[sf-core] Re: [Peace-discuss] Iraq protest [sic]

[Andrew Ó Baoill]

Politics is the art of the possible. While there may be 29 or so (at  
present) willing to cut off funding immediately (which is what you  
advocate), there appears to be a small majority who would - if given  
an opportunity - vote for a 'phased withdrawal' plan

Now, you can take the view that it is immoral to push for a vote on a  
phased withdrawal because it's not a perfect solution, taking some  
period of time to end the war. Or you can see winning such a vote as  
putting us in a better situation than we are at present.

Impotent righteousness or pragmatic gains. Your choice.

Andrew

On Jul 16, 2007, at 3:38 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:

> Let me get this straight: you're working to get 51 votes in the  
> Senate,
> because you can't get 41?
>
> You're right that once elected members of the US Congress can say
> anything they want, they're not bound by their constituents' wishes --
> and, remarkably enough, the Congressional Democrats have chosen as a
> group to reject doing what they were elected to do, end the war.
>
> Instead of ending the war (as they could) they want to use its
> unpopularity to denigrate the other faction and increase their own
> electoral chances. They're actually willing to prolong the war for  
> that.
>
> Instead of participating in rallies organized by Democratic party  
> front
> groups, we should demand the Democrats do what they were elected to  
> do.
> --CGE
>
> Robert Naiman wrote:
> >
> >
> > Depends who you mean by "they."
> >
> > 29 Senators voted for the Feingold-Reid withdrawal bill. The  
> prospect
> > of getting 41 Senators to filibuster war funding is fairly remote.
> >
> > Sadly, we don't live in a European parliamentary democracy. For  
> better
> > and worse - mostly worse - there is no such thing as the  
> "Democratic"
> > position on anything. If you can win a Democratic primary and get
> > elected, you can say anything you want.
> >
> > But in any event, I submit that one doesn't have to support or  
> oppose
> > into any particular legislative strategy for ending the war to  
> attend
> > tomorrow's protest. It only takes 51 votes in the Senate,  
> apparently,
> > to confirm a Federalist Society hack to the Supreme Court. It should
> > only require 51 votes to stop the war.
> >
> > On 7/16/07, C. G. Estabrook <galliher at uiuc.edu
> > <mailto:galliher%40uiuc.edu>> wrote:
> > > This is a matter of barking up the wrong memorial.
> > >
> > > If the Democrats were serious about ending the war, instead of  
> just
> > > wanting it to use the the war to benefit Democrats, they could  
> do so by
> > > using the filibuster. Instead of voting further funding for the  
> war,
> > > which they continue to do, they could prevent any war funding  
> measures
> > > from passing the Senate. That requires only 41 votes, which  
> they have.
> > >
> > > --CGE
> > >
> > >
> > > Robert Naiman wrote:
> > > > There will be a protest tomorrow of the use of the Senate  
> "filibuster"
> > > > to block efforts to end the war in Iraq.
> > > >
> > > > Tuesday, 5pm, Veterans Memorial, Broadway and Main, Urbana.
> > > >
> > > > http://political.moveon.org/event/counterfilibuster/39352
> > <http://political.moveon.org/event/counterfilibuster/39352>
>
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