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<font size="+3">So what if he works for Venezuelan TV- to me that
makes him a LOT more credible then some so called journalist
propaganda stenographer from the US corporate media.<br>
The UN does NOT operate ALL refugee camps in the world.<br>
You are the one who believes everything you see and hear in the US
corporate media, despite proven facts to the contrary time and
time again.<br>
What about those weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and the
yellow cake uranium bullshit stories ?<br>
I bet you believed every word of it at the time.<br>
Hell, I wouldn't be surprised if you still believe it.<br>
<br>
David Johnson<br>
<br>
<br>
</font>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 9/30/2014 12:01 AM, Roger Helbig
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote
cite="mid:CALZ0NqWtng5gfjE6pTDMrDBcRcRT1CFRguxktLZ5DFXAMT31Sw@mail.gmail.com"
type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">and he works for Venezuelan TV - that is probably
about as solid a source as Iranian PressTV that interviews
outright frauds like Leuren K Moret - I am sure he has got lots
on camera - you can always trick the camera - like the Italians
who made a big deal out of White Phosphorus being used to
illuminate the night sky and provide smoke to hide maneuvering
troops.</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Sep 29, 2014 at 9:57 PM, Roger
Helbig <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:rwhelbig@gmail.com" target="_blank">rwhelbig@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0
.8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">why would Chechen be in NATO camps - UN
operates "camps", not NATO - this sounds like it is pretty
poorly researched or just slanted to attract the far left
that wants to believe and wants to blame US/UK NATO for
the cause of ISIS. </div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Mon, Sep 29, 2014 at 3:45 PM,
David Johnson via Peace-discuss <span dir="ltr"><<a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net"
target="_blank">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px
0px
0.8ex;padding-left:1ex;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
<h1><big><big><big>Islamic State was born in NATO
camps</big></big></big></h1>
<big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div><big><big><big> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/op-edge/authors/andre-vltchek/"
target="_blank"> <img
src="cid:part3.06050709.04070207@comcast.net">
</a> </big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big> Andre Vltchek is a novelist,
filmmaker and investigative journalist. He
has covered wars and conflicts in dozens
of countries. </big></big></big></p>
<big><big><big> </big></big></big></div>
<big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div><big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div><big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div><big><big><big> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/op-edge/191620-nato-isis-camps-turkey-syria/"
target="_blank">Get short URL</a> </big></big></big></div>
<big><big><big> <span> Published time:
September 29, 2014 20:11 </span> </big></big></big></div>
<big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div
style="margin-right:0px;margin-left:0px;float:none"><big><big><big><img
title="" style="margin-right: 0px;
margin-left: 0px; float: none;"
alt="Entrance to Apaydin camp (Photo by
Andre Vltchek)"
src="cid:part6.07070808.04020203@comcast.net"></big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big>Entrance to Apaydin camp
(Photo by Andre Vltchek)</big></big></big></p>
</div>
<big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div> <big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div>
<div><big><big><big><a moz-do-not-send="true"><span
title="Facebook"></span></a><span>63</span><a
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<big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div><big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<div><big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big>Tags</big></big></big></p>
<big><big><big> <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/tags/arms/"
target="_blank">Arms</a>, <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/tags/army/"
target="_blank">Army</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/clashes/"
target="_blank">Clashes</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/conflict/"
target="_blank">Conflict</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/human-rights/"
target="_blank">Human rights</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/iraq/"
target="_blank">Iraq</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/middle-east/"
target="_blank">Middle East</a>, <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/tags/military/"
target="_blank">Military</a>, <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/tags/nato/"
target="_blank">NATO</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/politics/"
target="_blank">Politics</a>, <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/tags/syria/"
target="_blank">Syria</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/turkey/"
target="_blank">Turkey</a>, <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/tags/uk/"
target="_blank">UK</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/usa/"
target="_blank">USA</a>, <a
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href="http://rt.com/tags/violence/"
target="_blank">Violence</a>, <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://rt.com/tags/war/"
target="_blank">War</a> </big></big></big></div>
<big><big><big> </big></big></big></div>
<big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big>The West and its client states in
the Middle East are now bombing Islamic
State (ISIS) positions in Syria, killing
both militants and civilians, violating
countless international laws and treaties.</big></big></big></p>
<big><big><big> </big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big> Oil installations inside Syria
are in flames; the West <em>“informed”</em>
Damascus that the bombing campaign could
take three years, as if it would be the sole
owner of the Middle East. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> The fact that it is done with no
international endorsement is by now not
surprising anybody. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> There is nothing standing on the
way of this campaign; no air force is
defending Syrian territory, no
surface-to-air-missiles are fired. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> Yet, the US and the UK make no
secret that this is not just a campaign to
debilitate ISIS positions. The US is openly
declaring alliance with the <em>“moderate
opposition forces”</em> inside Syria,
which essentially means those forces that
are fighting to overthrow the government of
President Assad. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> Damascus’ plea for a broader
coalition to fight ISIS is being ignored. No
wonder – for years Islamic State (or ISIS)
was actually an integrated part of the <em>“opposition
movement”</em> supported, trained and
financed by the West and its regional
allies. </big></big></big></p>
<h2><big><big><big> Hezbollah is already fighting IS
</big></big></big></h2>
<p><big><big><big> The excuse or justification, for
the latest attacks against Syria, is simple.
British Prime Minister David Cameron told
lawmakers: <em>"This is not a threat on the
far side of the world. Left unchecked, we
will face a terrorist caliphate on the
shores of the Mediterranean."</em> </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> By this, he was perhaps referring
to that short Syrian Mediterranean coastline
dotted with the cities like Latakia and
Tartus, but also, most likely, to the entire
Lebanon, which, according to a regional
analyst, Michael Jansen, <em>“...is already
the third battlefront in the war against
the Islamic State (IS) and, like embattled
Syria and Iraq, it has neither the
political unity needed, nor the material
means to fight its battle.”</em> </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> It is enough to read Daily
Security Information Reports by UNSIOC in
Lebanon to see how serious the situation
really is. There are incursions from Syrian
soil by the militants, kidnappings and
constant arrests. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> But most of the people in the
region would definitely disagree with both
Mr. Obama and Mr. Cameron about on whose
shoulders rests the responsibility for this
disastrous state of things. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> </big></big></big></p>
<div
style="margin-right:0px;margin-left:0px;float:none"><big><big><big><img
style="margin: 0px; float: none;"
alt="Apaydin Camp (Photo by Andre
Vltchek)"
src="cid:part29.06010105.04050303@comcast.net"></big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big>Apaydin Camp (Photo by Andre
Vltchek)</big></big></big></p>
</div>
<p><big><big><big> Outspoken leader of Hezbollah,
Sayyed Hasan Nasrallah, spelled out his take
on the situation, in Lebanon, on September
23, 2014: </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> <em>“We are against American
military intervention and an international
coalition in Syria, whether that [action]
is against the Syrian regime or Daesh
(ISIS)... Under the false pretext of
fighting terrorism the U.S. seeks to take
control of the region...”</em> </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> Hezbollah is actually already
fighting ISIS, but, despite its great
popularity in Lebanon and in the region, and
its inclusiveness and great social projects
(or maybe because of them), the organization
is on the list of terrorist groups, at least
in the US and in several European countries.
</big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> It appears that the West is
making sure that Lebanon remains
defenseless, even as it appears likely that
ISIS could soon intensify its attacks or to
make a decisive dash across the border, from
Syrian territory. Weapons from France had
not been delivered yet, partially because
France <em>“worries”</em> that they could
be used against Israel. The US is blocking
any purchase of Russian weapons by Lebanon
(Defense Minister of Lebanon, Ms. Nouhad
Mashnouk visited Moscow trying to secure
delivery of Russian-made arms), because of <em>“the
tension between the West and Russia over
Ukraine.”</em> </big></big></big></p>
<h2><big><big><big> Region ruined, West controls the
game </big></big></big></h2>
<p><big><big><big> The situation is extremely
complex but what is clear is that the West
is pressing all the control buttons in the <em>“game.”</em>
</big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> It helped to create and to
strengthen <em>“Syrian opposition,”
including its most radical elements like
Islamic State. The goal was to depose
President Assad. Now when the ISIS went
“out of control,”</em> and began gaining
territory in both Iraq and Syria, their
brutality and military success are used as
justification for direct intervention in
Syria. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> It is becoming clear that no
matter what, President Assad would never be
allowed to win; even if (and perhaps
especially if) he is supported by the
majority of the Syrian people. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> As a result of actions taken by
the West, both Iraq and Syria are now fully
destabilized, or more precisely, they are in
ruins. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> </big></big></big></p>
<div
style="margin-right:0px;margin-left:0px;float:none"><big><big><big><img
style="margin: 0px; float: none;"
alt="Hidden camera Jordan - Syrian border
(Photo by Andre Vltchek)"
src="cid:part30.04090809.07080206@comcast.net"></big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big>Hidden camera Jordan - Syrian
border (Photo by Andre Vltchek)</big></big></big></p>
</div>
<p><big><big><big> Lebanon does not even have fully
functioning government or sound military,
and may be swept away by the destructive
tide. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> The region is now literally
flooded with millions of refugees. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> And the West is once again
pounding the area with Tomahawk missiles and
bombs. Several pro-Western Arab regimes that
are co-responsible for the situation in
Syria and Iraq - Bahrain, Jordan, Qatar,
Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates -
have joined the <em>“campaign,”</em> by
offering their jets. This way, there is some
illusion of legitimacy - their handlers in
Washington can trumpet to the world that <em>“they
are not in it alone.”</em> </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> While the <em>“threat of
terrorism”</em> and <em>“danger to the
region and its people”</em> are quoted as
the main justifications for the military
action, there is really very little logic in
those arguments, and many citizens of the
Middle East now simply believe that the West
is aiming at the overthrowing of the
government of Syrian President Assad, at
creating an independent, oil-rich, and
pro-Western Kurdish state, and possibly even
at igniting conflict with neighboring Iran.
</big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> It is also understood that things
could get resolved without the Western
bombing campaign; through the channels that
the US and EU would never use: governments
in Damascus and Teheran would have to stop
being pushed into the corner. In fact, Syria
and Lebanon would have to be allowed to
rearm and to be allowed to fight their own
enemies. And Iran would have to be
encouraged to join the fight against the
Islamic State (ISIS). </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> On 21 September 2014, AP
reported:<em>“Syria's parliament speaker
said Sunday that the US should work with
Damascus to battle the Islamic State
extremist group rather than allying with
nations which he accused of supporting
terrorism. Speaker Jihad Laham was
apparently referring to Saudi Arabia and
other countries backing rebels trying to
overthrow Syrian President Bashar Assad.”</em>
</big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> But the West is not aiming at
resolving the crises. It is pushing and
fighting for full domination of the region.
</big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> It is playing chess with both
white and black pieces. In between are tens
of millions of people, and entire nations.
Every move terminates countless lives. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> </big></big></big></p>
<div
style="margin-right:0px;margin-left:0px;float:none"><big><big><big><img
style="margin: 0px; float: none;"
alt="Barricaded government building in
Beirut (Photo by Andre Vltchek)"
src="cid:part31.07030208.04040302@comcast.net"></big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big>Barricaded government building
in Beirut (Photo by Andre Vltchek)</big></big></big></p>
</div>
<h2><big><big><big> Create them, use them, fight
them </big></big></big></h2>
<p><big><big><big> ISIS did not fall from the sky.
They were armed, financed and trained in the
refugee camps built for <em>“Syrian
refugees,”</em> in Turkey and Jordan. Both
countries are staunch allies of the West;
Turkey is on top of it a member of NATO. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> Several regional reporters,
including Turkish investigative journalist
Huseyin Guler and Ulusal’s TV documentary
filmmaker Serkan Koc, identified the camps
as training facilities, particularly Apaydin
in the vicinity of Hatay, near the Turkish
border. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> The fact that Jordan is offering
its territory for purposes of <em>“training
the opposition”</em> is no secret. Earlier
this year I worked in two refugee camps near
the Jordan-Syrian border: an old and
overcrowded Zaatari Camp and one new one,
which is still only partially operational –
Azraq. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> From testimonies given to me by
both refugees and local inhabitants, Zaatari
Camp has been used as a training facility
for <em>“Syrian opposition fighters,”</em>
for years. In the area, there was a clear
presence of both Saudi and Qatari cadres. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> The AP reported: <em>“Jordan is…
officially denying that any training of
anti-Assad fighters takes place on its
soil, though both Jordanian and American
officials have acknowledged it does.”</em>
</big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> The National, a daily newspaper
published in the United Arab Emirates,
reported on December 28 2013: </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> <em>“A command centre in Amman
or "operations room" as Syrian rebels
describe it, gives military advice to the
Free Syrian Army and channels weapons to
them for their fight against Bashar Al
Assad's regime… Rebels say there is also a
complex, shadowy system of weapons
movement, with diverse, sometimes
parallel, supply routes. The command
centre works with the FSA and the Supreme
Military Council - the FSA high command
headed by General Selim Idriss and allied
with the Syrian National Coalition, the
opposition political alliance backed by
Arab states and the West.”</em> </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> I investigated the situation on
the Turkish-Syrian border, in the vicinity
of the city of Hatay, on several occasions,
for both the documentary film I was
producing for Venezuelan TV channel TeleSur,
and for several of my written reports. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> The tolerant and multi-cultural
city of Hatay has been living in fear for
years, terrorized by those machinegun-waving
bearded jihadi cadres who were transplanted
there from Saudi Arabia and from the rest of
the Gulf, in order to train and radicalize
Syrian <em>“opposition fighters.”</em> </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> Apayadin Camp is where many of
the ISIS fighters have their roots. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> </big></big></big></p>
<div
style="margin-right:0px;margin-left:0px;float:none"><big><big><big><img
style="margin: 0px; float: none;"
alt="Entrance to Incirlik base near Adana
(Photo by Andre Vltchek)"
src="cid:part32.05070007.06040802@comcast.net"></big></big></big>
<p><big><big><big>Entrance to Incirlik base near
Adana (Photo by Andre Vltchek)</big></big></big></p>
</div>
<p><big><big><big> Serkan Koc, who has produced
several groundbreaking works on the subject
of the <em>“Syrian opposition,”</em>
explained to me in Istanbul: </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> <em>“Of course you do realize
that those people are not really ‘Syrian
opposition.’ They are modern-day
legionnaires collected from various Arab
countries, including Qatar and Saudi
Arabia, paid by Western imperialist
powers. Some are members of Al-Qaeda and
other terrorist organizations. Most are
militant Sunni Muslims. One could describe
them as rogue elements hired to fight the
Assad government.”</em> </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> Some of those legionnaires,
including those who belong to Islamic State
(ISIS) had mutated and began wearing several
hats (President Assad was warning for months
that they would). They are still after
President Assad whom they mainly hate for
being secular, and for belonging to the
Alawite sect, which is considered to be
heretical in some Sunni Muslim circles,
especially in the most radical ones. But now
they are also after non-Muslims and
non-Arabs, even after the interests of those
who actually helped them to come to life –
the West. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> All this is not unlike how
al-Qaida was born. It mutated from
Western-trained and financed Mujahedeen that
were first involved in the fighting against
the Democratic Republic of Afghanistan (DRA)
and later the Soviet Union. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> The West is historically using,
even grooming, the most horrendous allies,
be it Mujahedeen in Afghanistan, the
military and religious cadres in 1965
Indonesia, fascist military in Chile,
Paraguay and Argentina, or present-day
Ukrainian fascists crews. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> <em>“Syrian opposition”</em> is
just one of the latest editions. It is clear
who is benefiting: the military and
political establishment of the West, which
supplies the weapons, destabilizes
countries, even entire regions, and tries to
establish full control over the world. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> Then, if and when the situation
changes and a former client’s movements go
gaga, there is always another use for them:
they can serve as a justification for direct
invasions and further militarization of the
regions and the entire planet. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> First you create them, then you
use them, and in the end you fight them. </big></big></big></p>
<p><big><big><big> <em>“The only victims”</em> are
millions of people who are dying and
becoming internally displaced in the regions
destroyed by these brutal imperialist games.
</big></big></big></p>
</div>
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