[Peace-discuss] Billy Graham

[C G Estabrook]

Naturally we wish our political opponents to be polite - and we take their scorn as an attempt to make up for the weakness of their arguments […]. 

But the question remains.


> On Feb 23, 2018, at 8:58 AM, Karen Aram <karenaram at hotmail.com> wrote:
> 
> The question maybe a fair one, but Roger’s statement: 
> 
>  “but that is what gets lots of people to suck up to you.  I wish that you would have to present information subject to the penalty of perjury and that when it does not measure up to being verified fact that you were hit with a year in jail, the penalty for perjury.  Then you might lie less than currently.”
> 
> proves that he is not concerned with truth, he is only concerned with vilifying those that attempt to present it. Why we have someone so intent on trolling and supporting war, the military, and making such immature accusations as he does, defies all logic. 
> 
> On Feb 23, 2018, at 06:32,
> 
> Roger Helbig via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>> 
>> FAB,  where exactly is this quote that you claim to exist - I rather doubt that anyone would model any bombing campaign on the attack on Dresden, but that is what gets lots of people to suck up to you.  I wish that you would have to present information subject to the penalty of perjury and that when it does not measure up to being verified fact that you were hit with a year in jail, the penalty for perjury.  Then you might lie less than currently.
>> 
>> Here is a pretty well written article about General Horner based on interviews with him - I am sure that none of you like the source since it is not ultra left, but it probably is pretty factually accurate 
>> http://www.airforcemag.com/MagazineArchive/Magazine%20Documents/2016/March%202016/0316gulf.pdf
>> 
>> Roger
>> 
>> 
>> On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 6:01 AM, Boyle, Francis A via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>> Before that war began, US Air Force General Horner publicly stated that the bombing campaign of the Iraqi Cities would be modeled on the bombing campaign of Dresden. Bush’s own Episcopal Bishop refused to pray with him at the White House the night Bush commenced that bombing campaign that exterminated 25,000 Iraqis. So Bush asked Billie and Billie was happy to kiss a certain part of Bush’s anatomy and give his Blessings and Imprimatur to this outright genocide in front of the American People on TV: Onward Christian Soldiers, Marching Off To War!
>> 
>> The Seventh Circle of Dante’s Inferno is too good for Billie. Fab.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Francis A. Boyle
>>  
>> 
>> From: Boyle, Francis A 
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 7:37 AM
>> To: 'Karen Aram' <karenaram at hotmail.com>; David Green <davegreen84 at yahoo.com>
>> Cc: Peace-discuss List (peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net) <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
>> Subject: RE: [Peace-discuss] Billy Graham
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> With due respect to you, I have no sympathy for warmongers. I was doing everything humanly possible to prevent and stop that Bush Sr war against Iraq while he was giving his Blessings to Bush exterminating 25,000 civilians in the Iraqi Cities by carpet bombing. I had to get my wife and kids out of town. Let him rot in the Seventh Circle of Dante’s Inferno reserved for warmongers! Fab.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Francis A. Boyle
>>  
>> 
>> From: Peace-discuss [mailto:peace-discuss-bounces at lists.chambana.net] On Behalf Of Karen Aram via Peace-discuss
>> Sent: Friday, February 23, 2018 6:38 AM
>> To: David Green <davegreen84 at yahoo.com>
>> Cc: Peace-discuss List <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
>> Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Billy Graham
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> One might think we’re being cruel to criticize the newly departed, but when we’ve lived with these false images throughout our lives, it’s important to uncloak the truth. The media and establishment present us with false gods.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> On Feb 22, 2018, at 20:05, David Green via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Graham's biographer has an article on Counterpunch. Graham's evangelical roots were in L.A., which explains why the LA Times of my youth carried such elaborate coverage of his mega-rallies at the Coliseum, 100,000 capacity at that time.
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Billy Graham and the Gospel of Fear
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Billy Graham and the Gospel of Fear
>> Billy Graham left behind a United States government in which religion plays a far greater role than before he in...
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> On ‎Thursday‎, ‎February‎ ‎22‎, ‎2018‎ ‎08‎:‎46‎:‎22‎ ‎PM, Karen Aram via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>> 
>>  
>> 
>>  
>> 
>> Bruce Dixon of the Black Agenda Report: 
>> Somebody should tell the truth about Billy Graham. He was a racist, rabidly anti-working class warmonger.
>> CECIL BOTHWELL, cecil at braveulysses.com
>> Bothwell wrote the biography The Prince of War: Billy Graham’s Crusade for a Wholly Christian Empire. He just wrote the piece “Billy Graham and the Gospel of Fear,” published by CounterPunch, which states: “When Graham succumbed to various ailments this week at the age of 99 he left behind an organization that is said to have touched more people than any other Christian ministry in history, with property, assets and a name-brand worth hundreds of millions. The address lists of contributors alone comprise a mother lode for the Billy Graham Evangelical Association, now headed by his son and namesake, William Franklin Graham, III. …
>> “Graham first gained national attention in 1949 when the publishing magnate William Randolph Hearst, searching for a spiritual icon to spread his anti-communist sentiments, discovered the young preacher holding forth at a Los Angeles tent meeting. Hearst wired his editors across the nation, ‘puff Graham,’ and he was an instant sensation.
>> “Hearst next contacted his friend and fellow [Time/Life] publisher Henry Luce. Their Wall Street ally, Bernard Baruch, arranged a meeting between Luce and Graham while the preacher was staying with the segregationist Governor Strom Thurmond in the official mansion in Columbia, S.C. Luce concurred with Hearst about Graham’s marketability and Time and Life were enlisted in the job of selling the soap of salvation to the world. Time, alone, has run more than 600 stories about Graham.
>> “The man who would become known as ‘the minister to presidents’ offered his first military advice in 1950. On June 25, North Korean troops invaded South Korea and Graham sent Truman a telegram. ‘MILLIONS OF CHRISTIANS PRAYING GOD GIVE YOU WISDOM IN THIS CRISIS. STRONGLY URGE SHOWDOWN WITH COMMUNISM NOW. MORE CHRISTIANS IN SOUTHERN KOREA PER CAPITA THAN ANY PART OF WORLD. WE CANNOT LET THEM DOWN.’ …
>> “Subsequently, Graham gave his blessing to every conflict under every president from Truman to the second Bush, and most of the presidents, pleased to enjoy public assurance of God’s approval, made him welcome in the White House. Graham excoriated Truman for firing General Douglas MacArthur and supported the general’s plan to invade China. He went so far as to urge Nixon to bomb dikes in Vietnam — knowing that it would kill upward of a million civilians — and he claimed to have sat on the sofa next to G.H.W. Bush as the bombs began falling in the first Gulf War.”
>>