[Peace-discuss] Bend the Arc

Fri Jul 6 23:48:01 UTC 2018

Where was your offer of "peace and reconciliation"? I missed it.

Like your friend Snarl, you're a crybaby bully. You can't tolerate when the
same tactics you use are used against you.

Robert Naiman
Policy Director
Just Foreign Policy
www.justforeignpolicy.org
naiman at justforeignpolicy.org
(202) 448-2898 x1

On Fri, Jul 6, 2018 at 6:36 PM, Karen Aram via Peace-discuss <
peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:

> Bob
>
> Okay, be an asshole, reject my offer of “peace and reconciliation” and I
> will be happy to continue to uncloak you for the lying “paid by the
> Democrat Party, dirty trickster” that you are. You have forced me to
> remember your lies and propaganda of Jill Stein, it is after all public
> knowledge, and as they say “a leopard doesn’t change its spots.”
>
> And, your statement: “There’s a whiff of anti-Semitism about it: let’s
> pick on them because they’re Jewish,” shows again, what you are. Painting
> anyone who appears to be a gentile, saying that which you don’t like, as an
> anti-semite.
> Again, I obviously credited you too highly, because thats a stoop so
> low……….
>
>
>
> On Jul 6, 2018, at 16:18, Robert Naiman <naiman at justforeignpolicy.org>
> wrote:
>
> I think that if you want to send the local BtA chapter to hell because
> they didn't co-sponsor this one rally, or you want to send BtA to hell
> because they don't work on Israel-Palestine when they explicitly set
> themselves up as an organization that doesn't work on foreign policy so
> they could recruit Jews to work on domestic justice issues who would
> probably be bad on Israel-Palestine without having to deal with the
> potential consequences of that, you'd be practicing the same politics that
> you're denouncing.
>
> As you know, we co-sponsored the Medea talk, even though it was
> co-sponsored by the Prairie Green Party, which I loathe because it gives a
> platform to Snarl, whom I loathe because he's an abuser who has been
> abusive to me personally. Nonetheless we co-sponsored the talk. We didn't
> pursue a policy of not co-sponsoring an event co-sponsored by an
> organization that gives the abuser Snarl a platform. We co-sponsored the
> talk anyway.
>
> I expect that the local BtA chapter will do good things in the future that
> will involve cooperation with people who have different politics. I think
> that's more likely if they're not subjected to thoughtless and
> opportunistic attacks from the ultra-left. But in any event, there are much
> better targets, as I said before, organizations in this town that can be
> directly tied to Israeli government abuses of Palestinians. Why pick on
> BtA, when they have nothing to do with it? There's a whiff of anti-Semitism
> about it: let's pick on them because they're Jewish, even though, by their
> own account, they have nothing to do with Israel.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Robert Naiman
> Policy Director
> Just Foreign Policy
> www.justforeignpolicy.org
> naiman at justforeignpolicy.org
> (202) 448-2898 x1
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jul 6, 2018 at 6:01 PM, Karen Aram via Peace-discuss <
> peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>
>> That maybe what you were told, but not what I was told, and as I said it
>> wasn’t just about Israel, it was about the politics of many of the
>> organizers.
>>
>> As to BTA, I have no familiarity with them other than this one
>> experience, and the article David just posted.
>>
>> We all should be unifying, they had their chance as an organization, they
>> chose not to do so.
>>
>> I commend you, given our differences, for working with us on the Medea
>> project in our continuing efforts to prevent further wars.
>>
>> On Jul 6, 2018, at 15:51, Robert Naiman <naiman at justforeignpolicy.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> It wasn't just that 'mention of “Palestine" might come up'. A number of
>> people in the group objected to specific things that they feared
>> "anti-Israel" people would say and they didn't want to be associated with
>> that.
>>
>> Full disclosure: I'm not quite a member, but sort of a lurker on the
>> outskirts of the local BtA chapter. I'm trying to encourage them to do good
>> things and not do bad things, within the ambit of what is realistic for
>> them to do and not do.
>>
>> I encouraged them to co-sponsor the anti-ICE demo on the basis of a
>> specific agreement about what would and wouldn't happen in the demo rather
>> than have a blanket policy of not participating in a demo co-sponsored by
>> SJP. A number of people were open to that, and I actually thought that
>> position might win out. Then I found out that they had decided not to
>> participate, following some conversations that I didn't see that I think
>> involved national BtA staff. So I don't completely know what happened with
>> that.
>>
>> I don't endorse the politics of many of their members. But I'm against
>> bashing them as a group for stuff that is outside their remit as a group,
>> as they understand it. Indeed, I've been encouraging them to stay out of
>> Israel politics, consistent with the national BtA line, because I know that
>> if they got involved in Israel politics  their positions would be bad. If
>> you want to attack Jewish communal institutions that actively support
>> Israeli government violations of Palestinian human rights, that's a
>> target-rich environment, there's a very long list. I don't see what the
>> utility for Palestinians of bashing BtA is. Perhaps it serves some other
>> objective. But picking on BtA isn't going to stop a single Palestinian
>> house from being knocked down.
>>
>> If you think you know more about this than I do, bring it on. You don't,
>> and I've got all day, and the next day, and the day after that.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Robert Naiman
>> Policy Director
>> Just Foreign Policy
>> www.justforeignpolicy.org
>> naiman at justforeignpolicy.org
>> (202) 448-2898 x1
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 6, 2018 at 5:26 PM, Karen Aram via Peace-discuss <
>> peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Because Bend the Arc, backed out of working with socialist/ Marxist
>>> groups on the rally opposing ICE we had at the Drury Inn, on the 23rd, we
>>> had over 300 people. They feared mention of “Palestine" might come up.
>>>
>>> That may not bother you Bob, but you didn’t back out of co-sponsoring
>>> Medea’s presence here even though association with socialists took place.
>>> You looked at the “bigger picture”, rather than petti politics.
>>>
>>> Yes, BTA did do their own rally on the 30th, though it would have been
>>> better had we been united.
>>>
>>> Also, these good things people do for their communities, and immigrants,
>>> isn’t a real solution.
>>>
>>> A real solution would be to stop creating the immigrants, who should be
>>> referred to as “refugees,” because that is what they are, refugees fleeing
>>> US wars and interventions, sanctions, NAFTA and crime.
>>>
>>> Attempts to keep the American people ignorant of the connection between
>>> foreign policy and domestic, supports and continues the killings and
>>> destruction.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jul 6, 2018, at 15:15, Robert Naiman <naiman at justforeignpolicy.org>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> The link works for me now.
>>>
>>> BtA was explicitly set up to be an organization that works only on U.S.
>>> domestic justice issues, not U.S. foreign policy, including not Israel.
>>> It's foundational, it's constitutional, that's what they were set up to do
>>> and not do. There is zero possibility of moving them on this.
>>>
>>> From what I know of the local chapter here, if they took positions on
>>> U.S. foreign policy, their positions would be horrible, certainly no better
>>> than those of the Jewish Federation.
>>>
>>> On the other hand, they're very good on opposing anti-Muslim prejudice
>>> and anti-refugee prejudice, which are also things that need to be done. I
>>> also understand that some of them are working to try to get the Champaign
>>> ordinance allowing landlords to discriminate against ex-prisoners repealed,
>>> which is another thing that needs to be done. And which project, I
>>> understand, could use some help right now from people who live in
>>> Champaign.
>>>
>>> So, why not let them work on the things that they're good on, instead of
>>> picking on them and trying to bully them for not working on issues that
>>> they would be bad on, which there is zero possibility that they're going to
>>> do in any event?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Robert Naiman
>>> Policy Director
>>> Just Foreign Policy
>>> www.justforeignpolicy.org
>>> naiman at justforeignpolicy.org
>>> (202) 448-2898 x1
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Fri, Jul 6, 2018 at 4:48 PM, David Green via Peace-discuss <
>>> peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> http://mondoweiss.net/2018/07/progressive-jewish-justice/
>>>>
>>>> Yes, it's still there.
>>>>
>>>> Just to clarify, Bend the Arc is a national Jewish progressive
>>>> organization with a local chapter; it is criticized in this article for not
>>>> considering foreign policy, which is the experience that AWARE members have
>>>> had with it locally.
>>>>
>>>> DG
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Jul 6, 2018 at 4:32 PM Robert Naiman <
>>>> naiman at justforeignpolicy.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> This link doesn't work for me. I searched on the web and that link
>>>>> doesn't work either. Maybe they took the article down?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Robert Naiman
>>>>> Policy Director
>>>>> Just Foreign Policy
>>>>> www.justforeignpolicy.org
>>>>> naiman at justforeignpolicy.org
>>>>> (202) 448-2898 x1
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, Jul 6, 2018 at 11:14 AM, David Green via Peace-discuss <
>>>>> peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> http://mondoweiss.net/2018/07/progressive-jewish-justice/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>> Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
>>>>>> https://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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