[Peace-discuss] [Peace] US presidential elections, the Left, and IP

Sat Jun 29 17:32:35 UTC 2019

In addition to Morton’s assessment, add Trumps sanctions on Iran, which are a form of war, and every bit as egregious, and devastating to the Iranian people as that which we criticized Madeline Albrecht for in relation to Iraq. 

While few deny Trump likely doesn’t want a military war, bad for business other than weapons, bad during an election year, this is just more evidence that it’s not about “the Party,” or individual President, but the system. 

> On Jun 29, 2019, at 09:53, Brussel, Morton K via Peace <peace at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
> 
> Interesting analysis, which I can mostly agree with: The the ultimate answer to this view is that which will occur in the next decade or so. This will concern what evolves from American foreign policy, and what will happen on the climate change front. 
> 
> It is noteworthy that trying to portrayTrump as “antiwar" is inconsistent with his "growing of" our military and national security arsenals while surroundiing himself with characters such as Bolton, Pompeo and Abrams. His championing of fossil fuels will likely prevent the measures essential to slowing down the global warming we now experience. 
> 
> Anf then there are his domestic measures, which I can only charaterize as ignornant and pernicious for this country and more widely. Environment, civil rights, education, corporate control, etc., etc., etc. 
> 
> —mkb
> 
> 
>> On Jun 29, 2019, at 8:51 AM, C G Estabrook via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
>> 
>> I voted for the Green party candidate in the last presidential election & expect to do the same in the next, given that Gabbard is not nominated. But I think the British ex-diplomat Craig Murray is correct:
>> 
>> 'Every now and then, I feel myself compelled to write something I know that the majority of my readers will not agree with. That is because I do not go along with left wing groupthink any more than I go along with the line of the Establishment. I do not subscribe to a set of opinions but attempt to consider every question afresh.
>> 
>> 'Wikileaks is much criticised for having published the leaked Hillary and Podesta emails, thus having “caused” Trump. At its extreme, this involves the entire evidence-free “Russiagate” paranoia. I find myself criticised for my association with Julian Assange on these same grounds.
>> 
>> 'The major answer to this is that it would have been morally wrong to conceal the evidence of Hillary’s wrongdoing, her associations with the Saudis and the Bankers, and particularly the rigging of the primary elections against Bernie Sanders by Hillary and the DNC. If I was accused of association with concealing all that, I would not be able to defend Wikileaks. Another part of the answer is that I am not sure any of this much affected the actual votes cast.
>> 
>> 'But the most important bit of the answer is that I am not sorry that Clinton lost and Trump won. I say that with apologies to all my American friends who are suffering from Trump’s harsh domestic policies and his version of the “hostile climate for immigrants” which we have long suffered in the UK. I do not underestimate the harm done by Trump’s penchant for trade wars, or his blindly pro-Israel policies and gestures, nor the continuation of the Saudi anti-Shia alliance.
>> 
>> 'But the vital fact for the rest of the world is that Trump remains the only US President since Jimmy Carter not to have launched a major war. In this, he is true to what he said consistently during his election campaign. I do not think you have to look any further than that for the explanation of why he pulled out of the attack on Iran following the destruction of the US drone. The mechanics of the decision-taking are not its cause, contrary to all the speculation.
>> 
>> 'I should take the time to congratulate Iran on shooting down the drone. The Americans have killed tens of thousands of people, all over the Middle East and Central Asia, using such drones. That they should holler so much when somebody knocks one down is ludicrous.
>> 
>> 'I am absolutely convinced that, were Hillary President, the Middle East would now be devastated by the biggest of all the recent wars, and America would have invaded both Syria and Iran by now.
>> 
>> 'Hillary was an enthusiast for the destruction of Iraq and Afghanistan and she was personally involved in starting the obliteration of the advanced Libyan state on the flimsiest of pretexts. The potential devastation she would have inflicted and the millions who would now be dead, maimed or orphaned outweighs in my view all the harm perpetrated by Trump. So my conclusion is this: I would far rather not have President Trump nor President Clinton, but forced into a straight binary choice I will take Trump. He has a better character; for all his faults he is the only one of the two who is not a psychopathic killer.’
>> 
>> 'How the Trump administration plays out, given the warmongering advisors from the political Establishment with whom Trump has surrounded himself, is a fascinating question. John Bolton is as near evil as any human being can be. Which brings me back to the faux left and their views.
>> 
>> 'In 2013, I spoke in a ceremony at the Oxford Union to give the Sam Adams Award for Integrity, of which previous winners include Julian Assange, Chelsea Manning, Edward Snowden, John Kyriakou, Thomas Drake and myself. Hundreds of students from the “left” at Oxford University were engaged
>> in a rowdy picket against the Sam Adams award aimed to stop the event because of the ridiculous allegations in Sweden against Assange.
>> 
>> 'Now get this. Exactly the day before, the Oxford Union had hosted an evening with John Bolton. Not a single member of the “left”, who tried to prevent Ray McGovern and I from speaking, had demonstrated against the egregious war criminal, responsible for the death of millions. There could not be a more stark example of the spectacular success of the
>> Establishment in using the false trail of identify politics to split and divert the left, particularly among young people.’
>> 
>> —CGE
>> 
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