[Peace] [Peace-discuss] Et tu, Brute? Chris Murphy bashes Obama, Kerry, UN on UNSC Res 2334

Thu Jan 5 18:15:01 UTC 2017

True of a good number of us ULGs (ultra-left gentiles) as well. —CGE

> On Jan 5, 2017, at 12:01 PM, David Green via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
> 
> Bob, I wasn't the only one confused by your original message, which seemed to be aimed at those of us you consider to the left of you in the pro-P movement. But you never elaborated on your message or my response to it.
> 
> In any event, I will inform Davis's office workers of my views, as I do in person regularly. I will point out to them, among other things, that nobody in our local Jewish community publicly expresses support for the Trump/Friedman approach.
> 
> DG
> 
> 
> On Thursday, January 5, 2017 11:30 AM, Robert Naiman via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
> 
> 
> Sorry, I haven't been paying attention to this thread and I have no idea what you are talking about and it makes no sense to me.
> 
> We supported the UNSC resolution against the settlements. We supported the Obama/Kerry decision not to veto it. We are pushing back on attacks on the UNSC resolution against settlements and we are pushing back on attacks on Obama/Kerry for not vetoing it. 
> 
> For example, we did this alert yesterday:
> 
> Congress: Don't Attack Obama & UN Security Council Opposition to Settlements
> http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/house-dont-attack-obama?r_by=1135580
> 
> And this morning, we did a call alert to the House on the same topic. 
> 
> Anyone here who cares about this could take half a minute to call Rodney Davis and urge him to vote NO on the Royce-Engel resolution attacking the UNSC resolution against settlements. 
> 
> Rodney Davis: 202-225-2371
> 
> For more background detail, see here:
> 
> Congress: Don't Attack Obama & UN Security Council Opposition to Settlements
> http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/house-dont-attack-obama?r_by=1135580
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Robert Naiman
> Policy Director
> Just Foreign Policy
> www.justforeignpolicy.org
> naiman at justforeignpolicy.org
> (202) 448-2898 x1
> 
> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017 at 11:21 AM, Harry Mickalide via Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
> Could you explain your position more Robert? Right now it seems like this is what you are saying:
> 
> "Sure, it's wrong for Israel to systematically erase Palestinians through settler-colonialism, but we cannot realistically expect this to stop so let's veto the UN Security Council for trying to stop it."
> 
> On Thu, Dec 29, 2016 at 2:05 PM, Carl G. Estabrook via Peace <peace at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
> “...it hardly seems helpful to focus on 'anti-Semitism' among Trump advisors…”
> 
> Exactly. The task would seem to be to discourage the colonization of the Trump administration by the neocons, as they did the Obama administration.
> 
> They were frightened by Trump’s opposition to the war party. Let’s encourage their fears.
> 
> —CGE
> 
> 
> > On Dec 29, 2016, at 12:26 PM, David Green via Peace <peace at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
> >
> > Bob, I get that politicians are afraid of displeasing their Zionist donors. Otherwise, I'm not sure what your point is. Perhaps I'm experiencing some end-of-the-year density.
> >
> > Nevertheless, look at the comments in response to the NYT editorial, as well as the editorial itself:
> >
> > http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12 /28/opinion/is-israel-abandoni ng-a-two-state-solution.html? action=click&pgtype=Homepage& clickSource=story-heading& module=opinion-c-col-left- region&region=opinion-c-col- left-region&WT.nav=opinion-c- col-left-region&_r=0
> >
> > Sort the comments by readers picks. This signals a significant change among liberal readers of the NYT. Admittedly, it is provoked mostly by their defense of Obama and their opposition to Trump. There is a certain superficiality regarding this issue among those who have kept silent during the Obama administration; but clearly there are a lot of repressed individuals who no longer feel they have anything to lose by criticizing Israel. And ironically, with Trump coming into office in reconciliation with Russia, he is also provoking sensible and perhaps effective opposition to his prospective hardline policy on I/P, including and especially among Jews.
> >
> > I can't imagine that this would have transpired with an incoming HRC administration.
> >
> > Under these circumstances, it hardly seems helpful to focus on "anti-Semitism" among Trump advisors, if that's what anyone is doing, and I fear that indeed is what JVP has been doing.
> >
> > Just food for thought.
> >
> > DG
> >
> >
> > On Thursday, December 29, 2016 11:36 AM, Robert Naiman via Peace <peace at lists.chambana.net> wrote:
> >
> > I try to tell my ultra-left friends about the terrain we're dealing with on I-P in DC. They don't want to hear it. They think I'm being a big bully for saying they can't have unicorns and ponies.
> >
> > So. Show don't tell. Exhibit 7,233. The court calls Connecticut Senator Chris Murphy to testify. Mr. Progressive Foreign Policy. Mr. I-want-to-be-the-Elizabeth-War ren-of-foreign-policy. To his everlasting credit, the first Senator to say boo about the Obama Administration's support for Saudi Arabia's catastrophic war in Yemen. Enter Chris Murphy.
> >
> > Speaking to MSNBC’s “Morning Joe,” the Senate Foreign Relations Committee member said the U.N. is “just fundamentally not a fair forum for the Israelis” and that the White House should have vetoed the Security Council measure condemning America’s closest ally in the Middle East.
> >
> > [my emphasis]
> >
> > http://www.politico.com/story/ 2016/12/chris-murphy-barack-ob ama-john-kerry-israel-donald-t rump-233026
> >
> > Chris Murphy's comment about the UN is pure sophistry, and Chris Murphy, as a not-completely-stupid person, surely knows it. Say the Human Rights Council is "not a fair forum for the Israelis." Fine. Say the General Assembly is "not a fair forum for the Israelis." Fine. The Security Council is not the Human Rights Council and is not the General Assembly, and as a not-completely-stupid person, Chris Murphy surely knows that. The United States of F*ing America has a VETO on the UN Security Council. NOTHING HAPPENS at the UN Security Council without US permission, and as a not-completely-stupid person, Chris Murphy surely knows that. Not to mention the subsidiary fact that to define Britain and France and even Russia as "anti-Israel," you have to define "anti-Israel" as "people who insist that we eat our vegetables before we can eat our dessert." If the UK and France are "anti-Israel," then your spouse who gently tries to suggest that maybe you've had enough wine to drink at the party is anti-Semitic.
> >
> > ===