[Peace-discuss] Pull a Green Party Ballot Today!

Thu Feb 4 11:34:19 CST 2010

Ricky & Bob:

Bottom line, gentlemen - What do these principles mean that you will do in 
regard to the local Congressional election this fall?

Will you vote for the incumbent Republican, Tim Johnson, who claims that he was
wrong to vote for war against Afghanistan and Iraq, and that he will no longer
vote for money for Mideast war?  Or will you vote for his Democratic
challenger, David Gill, who will not make such a pledge?  Or perhaps no vote?

Regards, CGE

Ricky Baldwin wrote:
> I can't speak for the Greens, but I share Bob's analysis of this point of
> view.
> 
> The only thing I'd add is that, as an anarchist myself, I don't think it's
> necessary to boycott elections in every context, to prove that you're a real
> anarchist.  (Some anarchists I've known won't even vote Green based on this,
> what I'd call a mistake.  By the way, I also don't think you've somehow
> betrayed your principles if you vote for someone you don't entirely agree
> with.  Your vote is just not 'all that'.  It's a vehicle, a tool, a means to
> an end, and it's the kind we shouldn't get too worked up about in my view.)
> 
> But just on the one point, I'm an anarchist because I believe that  we'd be
> better off doing things a different way, and I want to work toward that goal.
> It does not necessarily follow that ignoring the existence of the very real
> power dynamics in our society (e.g. by boycotting elections) is that way to
> change that gradient.  I think it is not clear at all that this position even
> makes sense.
> 
> I do not recognize the 'legitimacy' of capitalism, either, but I am forced to
> acknowledge its presence and power, if only to struggle against it, but also
> and very frequently in order to put food on the table.  Is there another way
> to accomplish this?  Perhaps, for some. But if the solution begins, "Just buy
> yourself a piece of land ..." you begin a circular argument, as well as
> cutting out most of us who don't have that extra cash, to speak of.
> 
> No, these systems of power accumulation - state power, corporate power, etc.
> - are insidious precisely because they tend to restructure every environment
> to suit them (sort of reverse terraforming), cut off avenues of escape, leave
> no stone unturned.  Some people like to 'drop out' or just submerge
> themselves in their jobs and such, maybe buy a house in a cul-de-sac
> neighborhood with a big fence around it or a cabin in the woods and think
> they're safe.  But no one is safe.  Because if there is a dead man with
> pennies left on his eyes, 'they' are not done yet.
> 
> Likewise, in my view, if we try too hard to avoid the taint of association
> with The Man, it's possible to wind up just avoiding the nitty-gritty of the
> practical work that needs doing - something of course The Man may worry a bit
> over, on the theory of the dead man's eyes above, but it doesn't really make
> that much difference.
> 
> My 2c - Ricky
> 
> "Speak your mind even if your voice shakes." - Maggie Kuhn
> 
> --- On *Thu, 2/4/10, Robert Naiman /<naiman.uiuc at gmail.com>/* wrote:
> 
> 
> From: Robert Naiman <naiman.uiuc at gmail.com> Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Pull
> a Green Party Ballot Today! To: "Peace-discuss List"
> <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> Date: Thursday, February 4, 2010, 8:57 AM
> 
> I find Matt's argument here quite striking. I wonder how many activists in
> the Illinois Green Party share the views that Matt expresses here. If it
> turns out that these views are widespread in the Illinois Green Party, I
> think it should affect the calculation of folks who are interested in
> promoting progressive change in the world in which we actually live about
> whether the Illinois Green Party is an institution whose influence in public
> affairs they want to promote.
> 
> Matt argues that it actually doesn't matter who Cheryle Jackson is or what
> views she espouses:
> 
> "If Cheryle Jackson or anyone else on the corporate ballots was actually any
> good, then they had no realistic chance of winning in this rigged election."
> 
> Presumably, Matt is acknowledging here that he actually doesn't know anything
> about and doesn't care to know anything about Cheryle Jackson, a remarkable
> position for someone who presumes to educate others on public affairs. But in
> Matt's worldview, that information is irrelevant, so why bother acquiring it?
> All you need to know about the world is that you should vote for the Green
> Party.
> 
> Furthermore, one presumes that according to Matt's logic, so long as the
> election remains "rigged," no Green Party candidates will ever have a
> realistic chance of ever winning any election.
> 
> Therefore, in Matt's worldview, the call to vote for the Green Party is
> essentially a call for a boycott of the election. The only difference between
> voting for the Green Party and staying home is that if you vote for the Green
> Party, there is an official record of how many people participated in the
> Green Party-initiated boycott.
> 
> Note the similarity between Matt's argument and the old anarchist slogan, "if
> voting changed anything, they'd abolish it." Of course, anarchists with this
> view are generally electoral abstentionists. The only difference is that the
> anarchists generally don't exhort you to go the polling place on election day
> and vote anarchist.
> 
> Other folks here are more familiar with the Illinois Green Party than I am.
> Are these views widespread in the Illinois Green Party?
> 
> 
> On Wed, Feb 3, 2010 at 3:35 PM, Matt Reichel <mattreichel at hotmail.com
> </mc/compose?to=mattreichel at hotmail.com>> wrote:
>> Of course, I couldn't disagree more with the analysis that it is
> worthwhile
>> pulling a corporate party ballot. If Cheryle Jackson or anyone
> else on the
>> corporate ballots was actually any good, then they had no
> realistic chance
>> of winning in this rigged election.
>> 
>> The act of pulling a Green ballot in itself was a vote against
> the system of
>> corporate bribe-taking candidates.
>> 
>> In the end, over 5,000 people in the state pulled a Green ballot:
> a 60%
>> increase over 2008 numbers, despite turnout being about 1/3rd of
> 2008 across
>> the board. (Champaign County was the only major county that saw a
> decrease,
>> in large part due to the graduation and relocation of several
> active GP
>> activists from there)
>> 
>> Most of the increase occurred in inner-city Chicago, where
> residents have
>> the benefit of clarity that those of you in the cornfields might
> not have:
>> choosing among corporate bribe taking candidates in one of the
> corporate
>> bribe-taking parties is an act of futility. In the land of Blago,
> Rahmbo,
>> Stroger, Daley, Burke I and II, Dick Mell, and so on, this
> couldn't be
>> clearer.
>> 
>> Solidarity,
>> 
>> Matt
>> 
>>> Date: Tue, 2 Feb 2010 15:39:31 -0600 From: galliher at illinois.edu
>>> </mc/compose?to=galliher at illinois.edu> To: kmedina67 at gmail.com
>>> </mc/compose?to=kmedina67 at gmail.com> CC: Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
>>> 
> </mc/compose?to=Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
>>> Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Pull a Green Party Ballot Today!
>>> 
>>> My experience exactly. Without the kiss.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Karen Medina wrote:
>>>> Election judge to Karen: "Would you like a Democrat or a
> Republican
>>>> ballot?"
>>>> 
>>>> Karen: "You are not offering a Green ballot?"
>>>> 
>>>> EJ: "Would you like a Green ballot?"
>>>> 
>>>> Karen: "No. But aren't we offered a Green ballot?"
>>>> 
>>>> [... ] [Karen was voter 110 at her precinct at 10:30am today.]
>>>> 
>>>> Karen to 3 EJs in an otherwise empty poling place: "Have a
> wonderful
>>>> day! Hope you have a great turnout!"
>>>> 
>>>> EJ1 blows a kiss. A heartfelt good-bye.
>>> 
>>> 
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> 
> 
> 
> -- Robert Naiman Just Foreign Policy www.justforeignpolicy.org 
> naiman at justforeignpolicy.org </mc/compose?to=naiman at justforeignpolicy.org>
> 
> Change.org: End the war in Afghanistan Timeline for Withdrawal and Political
> Negotiations 
> http://www.change.org/ideas/view/end_the_war_in_afghanistan_establish_a_timeline_for_withdrawal_and_begin_political_negotiations
> 
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