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My 2 bits reaction to all this:
<div class=""> I’m mostly concerned about Trump on the issues of nuclear war, climate change and the environment. </div>
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<div class="">Some say that at least Trump desires agreement with Russia, but on the nuclear issue his policies have been dangerous. He continues the cold war policies of Obama, with trillion dollar upgrades to nuclear weaponry and by withdrawing from past
nuclear weapons treaties. (What does he have in mind?) Moreover, incitement of proxy elements with their provocations near the borders of Russia and around the middle east can lead to unpredictable, if unintentional(?), fatal mistakes. </div>
<div class="">Stephen Cohen has discussed all this [e.g., <a href="https://piirs.princeton.edu/news/historian-stephen-cohen-discusses-war-russia" class="">https://piirs.princeton.edu/news/historian-stephen-cohen-discusses-war-russia</a>]. </div>
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<div class="">On climate change and environmental issues, his policies could hardly have been more destructive, and will be hard to remedy.
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<div class=""> It is important to get rid of him and his cohort on these existential issues alone.</div>
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<div class="">Yet, perhaps all this is futile argument; Trump is unlikely to be removed from office, except possibly in the 2020 election.</div>
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<div class=""> Obviously, there are many other reasons to get rid of Trump, the most fatuoius being the "quid pro quo” Ukraine/Biden affair. <br class="">
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<div class="">On Nov 27, 2019, at 10:08 AM, David Johnson via Peace-discuss <<a href="mailto:peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" class="">peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a>> wrote:</div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Deb,<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">As bad as Trump is, is he really worse than the Presidency of G.W. Bush ?<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">I say nowhere near as bad as GW, who by the way if you haven’t noticed, the ruling class and their corporate owned media has been working overtime to improve
his PR image, including Ellen DeGeneres’s promotion and JOE BIDEN pinning a “ Medal of Freedom “ on him at a huge public ceremony. All crimes are forgiven if it is in the service of the ruling class.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">After thousands of voter referendums passed across the U.S. supporting the impeachment of GW Bush in 2005 / 2006 for WAR CRIMES, including in Champaign and Urbana,
what are the first words out of Nancy Pelosi’s mouth when in November 2006 it was announced that the Democrats had won both the House and Senate ?.....” Impeachment is off the table, impeachment is off the table “ !<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Like the Russia gate conspiracy hoax that floundered for lack of real evidence, this latest Ukraine Gate action is also nothing but a dog and pony show distraction.
Distraction away from the Democrats having to actually oppose Trump’s policies by advocating for issues that would improve the lives of the vast majority of the American people. But the DNC won’t do that because it will threaten their gravy train of corporate
donations.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">In the meantime, if Trump is such a threat to our country, why is it the vast majority of Democrats have given him almost everything he wants and then some. They
made a public spectacle of opposing Brent Kavenaugh but proceeded to approve all of his right wing judge appointments to the federal bench. They did next to nothing to oppose Trump’s tax bill, with even Chuckie Schumer saying ; “ WE agree with the principal
of this bill, we just wish we were consulted. “. Then there was Trump’s request for increased WAR budget. What did the Democrats do ? They approved it and added even more money to it. And more recently the Democrats gave Trump expanded powers under the Patriot
Act, which only ; AOC, Ihlan Omar, Presley, and Talibi ( The Squad ) voted against.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">So if Trump is such a danger, the supposed opposition party ( Democrats ) have a funny way of opposing.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class=""><o:p class=""> </o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">To quote George Carlin Deb, ; “ It is a big club and WE are not members. “<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Lastly, funny how Trump’s briefly delaying military assistance to the FASCIST government of Ukraine is a “ security threat “ to the U.S. ?<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">Instead of NOT supplying any weapons to Ukraine, which even Obama refused to do.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">The best way to defeat Trump is to elect a candidate in the Democratic primary who will advocate for issues that are popular with and will benefit the American
people. Like Bernie Sanders. But you watch what happens. If they don’t rig the democratic primary again with voter disenfranchisement and outright ELECTION FRAUD or the use of Super Delegates at the convention, the ruling class and the corporate owned media,
who supposedly hates Trump so bad, will instantly turn their propaganda campaign against Sanders and will support the re-election of Trump.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<span style="font-size: 14pt; font-family: Calibri, sans-serif; color: rgb(31, 73, 125);" class="">David J.<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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<b class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Debra Schrishuhn [<a href="mailto:deb.pdamerica@gmail.com" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">mailto:deb.pdamerica@gmail.com</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Wednesday, November 27, 2019 9:30 AM<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>David Johnson<br class="">
<b class="">Cc:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>C. G. Estabrook; Peace Discuss; Peace<br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [Peace] Robert Reich’s letter to ‘MoveOn’ CORRECTED<o:p class=""></o:p></span></div>
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David<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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I understand what you are saying and generally agree with the historical context you provide. However, the entire presidential succession is not the issue here. The issue is that President Donald Trump has behaved in a number of situations badly, illegally,
and unconstitutionally, and for those actions the Constitution prescribes the remedy of impeachment.<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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Sent from my iPhone<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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On Nov 27, 2019, at 8:42 AM, David Johnson <<a href="mailto:davidjohnson1451@comcast.net" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">davidjohnson1451@comcast.net</a>> wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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Deb,<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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The problems we have currently in this country did not begin with Trump in Jan. 2017. AS the democratically elected President of Honduras ( Manuel Zelaya ) who was deposed in a military coup by Hillary Clinton and Obama in 2009 because he was implementing increased
taxes on the wealthy and foreign corporations , increasing the minimum wage , and democratizing the constitutional system of governance in Honduras, said in an interview on Democracy Now several years ago when he was asked about Obama’s foreign policies as
“ boss ( Jefe ) “ of the American empire, Zelaya’s immediate response was ; “ The President of the United States is NOT the Jefe ( boss ) of the American empire.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Ever wonder why nothing changes for the better regardless which political party wins the presidency ? Same bipartisan belligerent foreign policy, same focus on privatization and austerity, same expansion of corporate and police powers. Same erosion of individual
rights, privacy, and freedom of speech.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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The problem the majority of the ruling class ( not the tiny group that helped Trump get elected – Adelson, Mercer, etc. ) has with Trump is that they wanted Hillary Clinton to win because she has a proven track record of being a loyal and dependable servant
of the ruling class. Trump on the other hand is an uncertain “ wild card “ who is a pure opportunist with no other ideology than that, and Trump was campaigning on issues ( that he had no intention of executing ) that was a threat to neo-liberal austerity
and neo-conservative foreign policy.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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The POTUS has power, but not as much as most people think. The corporate plutocracy ( the ruling class ) is the real power. In particular ; The financial sector, the military industrial complex, The oil / gas / energy sector, and the corporate owned media.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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Below is a recent study that proves this point ( from the BBC ) –<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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The US is dominated by a rich and powerful elite.<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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So concludes a<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.princeton.edu/~mgilens/Gilens%20homepage%20materials/Gilens%20and%20Page/Gilens%20and%20Page%202014-Testing%20Theories%203-7-14.pdf" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">recent
study</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>by Princeton University Prof Martin Gilens and Northwestern University Prof Benjamin I Page.<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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This is not news, you say.<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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Perhaps, but the two professors have conducted exhaustive research to try to present data-driven support for this conclusion. Here's how they explain it:<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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<i class="">Multivariate analysis indicates that economic elites and organised groups representing business interests have substantial independent impacts on US government policy, while average citizens and mass-based interest groups have little or no independent
influence.<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></i><o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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In English: the wealthy few move policy, while the average American has little power.<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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Eric Zuess,<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="http://www.counterpunch.org/2014/04/15/the-contradictions-of-the-american-electorate/" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">writing</a><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>in
Counterpunch, isn't surprised by the survey's results.<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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"American democracy is a sham, no matter how much it's pumped by the oligarchs who run the country (and who control the nation's "news" media)," he writes. "The US, in other words, is basically similar to Russia or most other dubious 'electoral' 'democratic'
countries. We weren't formerly, but we clearly are now."<o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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<b class=""><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class="">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt; font-family: Tahoma, sans-serif;" class=""><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Peace [<a href="mailto:peace-bounces@lists.chambana.net" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">mailto:peace-bounces@lists.chambana.net</a>]<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><b class="">On
Behalf Of<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></b>Debra Schrishuhn via Peace<br class="">
<b class="">Sent:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Wednesday, November 27, 2019 7:15 AM<br class="">
<b class="">To:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>C. G. Estabrook<br class="">
<b class="">Cc:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Peace Discuss; Peace<br class="">
<b class="">Subject:</b><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span>Re: [Peace] Robert Reich’s letter to ‘MoveOn’ CORRECTED</span><o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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First, I won't be drawn into a round of "whataboutism." Second, to insist that the issues of U.S. policy by and character of the chief elected officer are mutually exclusive is both naive and disingenuous.<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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On Wed, Nov 27, 2019 at 4:47 AM C. G. Estabrook <<a href="mailto:carl@newsfromneptune.com" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">carl@newsfromneptune.com</a>> wrote:<o:p class=""></o:p></div>
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And e.g. Kennedy and Clinton weren’t?<br class="">
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One of the most disastrous presidencies of recent times was Carter’s - it ushered in neoliberalism - while Carter himself by all accounts is a man of decent character.<br class="">
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The issue is US policy, not the character of the chief magistrate (as Sally Hemings might say).<br class="">
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<br class="">
> On Nov 27, 2019, at 4:06 AM, Debra Schrishuhn <<a href="mailto:deb.pdamerica@gmail.com" target="_blank" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">deb.pdamerica@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
> Or maybe it is because Trump is a lawless, bald-faced liar, cheater (in every sense of the term), underhanded, self-serving (and self-dealing), misogynistic, homophobic, xenophobic racist with no core principles other than his own advancement and that of
his cronies.<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
> On Mon, Nov 25, 2019 at 3:57 PM C. G. Estabrook via Peace <<a href="mailto:peace@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">peace@lists.chambana.net</a>> wrote:<br class="">
> Robert Reich’s letter to ‘MoveOn’ is an absolutely mad appeal by a self-proclaimed 'liberal' to get Trump out of office as soon as possible.<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
> Why is the political establishment so desperate not just to win the next election but to remove Trump now?<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
> I think that the answer is to be found in the US grand strategy , followed by all recent US administrations. That depends on maintaining the US control of the world economy by retarding the economic development of Eurasia. (Not a new idea - see the 'Open
Door Policy' of 1899.) Zbigniew Brzezinski wrote clearly of the US government's need to prevent the emergence of "peer competitors," Russia and China.<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
> Trump was the first major party candidate in 40 years to attack the neoliberal and neoconservative policies of previous administrations, which were designed to do that.<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
> In office, Trump has been compelled or cajoled to acquiesce in those policies, but the political establishment can't be assured that will continue, given the rising populist wave that put him in office. The threat has to be suppressed as soon as possible,
and a reliable neolib/neocon executive put in place (by a coup, if necessary, as Adm. McRaven recently argued in the NYT).<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
> The example of Obama - the first president to be at war throughout two presidential terms, who waged no less than eight wars to constrain Eurasia and protect the economic control of the US 1% and for whom stooges like Reich and McRaven are working, must be
followed, insists that establishment.<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><br class="">
> (Reich? McRaving? To avoid being Trumped? Do the gods of history have a sardonic sense of humor?)<br class="">
> _______________________________________________<br class="">
> Peace mailing list<br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="mailto:Peace@lists.chambana.net" target="_blank" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">Peace@lists.chambana.net</a><br class="">
><span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span><a href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace" target="_blank" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline;" class="">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace</a><o:p class=""></o:p></p>
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<span style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none; float: none; display: inline !important;" class="">_______________________________________________</span><br style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class="">
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<a href="mailto:Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">Peace-discuss@lists.chambana.net</a><br style="caret-color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration: none;" class="">
<a href="https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss" style="color: purple; text-decoration: underline; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss</a></div>
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