[Peace-discuss] ron paul - we can do better with peace

Fri Apr 30 20:38:13 CDT 2010

What Carl and Chomsky have noted, in my opinion, is that the Tea Party has (or had) some life in it.  It may be a dog in many ways, but it was noted a little while ago that a live dog has more opportunity than a dead lion.

It is quite unfortunate that those who could be allies so quickly want to dismiss the "populist uprising" as "astroturf" without any consideration of what is actually going on.  Its pretty easy to make accusations of the movement being
white and affluent.  Most Americans are white, and most of the Americans who have a stake in changing the system are
white. So what?  Its a granfalloon.  The race card is pretty flimsy, but it could be said that for many blacks, they have a stake in keeping the system the way that it is, even though many of us whites think they would be better off if the D/R system didnt buy them out as it does.  (I can anticipate tonnes of well-earned flaming from that comment.  Have at it, but it would be a diversionary thread.)

There are some good reasons to lump the Tea Party movement with the Liberty movement. and while one is at it, it works to lump the progressives kicking and screaming into the same pile.

The original Tea Party movement was not astroturfed, although it has indeed been Heavily Co-opted by the R establishment in much the same way as the Peace Movement has been co-opted  by the D establishment.  In both cases there is a remnant that has not bowed to Baal.

The thinks that the manipulators of the Tea Party and the manipulators of the Peace movement and the manipulators of the Progressive movement (and yea, the manipulators of the Liberty movement) do to diffuse away the enthusiasm and frustrate the higher ends of those movements do not change the fact that there is indeed a potentially unifying thread running through all of those.  

That unifying thread is that the American Democracy (call it a Republic if that suits one's dialectical blindnesses more comfortably) is a lousy joke and people ought to be mad as hell about the way they are manipulated, lied to, cheated, and robbed.  

The Frank Luntzes of the world and similarly sick genii scan the mindscape of the "movements" and try to find ways to drain off the political capital, censor the message, and give the masses a pretty lace doily for their mind.  The Dems have their Frank Luntzes and their willing supplicants and sycophants too.  The R's and the D's are quite simply two different arms of the same octopus who want you to keep thinking that Buicks and Oldsmobiles are somehow different and that a Lincoln is any other than a damn Ford.

I heard Sarah Palin give her speech in St; Paul in 2008 and I dont like her much at all.  But people relate to her because they think that she is "one of us" (wrong or right).  Actually W had the same sort of appeal.  Whether she or W or any of the other cartoon characters are real people or just electrons in a machine is irrelevant.  The people identify with the character just like the kids relate to Mighty Mouse, Mickey Mouse, or XiYangYang.  Ideology is bunk.  Manipulation of the masses is the only thing that matters.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: David Green 
  To: E.Wayne Johnson 
  Cc: Peace Discuss 
  Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2010 5:16 AM
  Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] ron paul - we can do better with peace

  I think Paul Street and Anthony DiMaggio have done pretty well in explaining that the Tea Party, as an organized phenomenon, is a Republican creation

  http://www.zcommunications.org/what-populist-uprising-part-ii-further-reflections-on-an-astroturf-movement-by-anthony-dimaggio

  An analogy might be made to MoveOn and the Democrats.

  The purpose of both is to avoid the fundamental issues--war, the economy, etc. There's a synergy--the Republican base gets aroused, and the Democrats look left and point right--"See what you'd have if you didn't have us?" 

  What problems I have with the Liberty message, I wouldn't lump it with the TPers.

  DG

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: E.Wayne Johnson <ewj at pigs.ag>
  To: Stuart Levy <slevy at ncsa.uiuc.edu>; peace-discuss <peace-discuss at anti-war.net>
  Sent: Fri, April 30, 2010 1:57:56 PM
  Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] ron paul - we can do better with peace

  There are a lot of what I would call "peripheral" issues that get mingled in 
  with the Tea Party/Liberty message,
  and it is too often at the expense of the core issues.  For me, the war has 
  always been a core issue, and the inability of the people to overcome the 
  ruling class's insistence on imperialism around the world is a major 
  frustration with the system.

  We had invited Cindy Sheehan and Bill Kauffman to the Liberty Fest but Cindy 
  was unavailable and Bill had a family-based commitment to keep after 
  initially saying he would be there.

  I see the healthcare issue as being one of an undersupply of medical care 
  persons and an unreasonable "standard of care" that isnt really a standard 
  of care ideology but rather an ideology of greed.  The US doesnt make enough 
  health care providers to meet the needs of its population.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Stuart Levy" <slevy at ncsa.uiuc.edu>
  To: "E.Wayne Johnson" <ewj at pigs.ag>; "peace-discuss" 
  <peace-discuss at anti-war.net>
  Sent: Thursday, April 22, 2010 3:03 PM
  Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] ron paul - we can do better with peace

  > On Thu, Apr 22, 2010 at 08:17:45AM +0800, E.Wayne Johnson wrote:
  >> interesting video clip with some joker from Indiana and disturbing 
  >> message and response,
  >> followed by Ron Paul.
  >>
  >> http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2010/04/ron-paul-we-can-do-better-with-peace.html
  >
  > Yes.  "We stand with Israel", says Rep. Mike Pence of Muncie, IN,
  > to resounding cheers.  Ron Paul, talking about military bases around the
  > world and other good stuff, got cheers too though not so resounding.
  >
  >
  > Definitely not all, but a fair part of Mike Shedlock's written commentary
  > on the above page could have been heard at an AWARE meeting --
  > "The US cannot afford to waste trillions of dollars keeping
  > troops in 140 countries around the world." or "The reason '95% of the
  >  Political Class support Obama' over Ron Paul is the political class
  >  in both parties are mostly war mongers.  Enough already!" or
  > "[T]he military complex has a vested interest in perpetual war."
  > Encouraging to see.
  >
  > Also very interesting is the Rasmussen poll linked-to from that page:
  > 
  > http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections2/election_2012/election_2012_barack_obama_42_ron_paul_41
  > Don't just read the headline.
  >
  > We read, for example, that *almost a quarter* of likely US voters now
  > consider themselves part of the Tea Party movement.  That's a lot.
  >
  > Of those, almost all believe that Americans are overtaxed, and trust
  > the opinions of the American people more than their political leaders.
  > (Gary Trudeau said it: "We want to take our country back!  -- From who?
  > -- From the people we elected to lead us!  Will you join us?")
  >
  > When Tea-Party-identified voters were asked about a
  > hypothetical Republican-vs-Democrat (two-way) race for President,
  > most said they'd vote Republican.
  >
  > But if the Tea Party were a party and ran in a hypothetical three-way
  > Tea-Democrat-Republican presidential race, and asking *all* (not just TP)
  > voters this time, the Democrat would win, but a Tea Party candidate would
  > draw almost a fifth of (hypothetical) votes.
  >
  > Just over half of Republican voters say the average Republican congressman
  > is *more liberal* than they are.  Just 20% believe the average Republican
  > congressman is more conservative than the average Republican voter.
  > That's a frightening thought.
  >
  > Of Republican voters, most (59%) think Sarah Palin shares the values
  > of most Republican voters.  19% of all voters think that Ron Paul
  > shares the values of most Republican voters (but about half of all
  > voters weren't sure whether he did or not).
  >
  >
  > So: if the Tea Party were a party and did run a candidate,
  > would it prefer a Palin (or a Pence), or a Paul?
  >
  >
  > Some questions would be easy.  Little need for social spending.
  > Equalizing inequality isn't something the government should have
  > a role in, I expect they'd comfortably agree.
  >
  > No "amnesty" for "illegal" immigrants -- even though, as one
  > immigration rights activist has pointed out, the history of this
  > country is *all about* amnesty, about escaping the shackles of the
  > past and heading freely into someplace new.
  >
  > But, what portion of the Tea Party's soul is anti-war and 
  > anti-imperialist?
  >
  > At last fall's Liberty Fest (thanks, Wayne!) I talked briefly with
  > the manager for IVAW member Adam Kokesh's run for US Congress,
  > hoping to gauge how important the anti-war message was for his campaign.
  > Even though I spoke admiringly of his IVAW connection, and mentioned
  > being happy about our Tim Johnson's turn against the war, it sounded as 
  > though
  > Kokesh's opposition to war was something they felt the New Mexico campaign
  > had to downplay.
  >
  > Altogether I heard very little at that meeting about opposition to war
  > (though I did miss the gubernatorial debate on the first day).
  > Some did raise it, and not only the Green-party candidates,
  > but war and US empire seemed low on the lists of most speakers I heard.
  >
  > This despite the fact that the $trillion we've spent, and trillions
  > we've committed, in Iraq and Afghanistan, are at least comparable to the
  > total cost (additional $1T over 10 years) of the health insurance bill
  > that's been the object of so much of the Tea Partiers' fury.
  >
  > Where's the fury over our violent pursuit of power around the world?
  > Was it there in the Tax Day tea parties, above the level of whispers?
  >
  >  Stuart
  > 

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