[Peace-discuss] WaPo: Liberals, Dems, Women Abandon Afghan War

[E. Wayne Johnson]

The dumbing-down, Mediocritization, and hypnotizing of Americans has 
been going on for years.

I agree with everything Chomsky is saying except for blaming it on the 
teachers.

It's the sheeple who are at fault.

The poets and the painters can make them feel but its really hard to 
make them think.

On 8/20/2009 9:19 PM, LAURIE SOLOMON wrote:
>
> But Mort I was a teacher for several years albeit at the Jr. College 
> and College level and not at the primary and secondary school leave.  
> My experience was one of extreme pressure by  administrators and 
> colleagues to tone down my expectations and demands of the students, 
> to teach in a non-controversial manner material that did not challenge 
> convention, and to teach practical  things and not indulge in 
> non-practical theoretical speculation and critical questioning of 
> established beliefs and principles.  Many potentially good creative 
> skeptical teachers either buckled under due to not wanting to fight 
> the pressure or left teaching out of frustration.
>
> As for your having a couple of good skeptical teachers, no one said 
> that they never existed and do not now; and yes they do leave lasting 
> impressions.  As you note, "even so, 'delicate' questions were and are 
> too often avoided."
>
> *From:* Morton K. Brussel [mailto:brussel at illinois.edu]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 20, 2009 6:09 PM
> *To:* LAURIE SOLOMON
> *Cc:* 'C.G.Estabrook'; 'Peace-discuss List'
> *Subject:* Re: [Peace-discuss] WaPo: Liberals, Dems, Women Abandon 
> Afghan War
>
> So, become a teacher!
>
> I've had a couple good skeptical ones in American history classes in 
> both Junior HS and HS, and they made lasting impressions. Even 
> so, "delicate" questions were too often avoided.
>
> On Aug 20, 2009, at 4:49 PM, LAURIE SOLOMON wrote:
>
>
>
> Ah; but the rub is that students grow up to be the teachers.  As 
> teachers, they perpetuate the non-skeptical and non-questioning 
> attitude, which now is replaced with real professional and economic 
> vested interests in not questioning as opposed to when they were 
> students and it was a matter of the authority and power relationship 
> between student and teacher that kept then uncritical vessels for the 
> ranting of their professors. It would appear that each generation of 
> teachers teaches the next to be less and less critical and more and 
> more accepting of the established discourse.  Each generation of 
> teachers teaches the next generation of teachers to be dumber and 
> dumber relying more and more on a highly in-the-box technical 
> perspective with great reliance on technology over critical 
> intellectual thinking. The more things change the more they stay the same.
>
> *From:* peace-discuss-bounces at lists.chambana.net 
> <mailto:peace-discuss-bounces at lists.chambana.net> 
> [mailto:peace-discuss-bounces at lists.chambana.net] *On Behalf Of 
> *Morton K. Brussel
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 20, 2009 3:08 PM
> *To:* C.G.Estabrook
> *Cc:* Peace-discuss List
> *Subject:* Re: [Peace-discuss] WaPo: Liberals, Dems, Women Abandon 
> Afghan War
>
> Chomsky not so infrequently over reaches, as in the assertions below.
>
> Chomsky puts students on the same level as their teachers; most 
> students do not have confidence enough, knowledge enough, or are not 
> well read or experienced enough to challenge what is being told to 
> them in their classes. They do not have enough self command to say to 
> their teachers: /That's a ridiculous lie. You're an idiot . /
>
> Perhaps Chomsky is projecting onto others his own experience, but I 
> don't believe that that's an extrapolation that should be made.
>
> But yes, I would agree that students generally do not have enough 
> skepticism inbred in them in their prior lives.
>
> One should also be skeptical of Chomsky, all the while respecting 
> generally what he has to say.
>
> --mkb
>
> On Aug 20, 2009, at 2:32 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:
>
>
>
>
> /I don't think he goes far enough. I'd say there are certain things it 
> wouldn't do to think. A good education instills in you the intuitive 
> comprehension--it becomes unconscious and reflexive--that you just 
> don't think certain things, things that are threatening to power 
> interests.//
>
> Not everyone accepts this. But most of us, if we are honest with 
> ourselves, can look back at our own personal history. For those of us 
> who got into good colleges or the professions, did we stand up to that 
> high school history teacher who told us some ridiculous lie about 
> American history and say, "That's a ridiculous lie. You're an idiot"? 
> No. We said, "All right, I'll keep quiet, and I'll write it in the 
> exam and I'll think, yes, he's an idiot." And it's easy to say and 
> believe things that improve your self-image and your career and that 
> are in other ways beneficial to yourselves.
>
>
> /
>
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>
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