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<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3 face="Times New Roman">" In spite of
her vigorous self-promotion, I do not think that Carol in the legislature would
vote any differently from the way Rosenberg would. From her past performance, I
would expect her to work to rise within the Democratic party establishment,
rather than oppose it."</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3 face="Times New Roman">What evidence
do you have to support the above statement Carl ?</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3 face="Times New Roman">Her track
record for the last ten years has been one of community activism, which more
often than not, involved fighting and opposing the States Attorney, The Police,
and other officials and vested interests.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3 face="Times New Roman">That is a FACT
you ignore.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3
face="Times New Roman"></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3 face="Times New Roman">If there is so
little difference between Rosenberg and Carol Ammons, then why is the local
Democratic Party establishment and the State Democratic Party establishment
including Mike Madigan and Rahm Emanuelle fighting so hard to prevent Carol from
being elected. Including Madigan sending a paid Staffer this last week to help
Rosenberg ?</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3
face="Times New Roman"></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3 face="Times New Roman">I would support
Carol if ONLY the above were the case, and not including her decade of local
activism.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3
face="Times New Roman"></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3 face="Times New Roman">I KNOW who my
enemies are Carl, and Mike Madigan, Rahm Emanuelle, et al, are DEFINTELY
servents of the corporate neo-liberal agenda.</FONT></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3
face="Times New Roman"></FONT></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial><FONT size=3 face="Times New Roman">David
Johnson</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR></DIV></FONT>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=astridjb@comcast.net href="mailto:astridjb@comcast.net">Astrid
Berkson</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=carl@newsfromneptune.com
href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com">C. G. Estabrook</A> ; <A
title=mkbrussel@comcast.net href="mailto:mkbrussel@comcast.net">Brussel Morton
K.</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Cc:</B> <A title=jrbarret@uiuc.edu
href="mailto:jrbarret@uiuc.edu">Barrett, James R</A> ; <A
title=peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss</A> ; <A
title=jencart13@yahoo.com href="mailto:jencart13@yahoo.com">Jenifer
Cartwright</A> ; <A title=sf-core@yahoogroups.com
href="mailto:sf-core@yahoogroups.com">sf-core</A> ; <A
title=occupycu@lists.chambana.net
href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net">occupycu@lists.chambana.net</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, February 15, 2014 10:23
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [OccupyCU] [Peace-discuss]
[sf-core] Re: AMMONS vs. ROSENBERG Debate Results</DIV>
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<DIV style="POSITION: relative" id=ygrp-mlmsg>
<DIV style="Z-INDEX: 1" id=ygrp-msg><!--~-|**|PrettyHtmlEndT|**|-~-->
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<P>
<DIV class=moz-cite-prefix>carol did not make points with the party when she
turned the jail program into a justice program. in fact she made some pretty
serious enemies. and anyone who depends on rahm emanuel and madigan for
everything will serve them, not us<BR><PRE class=moz-signature cols="72">"May this be the worst day of your life".
Old Irish blessing.</PRE>On 2/15/2014 6:43 PM, C. G. Estabrook
wrote:<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE cite=mid:E2F8A092-E956-4350-8207-194B10F720FC@newsfromneptune.com
type="cite"><SPAN> </SPAN>
<DIV id=ygrp-text>
<P>Thanks for your response, Mort.</P>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Objections to Obama for his crimes of commission (especially military)
and omission (especially economic) seem to me quite appropriate, up to and
including impeachment - and trial for war crimes. To dismiss those
objections as principally the product of racism is at best disingenuous
- even if there are racists who object to him, for whatever
reasons.<BR><BR>Obviously Illinois (and the US) needs a general shift of the
tax burden to the wealthy (even a progressive income tax is not adequate) -
but that’s not under discussion at all. A Keynesian argument can be made for
a general corporate tax cut (as the state Democrats propose) in
preference to the selective cuts suggested by “enterprise zones,” which lead
to beggar-thy-neighbor competition among jurisdictions. But it would have to
be accompanied by substantial taxes elsewhere - Tobin taxes and wealth taxes
- and no one is suggesting that.<BR><BR>In spite of her vigorous
self-promotion, I do not think that Carol in the legislature would vote any
differently from the way Rosenberg would. From her past performance, I would
expect her to work to rise within the Democratic party establishment,
rather than oppose it. <BR><BR>I think we’re dealing here with what
Freud called “the narcissism of small differences”: it’s been described as
“the need to find, and even exaggerate, differences in order to preserve a
feeling of separateness and self.”<BR><BR>Chomsky points out that that’s
functional for the entire political system: “The smart way to keep people
passive and obedient is to strictly limit the spectrum of acceptable
opinion, but allow very lively debate within that spectrum -
even encourage the more critical and dissident views. That gives people
the sense that there's free thinking going on, while all the time the
presuppositions of the system are being reinforced by the limits put on the
range of the debate.”<BR><BR>The differences that David Johnson noted aren’t
great. It seems to me that many earnest local liberals of our acquaintance
are colluding (as the psychoanalysts might say) with Carol in the
accentuation of those differences. Perhaps they're acting from the despair
that led American liberals to substitute identity politics for class
politics under the attack of neoliberalism, so that typically Democrats
today are about where the moderate Republicans of our youth were. The
promise of hope and change precisely covers despair and stasis.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Regards, Carl</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>On Feb 11, 2014, at 11:40 AM, Brussel Morton K. <<A
href="mailto:mkbrussel@comcast.net" moz="true">mkbrussel@comcast.net</A>>
wrote:</DIV><BR class=Apple-interchange-newline>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<DIV>
<DIV>Carl,</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>An interesting, even and informative, response… My thoughts:
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>It is more than possible that <B>some</B> of the objectors to Obama
do have a racist agenda. It is not clear (to me) that Carol Ammons
believes that <B>all</B> objections to Obamas reign are racist, as you
seem to imply. Pertinent questions would be to ask what Carol thinks about
Obama's health plans (as opposed to a universal medicare-like (or other
single payer plan), whether she supported Obama's surge into Afghanistan,
about his drone war on supposed terrorists (not to speak about American
citizens), about his implied compromises(?) on social security, about his
defense of the NSA, about his defense of the Patriot Act, about his not
closing down Guantanamo, about his persecution of Snowden, Assange,
Manning, about his continuing imperialistic actions (Cuba, Venezuela, …),
about the military budget, etc., etc. Those are not Primary
issues, but they are primary issues.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>It seems to me that the differences David Johnson noted—how large a
minimum wage ought to be, what the corporate tax rate ought to be— are not
trivial in the context of this state primary, but are clues to the mental
approaches the candidates really have. </DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>My impression is that one candidate is the Democratic establishment
candidate with money, one presumably backed by Madigan; the other is not.
Significant?</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>Carl's last paragraph, first sentence, is less than convincing (to
me), likely wrong speculation.</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>--mkb</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>
<DIV>On Feb 11, 2014, at 9:01 AM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:</DIV><BR
class=Apple-interchange-newline>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Jenifer--<BR><BR>Contrary to your periphrastic
imaginings, I’ve seen no indication that the Democratic candidates for
the 103rd IL House seat differ on abortion: it’s not an issue in the
primary. <BR><BR>The fact is that there are few if any issues in
the campaign - and that’s the problem. A local political website wrote,
“…it is important to remember that Rosenberg and Ammons are largely the
same on the issues – something else that came out during last week’s
debate." <BR><BR>David Johnson, an acute observer, found two "major
differences" in their debate: the nature of corporate tax cuts, and the
dollar amount of a minimum wage rise. I suggested these differences are
minimal - if they exist at all.<BR><BR>I’ve mentioned my dismay at
hearing Carol suggest that opposition to the policies of the Obama
administration is racist: I think on the contrary that there are
excellent reasons to oppose Obama. Her recent contretemps with the mayor
of Champaign suggested that opposition to her is racist. Surely her
supporters are not arguing that she should be elected because she’s
African-American.<BR><BR>We are famously called upon to be “a nation
where [candidates] will not be judged by the color of their skin, but by
the content of their character” - and it’s here that questions have been
raised about her cutting corners in the advancement of her electoral
career.<BR><BR>On her record and her position on the issues, I see
little reason to think that she will vote as anything other than a
reliable member of the pro-business Democratic majority in the Illinois
House (as would her opponent) - a majority even less progressive than
the governor. I’d rather vote for someone - a Green, say - who would
oppose that anti-democratic majority: who would vote for paying the
state bills by taxes on wealth, who would vote for a state single-payer
system, etc. But Carol is part of a system that ensures that that is not
being offered. <BR><BR>Regards, Carl<BR><BR><BR>On Feb 11,
2014, at 2:22 AM, Jenifer Cartwright <<A
href="mailto:jencart13@yahoo.com" moz="true">jencart13@yahoo.com</A>>
wrote:<BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">The principal objector's thinking about
women's issues is well known, so regardless of the excuses he's come
up with, I'm guessing the real reason is that Carol Ammons supports
Planned Parenthood.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR><BR>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">From: Brussel Morton K. <<A
href="mailto:mkbrussel@comcast.net"
moz="true">mkbrussel@comcast.net</A>><BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">To: C. G. Estabrook <<A
href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com"
moz="true">carl@newsfromneptune.com</A>> <BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Cc: "Barrett, James R" <<A
href="mailto:jrbarret@uiuc.edu" moz="true">jrbarret@uiuc.edu</A>>;
Peace-discuss <<A href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"
moz="true">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</A>>; sf-core <<A
href="mailto:sf-core@yahoogroups.com"
moz="true">sf-core@yahoogroups.com</A>>; "<A
href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net"
moz="true">occupycu@lists.chambana.net</A>" <<A
href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net"
moz="true">occupycu@lists.chambana.net</A>> <BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Sent: Thursday, February 6, 2014 3:01
PM<BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] [sf-core] Re:
[OccupyCU] AMMONS vs. ROSENBERG<SPAN style="WHITE-SPACE: pre" class=Apple-tab-span> </SPAN>Debate
Results<BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">I find it curious that you appear to be
putting all " progressive, ostentatiously pro-labor viable Black
candidate(s)" into the same bag (as M. Obama). What do you have
against Carol Ammons (as against her opponents) aside from the fact
that she has the same color as Obama (which could mislead us in our
choice). <BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">--mkb<BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">On Feb 6, 2014, at 12:33 PM, C. G. Estabrook
wrote:<BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">The national Democrats offered "a
progressive, ostentatiously pro-labor viable Black candidate who is
willing to speak in Terms of class inequality" for president, and
his mendacity got us an administration of assassination and
austerity. <BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Doesn't that suggest that we should ask what
"progressive, ostentatiously pro-labor viable Black candidate[s]" on
the local level actually propose, rather than voting for them out of
debased identity politics?<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">--CGE<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">On Feb 6, 2014, at 12:22 PM, Barrett, James
R <<A href="mailto:jrbarret@uiuc.edu"
moz="true">jrbarret@uiuc.edu</A>>
wrote:<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Very discouraging. I doubt anyone agrees
with all of her<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">views, but we have a progressive,
ostentatiously <BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">pro-labor viable Black candidate who is
willing to speak in <BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Terms of class inequality and we're
supposed<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">to invest our limited time into attacking
her? That's sick.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Jim
Barrett<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite">________________________________________<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">From: <A
href="mailto:sf-core@yahoogroups.com"
moz="true">sf-core@yahoogroups.com</A> [<A
href="mailto:sf-core@yahoogroups.com"
moz="true">sf-core@yahoogroups.com</A>] on behalf of C. G.
Estabrook [<A href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com"
moz="true">carl@newsfromneptune.com</A>]<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Sent: Thursday, February 06, 2014 9:39
AM<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">To: David
Johnson<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Cc: sf-core; Peace-discuss; <A
href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net"
moz="true">occupycu@lists.chambana.net</A><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Subject: Re: [sf-core] Re: [OccupyCU]
AMMONS vs. ROSENBERG Debate Results [1
Attachment]<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">[Attachment(s) from C. G. Estabrook
included below]<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite">David--<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">As you know, "enterprise zones" are a
neoliberal technique, originally proposed by 'supply-side'
economists. Their current proponents acknowledge successful
criticism by looking for newer, more marketable names - e.g.,
"technology zones."<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">It's not clear that states and
municipalities should be competing to give breaks to corporate
entities on the threat that they might move away and take jobs -
or on the promise to bring them. See e.g., Durl Kruse' letter
(attached) regarding the Champaign City Council's "Tax Increment
Financing District" that will give Kraft "a $3.6 million tax
subsidy to build a new
warehouse."<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Durl writes, "One must wonder if this TIF
project represents the flexing of corporate muscle by threatening
the community 'not to build if not approved,' and when given the
opportunity, to directly manipulate TIF laws for corporate gain at
taxpayers' expense."<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Clearly, the supposed benefits of such a
program should generalize. You can make an argument for "an across
the board corporate tax cut" to promote trade and employment. Such
business taxes should be replaced with taxes on concentrated
wealth and speculation - i.e., taxes on investable assets, and
Tobin taxes.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Given the entrenched (non-democratic)
political power of capital, wealth taxes and Tobin taxes are not
on the horizon in Illinois, unfortunately. (The Democrats should
of course be opposed on this point.) The best we can do in the
near future seems to be a progressive income tax and social
subsidies, including perhaps the state single-payer system that
you've been working for.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Regards,
CGE<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">On Feb 5, 2014, at 10:21 PM, David Johnson
<<A href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net"
moz="true">davidjohnson1451@comcast.net</A>>
wrote:<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">The differnce is that Rosenberg supports
an across the board corporate tax cut with no
conditions.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Carol Ammons " Technology Zone Program "
gives a tax break to a company ONLY if a company
;<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">1) increases employment by the greater
of 10 % of its current workforce or a minimum of 3 new full-time
employees<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">2) Pays wages of 20 % or more above the
median income of Champaign
County<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">3) Employ a minimum of 5 full-time
employees<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Not to mention that Rosenberg is an
attorney who works for Carle Clinic and takes poor and elderly
people to court for not paying hospital
bills.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Carol has been a community activist for
over a decade, opposing the : Police, States Attorney and other
local officials / vested interests at times when necessary in
the pursuit of social
justice.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Again, the choice is clear to me who
would be the better advocate for Working people in the 103rd
District<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">David
Johnson<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">----- Original Message
-----<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">From: C. G.
Estabrook<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">To: David
Johnson<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Cc: <"Undisclosed-Recipient:;"@<A
href="http://mail0.frost.chambana.net"
moz="true">mail0.frost.chambana.net</A>><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Sent: Wednesday, February 05, 2014 9:29
PM<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Subject: Re: [OccupyCU] AMMONS vs.
ROSENBERG Debate
Results<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Didn't Carol support 'enterprise zones'
(under another name), which are even more substantial corporate
tax cats - for favored
corporations?<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">On Feb 5, 2014, at 9:24 PM, David
Johnson <<A href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net"
moz="true">davidjohnson1451@comcast.net</A>>
wrote:<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">I just returned from the Ammons vs.
Rosenberg debate, for the Illinois 103rd State Rep Democratic
Primary
race.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">The major differences between the two
candidates were
;<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Rosenberg SUPPORTS cutting corporate
taxes and OPPOSES the $ 15.00 per hour minimum
wage.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Carol Ammons in contrast OPPOSES
cutting corporate taxes and SUPPORTS the $ 15.00 per hour
minimum
wage.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Rosenberg also stated that Carol
Ammons experience in local government on the County Board and
the Urbana City Council does NOT make her more qualified than
him in terms of
experience.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">He stated that
;<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">" Springfield is a different BEAST
than local government and I am more qualified to deal with
that."<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">The difference could not be any
clearer to
me.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">What was also interesting was that I
submitted TWO questions for the candidates, first via e-mail
several days before the debate and early on at the
debate.<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">Neither question was asked
!<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">The questions were
;<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">1) Would you be willing to co-sponsor
the current House Bill to enact a universal health care system
in Illinois ( H.B. 942
).<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite">and<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">2) Would you co-sponsor House Bill
H.B. 3754 that would dissolve the Illinois Charter School
Commision<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">I wonder why the Moderators avoided
asking these questions
?<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE
type="cite"><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">
<BLOCKQUOTE type="cite">David
Johnson<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><BR></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></DIV></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></DIV></DIV><!-- end group email --></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
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