[Peace-discuss] Re: [Wefta] military recruitment on WEFT (!)

[Dlind49 at aol.com]

An a request for censorship of ideas and individuals is not only very 
pervasive within the military but now invades the LOCAL peace movement.  I FIND THIS 
APPALING AND IT MUST BE STOPPED!!! Since 1967 my military experience has led 
me to be more active in the peace and environmental movement along with the 
rest of my friends and colleagues. These military, civilian, governmental, and 
media friends from all over the world have made a significant impact. We have 
published numerous books and book chapters, numerous magazine articles, numerous 
newspaper interviews, numerous televison documentaries, analysed, written, 
altered, and stopped numerous military operations spanning over 35 years, forced 
the military to modify operations and we ahve wrItten new procedures and 
military manuals to ensure or at least try to protect the environment. Maybe Bill 
does not want to hear about the other side and acquire information but I and 
my friends want to share our knowledge and experience to stop the nonsense.  If 
peace movement folks think that by asking warriors and the leaders who are 
driving this madness to comply with their wishes and stop attacking, destroying, 
killing, setting up operations, using horrible weapons, and to stop 
contaminating air, water, and soil with serious adverse health and environmental 
consequences just because it is wrong or immoral then the folks in the peace 
movement who request and expect compliance are in "lala land". You only stop the 
nonsense by making sure miliary folks understand the actual consequences of their 
actions and then you make them comply with their own guidlines and 
regulations. When existing guidelines and regulations do not work you write new ones as 
we have done for many years. You force congressional or governmental action not 
only from leaders here in the U.S. but other countries too as we have done.   
 Although I was working, and I still am on a daily basis, within the military 
system for many years and that includes congressional work and UN work, my 
venture into the peace movement came by invitation from AWARE as a replacement 
for KATHY KELLY, another old friend, when she could not participate in an AWARE 
teach in at the last moment. Peter called me the day before and asked me 
after Kathy suggested that he call and ask me me to help with less than 1 days 
notice.  I DID!  One thing that I have learned from all of my experience withn 
the military, peace movement, and law enforcement for over 3 decades is that the 
members of three groups do not interact and too many indivuduals within each 
separate group do not know the others or much about how the other groups 
function or their rationale behind their decisions.  Today all over the world "us" 
military types and yes "I AM A WARRIOR" have entered the peace movement and 
have made a significant and real impact- such as another one of our group named 
Scott Ritter for example.  Now maybe Bill does not understand that but it is 
obvious.

I THANK JOHN BALDRIDGE  FOR HIS COMMENTS.  

Our (my own and that of my friends and colleagues)  work and efforts are not 
limited to depleted uranium or weapons of mass destruction but all aspects of 
the military and law enforcement operations.  If you really want to make a 
difference then help us stop the nonsense.  You can make a real difference as we 
say in military intelligence and special operations by getting inside the head 
of your adversary  (the jerks who drive this ongoing nightmare) and 
understanding what makes them tick and what  CAN STOP THEM.  Funny how a community - 
AWARE- and folks such as Bill Gorrell ignore that some of the most vocal and 
successful peace advocates ( not just me) from within the military and government 
circles are right here in our own vicinity. While some in our local peace 
community ignore help and wisdom from within the system as part and I emphasize 
only a  part of the solution the rest of the world is knocking down our doors 
and asking our team for help.  Please check out www.traprockpeace.org  and  
www.adelaidefestivalofideas.com.au and www.ngwrc.org and www.sftt.org  and 
www.cadu.org and www.umfm.org and many other web sites. And our team is actually 
making a difference because we get the attention of media leaders, DOD jerks, and 
government leaders NOT JUST IN THE UNITED STATES BUT FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD 
who do call us for help or to respond to our actions and requests or who try 
to stop us because we are getting the message out. 

and this is where I come from in case you missed it.  It has been distributed 
and published all over the world: 

A Commitment to Peace
Major Doug Rokke, Ph.D.

September 18, 2002


    As I sit here tonight unable to sleep, my mind is considering the 
ramifications of potential and ongoing military actions and economic sanctions. As a 
disabled warrior with combat experience in two wars, Vietnam and Desert Storm, 
I can only hope and pray that the outcomes of these actions do not leave 
another trail of adverse health and environmental problems.  I have concluded that 
we must unite in a concerted effort to prevent additional suffering.  
Throughout the history of the world those who make a commitment to peace have endured 
isolation and retaliation when they challenged the individuals and 
governments seeking economic and political advantages.  A vision of peace where all 
nations can live together for the common good is an ideal dream but may be 
unrealistic.  War is the ultimate weapon a nation or leaders can use to control the 
allocation and use of food, water, terrain, shelter, and mineral resources.  
War occurs when nations or individuals fail to reach a satisfactory compromise 
on sharing of these limited resources.  Today we are reaching another 
crossroads in history where we must decide which road we follow. We can select peace or 
go to war.  One means life the other means death!  The prevalent modus 
operandi at this time of those seeking power and control is to threaten economic 
sanctions or military attacks in order to achieve their goals and objectives.  
This is unacceptable. We must act to with a unified and strong voice prevent 
nations and leaders from imposing their demands on others. At the same time we 
must make sure that those nations and leaders who pose a viable threat to peace 
are checkmated. But that does not mean that we result to military force.  
There are many options but only wise persons are willing to discuss and mutually 
select the option most beneficial to all.   Today information control is used 
to prevent discussion and debate.  If a person does not have adequate and 
validated information they will be unable to contribute to the resolution of 
serious problems.  We must ensure the complete dissemination of information even if 
that information reveals illegal or disturbing actions by our own or any other 
nation.  These ways to achieve peace will require a commitment of time, 
financial resources, knowledge, attitudes, life, liberty, and willingness to endure 
isolation and retaliation by any person who wishes to contribute towards the 
resolution of local, state, national or international problems.  The choice is 
ours.  We can select a life as a mushroom or we can select to act.  I select 
action for if peace is to be achieved then I must "let peace begin with me".   
       

**

SO IN CONCLUSION BILL ASKED FOR CENSORING MY VOICE.  Maybe he should call the 
jerks who do this everyday for government and military ask them for a job or 
least the bounty that is on my own and my team members heads and lives. I can 
give Bill their telephone number.  But because they already monitor this with 
DOD's carnivore computer program  they are probably jumping with joy at Bill's 
suggestion and hoping that it happens.  They might even give Bill a call to 
help them.  NEAT!  

But in the meantime - I suggest that everyone consider help from where ever 
and from who ever it comes from and really understand what is driving this 
nightmare and how we can stop it.  LAST THOUGHT TO SHARE IS THAT AND I WANT TO 
PUBLICALLY THANK TIM JOHNSON  AND HIS STAFF FOR ALL OF THEIR CONTINOUS HELP EVEN 
THOUGH MANY IN THE LOCAL PEACE MOVEMENT DERIDE THEM. In reality they are 
helping every day.   

doug rokke

** the original request follows*

Is Doug Rokke a WEFT Associate?  If not, please remosve him from this list
that is already too with communication between actual Associates.  Also, I
would ask the members of this list to stop replying to his messages and
sending me messages about how this guy is so cool because he works against
the use of depleted uranium weapons.  DU is only the top of the iceberg,
which is being publicized by many people who, unlike Rokke, sre real
anti-militarists.

DU weapons are definitely a scandal.  So is the rest of the military.  Why
criticize a small aspect of the militiary and then turn around and talk
about how otherwise our armed forces are great?  Is DU worse than cluster
bombs or land mines.  Is DU worse than doing everything the military can do
to brainwash millions of impressionable young recruits into robotic killing
machines (even if that affect is not the result, it is the goal!)?  Is it
not possible that the brainwashing succeeds in many soldiers with bad
results for their families?

I, for one, am not interested in receiving messages full of military
apologia.

Bill Gorrell

** John's response**

I don't know about the technical issues of the mailing lists in question.

However, I will say this:  It is ridiculous to criticize a person's
successful activist efforts by claiming they haven't done enough, or that
they aren't a "real anti-militarist."  Doug Rokke has been a tireless
advocate for the banning of depleted uranium weapons.  His military
credentials add great credibility to his voice because he has direct
experience, and these credentials have helped to gain attention and support
for this issue that otherwise would  never have been gained.

  The fact that active and former military personnel are active in the peace
movement is a very positive thing.  It also means that some participants in
the peace movement will have been influenced by the military culture, and
will natuarlly feel a certain loyalty to that culture.  This in no way
invalidates their contributions.

  You are correct, Bill, that much more work needs to be done.  But Doug's
contribution to the spectrum of effort for rational society is real, and
cannot be discounted.

John.