"Woowoo pilots" was - Re: [Peace-discuss] Pentagon

Thu Jun 28 12:06:42 CDT 2007

I am very reluctant to bring my personal background froward, but in this case I will admit that I served one tour in the Navy as a pilot. I have 960.4 pilot hours, of which 421.9 were flying single engine jet fighters. I also have 135.9 hours as a multi-engine pilot. Your arguments below are irrelevant regarding the black box "data.". 

  Anyone who has even flown knows that aircraft altimeters are extremely accurate barometers. But to serve as altimeters, they must be corrected for local barometric pressure. All airports post their altitude. A pilot on the ground at that airport can dial in the airport's altitude and then the altimeter will automatically show the barometric pressure at that airport. A pilot flying into an airport, particularly when on instruments, always obtains the barometric pressure at that airport (which is broadcast,) and sets his altimeter to that pressure, so his altimeter will read correctly for that airport. 

  Barometric altimeters are extremely accurate at ground level when adjusted for the correct barometric pressure. En route, their accuracy changes because they are flying between different weather conditions and barometric pressures, and that is why, when above 18,000, they are re-set to the "standard" (but almost in all cases, fictitious,) setting of 29.92. This makes the altimeters of all the aircraft in the vicinity read for the same pressure, although the altitude is almost certainly not correct. But everyone is using the same setting and thus the error is uniform - which is what counts. 

  But when you get close to the ground you get the correct pressure setting and your altimeter is accurate.

  Now the black box showed that the altimeter was never changed from it's above 18,000 feet setting of 29.92. Thus the altimeter would have indicated that the aircraft was at an altitude a couple of hundred feet below the Pentagon when it supposedly hit it. But the black box "data" showed that it was at the altitude of the Pentagon WITH THE WRONG PRESSURE SETTING of 29.92. THAT WAS IMPOSSIBLE. 

  THERE IS NO EXPLAINATION OTHER THAN THAT THE BLACK BOX DATA WAS FUDGED. 

  If you are interested further, I suggest you educate yourself at :

  How do planes know the exact altitude ?
  http://www.madsci.org/posts/archives/aug97/866507388.Ph.r.html

  Your statements below are as irrelevant as was your claim that nobody could have expected the hijackers to reset the altimeter. 

  You have my condolences.

"Chas. 'Mark' Bee" <c-bee1 at itg.uiuc.edu> wrote:

----- Original Message ----- 
From: Chuck Minne 
To: peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net 
Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 5:40 AM
Subject: "Woowoo pilots" was - Re: [Peace-discuss] Pentagon

Well, apparently I have not been unsubscribed - yet.

       This is woowoospeak for "folks are being nice enough to me that no one cares enough to meet the level of my ridiculous straw man 'unsubscribed'."  By the way, not only do you screw everyone on peace-discuss out of mail access time and possibly endanger their machines with your endless parade of the same tired debunked binaries everyone has seen a hundred times, by refusing to post in plain text you also prevent the software from '>'ing your quotes.  So now you get to wonder who said what - provided you read these through at all, something for which I've seen precious little evidence.  I'll try to indent more, you think up another snappy comeback.  ;)

You miss the point entirely on the altimeter settings.

      Nope.  We'll see in a minute how this typical woowoo transference stands up to scrutiny.  As usual.

 Don't feel too bad, you're not alone, so did the people who released the black box "data." Whether the "hijackers" reset the altimeter or not is completely irrelevant. However, the people who released the black box data have the aircraft hitting the Pentagon at an altimeter setting of 29.92. But that was not the correct setting, and they (the government officials who clearly fudged the readings,)

      lol  Oh, clearly.

 missed that completely. Oooops, when the altimeter is corrected for the actual barometric pressure at the time

       Cite?  Remember, for pitot tube instruments, you need the actual pressure and actual temperature at the _impact site_.

, guess what? The plane was too high to hit any light poles OR the Pentagon. 

       D'OH!  You showed me!  The Men In Black obviously sawed off the light poles, and every emergency worker who noticed is sleeping with the fishes or retired to Aruba. (What's wrong with this picture?)

In other words, because the "hijackers" did not reset the altimeter, and left it at 29.92, it (and the black box,) would have falsely indicated that the plane was flying several stories underground when it supposedly hit the light poles and the Pentagon.

         Odd.  According to your woowoo site, "All Altitude data shows the aircraft at least 300 feet too high to have struck the light poles."

         http://pilotsfor911truth.org/pressrelease.html  (While you're there, don't forget to 'Make a Donation'.)

        Which is it, Chuck?

        For insight into this question, let's do a little research.  I quickly found this:

        http://www.faa.gov/airports_airtraffic/air_traffic/publications/ATpubs/AIM/Chap7/aim0702.html

        If you go to the middle of the document, to the graph labeled "Lowest Flight Level Correction Factor", you see that for an altimater setting of 29.92, a correction factor of 500 feet comes into play.

        The following text is also illustrative:

        "b. Once in flight, it is very important to obtain frequently current altimeter settings en route. If you do not reset your altimeter when flying from an area of high pressure into an area of low pressure, your aircraft will be closer to the surface than your altimeter indicates. An inch error in the altimeter setting equals 1,000 feet of altitude. To quote an old saying: "GOING FROM A HIGH TO A LOW, LOOK OUT BELOW." 

         There certainly does seem to be a lot of error built into pitot tube altimeters, doesn't there?

         Now, let's take another look at that press release from your woowoo pals.  After noting that it _never_ makes the claim that no 757 hit the Pentagon, we notice:

        "All Altitude data shows the aircraft at least 300 feet too high to have struck the light poles."

         "The record of data stops at least one second prior to official impact time."

         "If data trends are continued, the aircraft altitude would have been at least 100 feet too high to have hit the Pentagon."

         Ok, so according to your pals, the aircraft would have been 100 feet too high.  At an altimeter setting where correction factors up to 500 feet are indicated.

         Your margin of error is now so far within the range of pitot tube instrumentation error as to be laughable, particularly with a timeline that merits an 'at least'.  Your 'Pilots for 9/11 bucks' apparently failed to hit the books - and if they're trusting their altimeters to within 100 feet on landing, they've got even more serious problems!  =)

          BTW, here's yet another 9/11 site article disavowing the no-plane theory.  But you hang on tight there, dude.

          http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/pentagon/index.html

          (If you stay true to the script, you will now once again offer me your 'condolences' for my being able to read and think.  Something of an odd choice of words for one with an open mind.  The funny part?  For BushCo to be responsible for 9/11 requires NONE of this.)
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