[CWN-Summit] FON

Thu Sep 7 15:42:55 CDT 2006

Hi all,

Local users and FON:

Fon does allow local pass-throughs that don't have to pay the $3/day
rate; you can set up usernames and passwords for guests who are allowed
through. This is what I'm planning to do to share the cost of my
internet connection with my two neighbors.

On the other hand, you have to set this through Fon's centralized admin
panel, not on your router directly, and it takes 24 hours to set
up...that seems convoluted. I'd like to be able to set public and
private network settings directly on my router.

Firmware:

@David Young: "universal hotspot" firmware has been available for that
router for a very long time, for free, open sourced...it's called
dd-wrt. Fon's firmware itself is based on dd-wrt. This is an open source
firmware developed for the Linksys WRT54G router, made possible because
Linksys used GPL'd components in their firmware build, which were then
released to the community. There's also an alternative firmware built by
Sveasoft called Public Alchemy, but there's a fee to download and use
that. 

dd-wrt allows a ton of features that no comparably-priced router can
match...like manual control of the router's signal strength, mesh mode,
repeater mode, VOIP QoS, etc. FON allows a few of these features.

The important thing about FON is that's easy to replace the FON firmware
with the original dd-wrt, enable the full feature-set, and then use
heartbeat to handshake with the FON server again. This gives you FON
service with much more control over your router. Assuming I have a free
weekend at some point, I'll explore that in more detail.

The point is also that this firmware has been available for quite a
while...but almost no one had really heard of it. Fon was the first
(that I know of) to create a centralized login portal and build the
"system" for this kind of wifi sharing, and also the first to market the
concept. You've heard of FON. You haven't heard of dd-wrt. Clearly,
they're having some effect.

Also, it's worthwhile to note that the firmware is only half the
game...you still need a centralized server to manage everyone's login
information, at the least. Otherwise, how does my router know to log you
in? It follows that all of our portals must also link up to this central
server, etc. That makes this a little less straightforward than a router
with firmware that magically does all of this.

Linksys offering it themselves:

For Linksys to offer the firmware themselves, they'd have to put in a
lot of work...who's going to maintain the central server and portal
system? Customer support? Pricing? Linksys isn't in the "bridge the
digital divide by creating shared wifi" business...they seem to focus on
the hardware alone. Also, a linksys WRT54G costs ~$60, while the same
router already hacked from FON costs $5. That's a pretty significant
price difference. Linksys seems to be happier charging more money and
offering support; FON charges less and offers less support, and operates
on an entirely different business model and target audience. 

FON Support:

Email response time has been reasonable, though their shipping times
have been reported to be a little crazy sometimes. Their marketing and
customer relationship management processes need a major overhaul. But
that's the whole point...get normal wifi with a $60 router, or get the
no-frills version for $5 with a lot of associated coolness. 

Rates:

It would be nice if the $3/day rate were lower, but I think you're
confusing the audience that's aimed at. The idea isn't to use FON to
share wifi with your neighbor, who would then be comparing $3/day with
SBC's rates. The idea is to offer wifi service as a hotspot, like at
Borders or at a restaurant or laundromat, where your customers are
comparing $3/day with what Tmobile charges for a hotspot (which is at
least double that, I believe).

It would be good if FON had a more streamlined process for modifying the
default portal page (though this could be done if you replaced FONware
with dd-rt and set up your own portal), so that users who *were*
interested in regular internet access could contact you directly to work
out a payment-sharing scheme. My neighbors know me, and so we'll work
this out...but what if someone from the apartment building next door
wants to share a connection with me, too? What if there are enough
people in this area willing to share that we could form a resident's
association, and grab a T1? An easier process to create custom portal
pages would make that a little easier to work out. 

Anyone else using FON? Ideas for where it could go? 

  Dave.

On Thu, 2006-09-07 at 13:31 -0500,
cwn-summit-request at lists.cuwireless.net wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
> 
>    1. Experience being a Fonero? (Ben West)
>    2. Re: Experience being a Fonero? (David Young)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2006 12:58:25 -0500
> From: Ben West <westbywest at riseup.net>
> Subject: [CWN-Summit] Experience being a Fonero?
> To: cwn-summit at lists.cuwireless.net
> Message-ID: <44FF0C41.1020005 at riseup.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
> 
> I am curious if anyone on this list has experience as a FONero, that is
> with sharing bandwidth on Martin Varsavsky's global wifi enterprise FON
> (http://en.fon.com/).
> 
> I am impressed by the number of people involved (84804 as of this
> writing), along with their venture capital from Skype and Google.  I'm
> also impressed that they're shipping wifi routers with their logo and
> customized firmware.
> 
> I also notice how FON supporters tend to be adamant:
> http://anina.typepad.com/anina/2006/06/from_beggar_to_.html
> http://knaddison.com/category/fon
> http://saltybeagle.com/?section=article&id=52
> http://www.cs.joensuu.fi/~cislas/blog/?p=40
> http://www.kimbach.org/2006/07/04/ive-become-a-fonero/
> 
> Just as FON's critics can be adamant, although they tend to focus on the
> activities of Mr. Varsavsky:
> http://tech.am/2006/08/01/my-last-day-as-a-fonero-bye-fon-hello-future/
> http://wifinetnews.com/archives/006267.html
> 
> My initial interest in FON was its global coordination, i.e. sharing
> your own wifi bandwidth gave you access to all FON hotspots worldwide,
> and promised potential $$$ to go to your DSL bill.  I also like idea of
> subsidized wifi routers, along with (somewhat customizable) captive
> portal software.
> 
> I am, however, a bit leery of FON's centralized billing process
> ($3/day), since at 1st glance, it won't let you set up local exceptions.
>  $3/day is already more expensive here than simply having your own
> broadband connection at home.  Max $10/month, along with a streamlined
> login process (or even connection caching) for existing DSL/wifi hotspot
> owners would be far more reasonable in my area.
> 
> In addition, I see that FON tech support is frequently lagging, or
> non-existent, tho I'm willing to be a local fonero tech support guy to
> help compensate for this.
> 
> Finally, I see that FON tends to float in sketchy legal status with
> ISPs, although much of that I'm willing to blame on staunch
> unwillingness from ISPs (especially in the US) to permit customers to
> share wifi.  The allowance to share DSL bandwidth, BTW, is one
> compelling reason to use the Speakeasy ISP in the US.
> 
> Could anyone share their thoughts on FON?
> 
> -- 
> Ben West
> westbywest at riseup.net
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 6 Sep 2006 22:53:20 -0500
> From: David Young <dyoung at pobox.com>
> Subject: Re: [CWN-Summit] Experience being a Fonero?
> To: cwn-summit at lists.cuwireless.net
> Message-ID: <20060907035320.GH6623 at che.ojctech.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> On Wed, Sep 06, 2006 at 12:58:25PM -0500, Ben West wrote:
> > Could anyone share their thoughts on FON?
> 
> FON's business model seems fragile to me.  If Cisco/Linksys put "universal
> hotspot" software on its routers, and other Linksys router owners were
> available for you to use if you activated your own hotspot, what value
> could FON add that people would pay for?
> 
> I see no reason the "universal hotspot" software could not be something
> free that runs on a PC or a "hackable" AP.
> 
> What is keeping SBC, err, AT&T from turning its customers' 2Wire routers
> into a universal roaming service by remote-controlling them over DSL?
> (I was pretty sure that was what SBC was up to back in 2004.  They really
> disappointed me!)
> 
> Dave
> 