[Peace-discuss] AWARE single-payer liberal vs. socialist debate

[David Green]

Actually, the majority already do understand that single payer is the way to go. So the problem is one of political organization and action. In the way of that we find both Democrats and Republicans who claim that single payer is not "politically possible." We find Obama saying that it would require us to "start from scratch." So it's clear that what is needed is a collective perspective from beyond "business as usual." We need to discover what it is that prevents that. It's not nearly as simple as a contrast between "pragmatists" and "ideologues." I actually agree with Mao on this one, in general terms.

DG




________________________________
From: Bob Illyes <illyes at uiuc.edu>
To: peace-discuss List <Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
Cc: melodye at nitrogendesign.com; claudia at shout.net
Sent: Fri, March 26, 2010 1:17:45 PM
Subject: [Peace-discuss] AWARE single-payer liberal vs. socialist debate

Claudia writes:

"The single payer movement will require people to be informed, and be willing to educate, and not attack others with whom they do not agree completely."

The reason for this war of words, which has made peace-discuss pretty much useless for some time, is perhaps best summed up by Chairman Mao in his short paper "Combat Liberalism":

"liberalism negates ideological struggle and advocates unprincipled peace... Liberalism is passive in character and produces the effect of helping the enemy...there should be no place for it".

Against someone who believes that liberal democracy is the best way to go, as I do, there is no middle ground that is of interest to this sort of socialist. It is all or nothing, including single payer or nothing.

On the other hand, if the subject is simply single payer health care rather than socialism vs. liberal democracy, the case is simple:

1) All industrialized liberal democracies but us have single-payer or something that is functionally equivalent (like the German highly-regulated and non-profit insurance system).

2) Therefore there is no reason to believe that we have to throw away our form of government to achieve what the rest have, or to doubt that we can have it. All that stands in our way is the hard work of making it happen. Due to democratic constraints, this will almost certainly proceed in steps.

QED


Bob


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