[Peace-discuss] Michael Moore on C-Span: SLACKER UPRISING; Elelction 2008; Vietnam revisited

[Jenifer Cartwright]

Yes, the torture accusation could be another one of McCain's face-saving lies, of which there are so many -- and this time with no pesky footage to prove otherwise. The story about his turning down early release for himself and allowing others to precede him to freedom -- and his reputation for fortitude in general -- seems to have held up... tho' those things don't jibe w/ his weepy denunciation of the US, or confession, or whatever it was...
 
On the other hand, would the Vietnamese be likely to admit having tortured him, even if they (or some of their guards, w/ or w/o their knowledge and consent) had?
 --Jenifer  


--- On Mon, 10/27/08, Robert Naiman <naiman.uiuc at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Robert Naiman <naiman.uiuc at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Michael Moore on C-Span: SLACKER UPRISING; Elelction 2008; Vietnam revisited
To: jencart13 at yahoo.com
Cc: "Peace- Discuss" <peace-discuss at anti-war.net>
Date: Monday, October 27, 2008, 1:18 AM

The more I think about it, the more I think that McCain made up the
torture story to explain why he signed a confession denouncing the
United States. The Vietnamese side of the story totally makes sense.
On the one hand, of course they saw McCain as a war criminal. As the
nurse in the Times story said, she would have preferred to kill McCain
rather than treat him. On the other hand, they had the "Ho Chi Minh
ideology" that saw the struggle with the US as political, and that's
why they saved McCain's life and nursed him back to health. So why
would they torture him? It totally contradicts everything else we know
about how they understood their interests in the situation.

In Dave Dellinger's autobiography "From Yale to Jail," he
describes
how the Vietnamese communists were mystified that US anti-war
protesters would march carrying NLF flags. "They should be carrying
American flags," the Vietnamese said. It's hard to reconcile that way
of thinking with torturing a high-profile US detainee.

On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 12:57 AM, Jenifer Cartwright
<jencart13 at yahoo.com> wrote:
> A lie detector test, what a good idea!... tho' McCain's told so
many
> whoppers this last year that it's hard to believe anything he says,
> including the torture stories. Interesting piece, thanks for the link.
>  --Jenifer
>
> --- On Mon, 10/27/08, Robert Naiman <naiman.uiuc at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> From: Robert Naiman <naiman.uiuc at gmail.com>
> Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Michael Moore on C-Span: SLACKER UPRISING;
> Elelction 2008; Vietnam revisited
> To: jencart13 at yahoo.com
> Cc: "Peace- Discuss" <peace-discuss at anti-war.net>
> Date: Monday, October 27, 2008, 12:38 AM
>
> The Vietnamese are saying that McCain was never tortured. Did he make
> the whole thing up? It's totally plausible, and would be typical for
> the right wing in this country. Maybe he should offer to take a lie
> detector test on his claim that he was tortured.
>
> 'John McCain Was Never Tortured in My Jail', says Tran Trong Duyet
>
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/us_and_americas/us_elections/article5010491.ece
>
> On Mon, Oct 27, 2008 at 12:26 AM, Jenifer Cartwright
> <jencart13 at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> Hello AWARE Friends,
>>
>> Michael Moore stumbles around at the beginning and end of this 1 hr 34
>> minute speech -- "Mike's Election Guide 2008" which
aired
> 9/18/08 and
>> 10/19/08 on C-Span... but the middle two-thirds*** is dynamite --
>> tremendously powerful, not to be missed.
>>
>> Moore's speech includes:
>>  -  promotion of his latest film, SLACKER UPRISING -- which, btw, your
> AWARE
>> friends are showing (at no charge) on Tuesday, Oct 28th at 7p in Allen
>> Hall's main lounge!!!
>>  - promotion of his latest book, MIKES's GUIDE to ELECTION 2008
>>  - condemnation of the Republicans at the head of the ticket; praise
for
>> Obama
>>  - ***an itemized account of US atrocities during the Vietnam war and
a
>> blistering attack on the US and the decision-makers in power at the
time,
>> and...
>>  - contention that the much-lauded McCain is no hero, but rather, a
war
>> criminal who deserves to be punished for the crimes committed
>> deliberately and systematically against civilians in Vietnam
>>
>> You can watch and listen by clicking on this link
>>
>>
>
http://www.c-spanarchives.org/library/index.php?main_page=product_video_info&products_id=281757-1
>>
>> and then clicking on the big round red flash video logo.
>>  --Jenifer
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Peace-discuss mailing list
>> Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
>> http://lists.chambana.net/cgi-bin/listinfo/peace-discuss
>>
>>
>
>



-- 
Robert Naiman
Just Foreign Policy
www.justforeignpolicy.org
naiman at justforeignpolicy.org

Ambassador Pickering on Iran Talks and Multinational Enrichment
http://youtube.com/watch?v=kGZFrFxVg8A




      
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://lists.chambana.net/mailman/archive/peace-discuss/attachments/20081027/92aefabd/attachment.html