br>
>> Regards, CGE<br>
>> <br>
>> On Feb 5, 2014, at 10:21 PM, David Johnson <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net">davidjohnson1451@comcast.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
>> <br>
>>> <br>
>>> The differnce is that Rosenberg supports an across the
board corporate tax cut with no conditions.<br>
>>> <br>
>>> Carol Ammons " Technology Zone Program " gives a tax break
to a company ONLY if a company ;<br>
>>> <br>
>>> 1) increases employment by the greater of 10 % of its
current workforce or a minimum of 3 new full-time employees<br>
>>> <br>
>>> 2) Pays wages of 20 % or more above the median income of
Champaign County<br>
>>> <br>
>>> 3) Employ a minimum of 5 full-time employees<br>
>>> <br>
>>> Not to mention that Rosenberg is an attorney who works for
Carle Clinic and takes poor and elderly people to court for not paying
hospital bills.<br>
>>> <br>
>>> Carol has been a community activist for over a decade,
opposing the : Police, States Attorney and other local officials /
vested interests at times when necessary in the pursuit of social
justice.<br>
>>> <br>
>>> Again, the choice is clear to me who would be the better
advocate for Working people in the 103rd District<br>
>>> <br>
>>> David Johnson<br>
>>> ----- Original Message -----<br>
>>> From: C. G. Estabrook<br>
>>> To: David Johnson<br>
>>> Cc:
<"Undisclosed-Recipient:;"@mail0.frost.chambana.net><br>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2014 9:29 PM<br>
>>> Subject: Re: [OccupyCU] AMMONS vs. ROSENBERG Debate Results<br>
>>> <br>
>>> Didn't Carol support 'enterprise zones' (under another
name), which are even more substantial corporate tax cats - for favored
corporations?<br>
>>> <br>
>>> <br>
>>> On Feb 5, 2014, at 9:24 PM, David Johnson <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net">davidjohnson1451@comcast.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
>>> <br>
>>>> I just returned from the Ammons vs. Rosenberg debate,
for the Illinois 103rd State Rep Democratic Primary race.<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> The major differences between the two candidates were ;<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> Rosenberg SUPPORTS cutting corporate taxes and OPPOSES
the $ 15.00 per hour minimum wage.<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> Carol Ammons in contrast OPPOSES cutting corporate
taxes and SUPPORTS the $ 15.00 per hour minimum wage.<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> Rosenberg also stated that Carol Ammons experience in
local government on the County Board and the Urbana City Council does
NOT make her more qualified than him in terms of experience.<br>
>>>> He stated that ;<br>
>>>> " Springfield is a different BEAST than local
government and I am more qualified to deal with that."<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> The difference could not be any clearer to me.<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> What was also interesting was that I submitted TWO
questions for the candidates, first via e-mail several days before the
debate and early on at the debate.<br>
>>>> Neither question was asked !<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> The questions were ;<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> 1) Would you be willing to co-sponsor the current
House Bill to enact a universal health care system in Illinois ( H.B.
942 ).<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> and<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> 2) Would you co-sponsor House Bill H.B. 3754 that
would dissolve the Illinois Charter School Commision<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> I wonder why the Moderators avoided asking these
questions ?<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> David Johnson<br>
>> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> <br>
> ------------------------------------<br>
> <br>
> Yahoo Groups Links<br>
> <br>
> <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sf-core/" target="_blank">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sf-core/</a><br>
> <br>
> <*> Your email settings:<br>
> Individual Email | Traditional<br>
> <br>
> <*> To change settings online go to:<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sf-core/join" target="_blank">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sf-core/join</a><br>
> (Yahoo! ID required)<br>
> <br>
> <*> To change settings via email:<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:sf-core-digest@yahoogroups.com">sf-core-digest@yahoogroups.com</a>
<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:sf-core-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com">sf-core-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
> <br>
> <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:sf-core-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com">sf-core-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com</a><br>
> <br>
> <*> Your use of Yahoo Groups is subject to:<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/" target="_blank">http://info.yahoo.com/legal/us/yahoo/utos/terms/</a><br>
> <br>
<br>
<br>
_______________________________________________<br>
Peace-discuss mailing list<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a><br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss"
target="_blank">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss</a><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
_______________________________________________
Peace-discuss mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss</a></div>
</div>
<pre wrap="">
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
_______________________________________________
Peace-discuss mailing list
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
</body>
</html>