[Peace-discuss] [Peace] Fwd: "Panhandling"

[Morton K. Brussel]

So, what is he misunderstanding? 

--mkb

On Jul 24, 2011, at 9:07 AM, Karen Medina wrote:

> If Mort is misunderstanding, than how many others will also?
> -karen medina
> 
> On Sat, Jul 23, 2011 at 1:18 PM, Morton K. Brussel <brussel at illinois.edu> wrote:
>> Comments:
>> Poverty is a major cause of unpleasantness and criminal behavior, but to rid
>> society of poverty would not solve all problems of ciminality.
>> The Urbana city council was informed that some people were
>> alarmed/frightened by behaviors they encountered, and responded with an
>> ordinance. I do not believe that they conflated panhandling with violent
>> crime or race. Whether the "public" believes that is arguable.
>> Unfortunately, many opponents of the ordinance have conflated all those who
>> panhandle as innocents subject to racial and economic persecution. They do
>> not believe that even assuming certain kinds of panhandling is simply a
>> nuisance it is a significant problem to those feeling threatened. They
>> reject the notion that such a problem can have any regulatory solution.
>> There is poverty and there is criminality. Solutions must be sought for
>> both, not overlooked for either. We are not at the stage where this society
>> is about to tackle the problems of poverty and the underclass. Yet,
>> criminality still needs to be addressed.
>> Whether "aggressive panhandling" should be considered criminal, or simply as
>> mischievous or harmlessly unpleasant, is something for society to determine.
>> That is what I feel is at issue here.
>> Finally, I don't believe that the ordinance at hand can be effectively
>> enforced (Will police be permanently stationed at hotspots of
>> panhandling?), and it is therefore largely ineffective, hence useless,
>> except possibly as a dissuasive element. How dissuasive will it be? For that
>> we need data.
>> --mkb
>> 
>> 
>> On Jul 23, 2011, at 12:06 PM, Belden Fields wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> Begin forwarded message:
>> 
>> From: Belden Fields <a-fields at illinois.edu>
>> Date: July 23, 2011 12:02:30 PM CDT
>> To: CUCPJ <discuss at communitycourtwatch.org>
>> Cc: Esther Patt <estherpatt at hotmail.com>
>> Subject: Fwd: "Panhandling"
>> 
>> 
>> Begin forwarded message:
>> 
>> From: Belden Fields <a-fields at illinois.edu>
>> Date: July 23, 2011 12:01:59 PM CDT
>> To: casmyth at city.urbana.il.us, Brandon Bowersox <brandonbowersox at gmail.com>,
>> hdstevenson at city.urbana.il.us
>> Cc: Eric Jakobsson <councileric at gmail.com>, dproberts at city.urbana.il.us,
>> dwmarlin at city.urbana.il.us
>> Subject: "Panhandling"
>> Dear Council Members,
>> As per my comments before the Committee of the Whole about the way the word
>> "panhandling" had been conflated with violent crime and racialized in the
>> public mind by the initial proposed ordinance and the  way it was discussed
>> in the press, I share the concern that councilperson Robert Lewis has with
>> even the revised and improved ordinance.
>> What I propose is that the ordinance be named an ordinance concerning
>> Solicitation of Money From Strangers on the Public Way.
>> Then, the paragraph beginning with the words "Panhandling means...", under
>> Sec. 15-68, would be shortened.  The first sentence would begin: "Such
>> proscribed behavior does not include....."
>> If we are really focused on behavior, then even Santa Clause ringing a bell
>> for donations or a person selling poppies for disabled vets should not
>> engage in aggressive behavior.  The ordinance would thus really address
>> behavior in a general way and not a stigmatized subset of people.
>> Thanks for y;our attention.
>> Belden Fields
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