<div><div>And again that is why we need to take it back from within.</div><div>Then there is the FDR paraphrase to union leaders of his day 'if you want me to help, you will have to force me.'</div><div><br/></div><div><br/></div><div><font style="color:#333333"><i>Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID</i></font></div></div><br><br>David Johnson <davidjohnson1451@comcast.net> wrote:<br><br>
<font size="+3">And to pretend that the democratic party is the
party of FDR, and is not bought off by the same corporate special
interests as the republican party is also denying reality.<br>
<br>
David Johnson<br>
<br>
</font>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 7/20/2014 12:57 PM, Stan via
Peace-discuss wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:duufrl7aiksi0oirqaylw21c.1405879055824@email.android.com"
type="cite">
<div>
<div>And to pretend that the Republican party of Lincoln and
Teddy Roosevelt is the same party as the Bush Republican party
denies reality.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><font style="color:#333333"><i>Sent from my Verizon
Wireless 4G LTE DROID</i></font></div>
</div>
<br>
<br>
"C. G. Estabrook" <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com"><carl@newsfromneptune.com></a> wrote:<br>
<br>
<div><span style="font-family: TimesNewRomanPSMT;">~ Nescire autem
quid antequam natus sis acciderit id est semper esse puerum ~</span><br
style="font-family: TimesNewRomanPSMT;">
<br style="font-family: TimesNewRomanPSMT;">
<span style="font-family: TimesNewRomanPSMT;">"Not to know what
happened before you were born -- is to be a child forever"
(Cicero). </span><br style="font-family: TimesNewRomanPSMT;">
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
<div>
<div>On Jul 20, 2014, at 11:27 AM, Stan via Peace-discuss <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>>
wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<blockquote type="cite">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;
charset=UTF-8">
<div>
<div>Thank you Debra you are exactly correct.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>At least Carl has admitted he is OK with electing
Republicans. It is quite humorous to hear him proclaim
the Republican party the 'war ending' party after the
Bush 43 years.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><font style="color:#333333"><i>Sent from my Verizon
Wireless 4G LTE DROID</i></font></div>
</div>
<br>
<br>
"C. G. Estabrook" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com">carl@newsfromneptune.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
Surely you don't mean that the Green party, in Illinois or
elsewhere, is "getting involved three months before the
election and using legal tricks and loopholes..."? You'r
thinking of the Democrats.<br>
<br>
As to "splitting the progressive vote in close races and
help elect Republicans," that may occasionally be a good
idea. From World War II to the invasions of Afghanistan
& Iraq, U.S. wars were begun by Democratic presidents
and ended by Republican presidents; and those two ongoing
wars have been thoroughly "bipartisan." The support of
soi-disant progressives for all of these wars is scandalous.<br>
<br>
The presidential election of 2016 may pose an anti-war
Republican from the Ron Paul wing of the party to a pro-war
Democrat, perhaps Hillary Clinton or Elizabeth Warren. <br>
<br>
In that case, the anti-war movement, effectively co-opted by
the child-killer in the White House, may reconstitute itself
in favor of the Republican. (The Green Party will remain an
antiwar alternative, if both neoliberal parties nominate
pro-war candidate, as they usually do.) <br>
<br>
--CGE<br>
<br>
On Jul 20, 2014, at 3:49 AM, Debra Schrishuhn via
Peace-discuss <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
<br>
> As long as only 20-30 percent of eligible voters vote
in primaries, we<br>
> end up with tepid candidates on the ballot and poor
choices in the<br>
> general election. The answer is not getting involved
three months<br>
> before the election and using legal tricks and
loopholes, but rather<br>
> to get involved 15 months or two years (or more) before
the election you hope to<br>
> affect. Increase the vote in primary elections and get
better<br>
> candidates to run in the first place. Once the general
election<br>
> candidates are chosen, the stage is set and third
parties face<br>
> overwhelming odds. The best they can do at that point
is, as Stan<br>
> says, split the progressive vote in close races and
help elect<br>
> Republicans.<br>
> <br>
> Debra<br>
> <br>
> On 7/19/14, C. G. Estabrook via Peace <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:peace@lists.chambana.net">peace@lists.chambana.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
>> Why is that the only alternative?<br>
>> <br>
>> "Act only according to that maxim whereby you can,
at the same time, will<br>
>> that it should become a universal law" (Kant).<br>
>> <br>
>> If everyone (or even just enough) does as I do -
vote Green - there is no<br>
>> problem.<br>
>> <br>
>> <br>
>> <br>
>> On Jul 19, 2014, at 9:50 PM, Stan via Peace-discuss<br>
>> <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
>> <br>
>>> As though helping Republicans win is the right
solution. There are few<br>
>>> starving people who would turn down a half a
bowl is soup because they<br>
>>> only want a full bowl of soup or nothing, yet
the supporters of third<br>
>>> parties continue to play into the hands of the
1%ers.<br>
>>> <br>
>>> <br>
>>> <br>
>>> "C. G. Estabrook" <<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com">carl@newsfromneptune.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
>>> <br>
>>> But it's the Democrats in control of the
legislature who have prevented<br>
>>> Illinois' paying its bills by refusing to tax
the rich.<br>
>>> <br>
>>> Voting for Democrats in Illinois simply
prolongs that acquiescence to the<br>
>>> 1%.<br>
>>> <br>
>>> Debs is supposed to have pointed out long ago,
"It is better to vote for<br>
>>> what you want and not get it than to vote for
what you don't want and get<br>
>>> it."<br>
>>> <br>
>>> <br>
>>> <br>
>>> On Jul 19, 2014, at 10:40 AM, Stan <<a
moz-do-not-send="true" href="mailto:swag901@ymail.com">swag901@ymail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
>>> <br>
>>>> AKA tools of the Republican Party.<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> The Greens have another chance to get
Republicans elected by splitting<br>
>>>> the liberal votes.<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> "C. G. Estabrook via OccupyCU" <<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:occupycu@lists.chambana.net">occupycu@lists.chambana.net</a>>
wrote:<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> THE PETITION DRIVE<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> On June 23rd, the Illinois Green Party
submitted 29,707 signatures to<br>
>>>>> the State Board of Elections in order
to place our full slate of<br>
>>>>> candidates on the November ballot - US
Senate, Governor, Lieutenant<br>
>>>>> Governor, Attorney General, Secretary
of State, Comptroller, and<br>
>>>>> Treasurer.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> Three volunteers in particular
collected an insane number of signatures.<br>
>>>>> Rita Maniotis collected 4,071, Sheldon
Schafer collected 3,246, and<br>
>>>>> Charlie Howe collected 2,066. Rich
Whitney, Scott Summers, and Bill<br>
>>>>> Kreml also collected over 1,000
signatures each. All together, 118<br>
>>>>> petition circulators came together with
many other generous donors and<br>
>>>>> volunteers in order to build the Green
Party in Illinois. The voters of<br>
>>>>> Illinois deserve candidates that will
stand up for public education,<br>
>>>>> teachers, children, the environment,
unions, pensioners, and progressive<br>
>>>>> taxation.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> THE CHALLENGE<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> Illinois is notorious for its backwards
and unfair "binder check"<br>
>>>>> process. It's a process that allows
objectors to challenge individual<br>
>>>>> signatures without any evidence, cause,
or consequences. An extremely<br>
>>>>> high burden of proof is automatically
put on the defense who have<br>
>>>>> already signed and notarized each
individual petition sheet.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> Karen Yarbrough, the sitting Cook
County Recorder of Deeds and a<br>
>>>>> prominent Democrat, officially
challenged our signatures on June 30th.<br>
>>>>> Make no mistake, this is at the direct
behest of Pat Quinn and Mike<br>
>>>>> Madigan. What this potentially means is
a grueling 3-4 weeks, 7<br>
>>>>> hours/day, of 8-10 people going line by
line through our petition<br>
>>>>> sheets, each with a hearing officer and
a representative for Yarbrough.<br>
>>>>> Independent Maps, in an attempt to put
a statewide referendum on the<br>
>>>>> ballot, just went through this process
and lost. Some hearing officers<br>
>>>>> tossed over 85% of their signatures. In
2006, putting our volunteers<br>
>>>>> through this process set the actual
campaign back until September with<br>
>>>>> our people already burned out.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> THE LAWSUIT<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> Rather than fight the Democratic
Machine and the State Board of<br>
>>>>> elections on their own terms, we've
decided to fight back by attacking<br>
>>>>> the fundamental problem, the election
code itself.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> On July 15th, Scott Summers, Green
Party candidate for Governor, and the<br>
>>>>> slate of Green Party statewide
candidates, filed a lawsuit in federal<br>
>>>>> court seeking to halt the state’s
“binder check” process and have key<br>
>>>>> provisions of the Illinois Election
Code ruled unconstitutional. You can<br>
>>>>> read more about the lawsuit here.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> RISE UP AGAINST THE MACHINE<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> Overturning these key provisions of the
election code doesn't just help<br>
>>>>> the Green Party. It doesn't just help
third parties and independents. It<br>
>>>>> would bust open the Democratic and
Republican primaries as well, making<br>
>>>>> it easier for all candidates to
actually get on the ballot and not be<br>
>>>>> subject to harsh and arbitrary legal
challenges. Our fight isn't just<br>
>>>>> for our party or even our party's
values. We're building multi-party<br>
>>>>> democracy in the United States and
right here in Illinois.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> Help us offset our legal and
petitioning expenses, and help us raise<br>
>>>>> funds to support our terrific
candidates.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> Donate here and better yet donate and
also become a Green Party member!<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> FOR THE LATEST NEWS, LIKE US ON
FACEBOOK<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> For more information about the Illinois
Green Party, see <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://ILGP.org">ILGP.org</a><br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> Illinois Green Party * 213 S Wheaton
Ave * Wheaton IL 60187<br>
>>>>> 773-809-4547<br>
>>>>> Paid for by the Illinois Green Party.
Contributions may be used in<br>
>>>>> connection with federal elections and
are subject to all federal<br>
>>>>> campaign contribution limits.
Contributions are not deductible for<br>
>>>>> federal income tax purposes as
charitable contributions.<br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> <br>
>>>>> ###<br>
>>>> <br>
>>>> <br>
>>> <br>
>>> _______________________________________________<br>
>>> Peace-discuss mailing list<br>
>>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a><br>
>>> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss</a><br>
>> <br>
>> <br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> Peace-discuss mailing list<br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a><br>
> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss</a><br>
<br>
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