[Imc-cleveland] Re: [IMC-US] The "USA" Label for the New Site

[patrick turner]

andy wrote:
>Pick another title.

andy, do you (or anyone else) have a proposal for a "title" that would 
address the problems with using the "U$", U$A, and AmeriKKKan type labels?

i think the main issues here are creating website to focus on the struggle 
from within the "belly of the beast" so the global site isnt dominated by 
news of interest to mostly people living in the "US".

this may be a problem of editorial choices made by the global editorial 
group on whether stories are really of "global" interest, but since i havent 
been active in the global network i cant say for sure...  por ejemplo, right 
now there is currently two features on the global site that deal with US 
based news, one is about US media deregulation and the other is about the 
meeting in sacramento of US and global ministers about deciding farm and 
food issues.  seems to me the trouble may be partly an editorial issue, a 
strictly US site will not completely solve an editorial imbalance especially 
if the majority of participation in global site comes from the US.

i do see the need for a site where people can go to find news on the 
struggles in the land shadowed by the superpower's stars and bars, and think 
it would help with the concerns about the inbalance of coverage.

i dont know if my analysis is correct, just my thoughts.

id like to see the project move along in "alpha" or "beta" form as we 
address these issues

aloha,

patrick
cleveland imc


>From: Andy Pyle <andypie at earthlink.net>
>Reply-To: andypie at earthlink.net
>To: Sascha Meinrath <sascha at ucimc.org>
>CC: IMC-US Working Group <imc-us at lists.cu.groogroo.com>, Cleveland 
>indymedia <imc-cleveland at lists.indymedia.org>, IMC-US-Process List 
><imc-us-process at lists.indymedia.org>
>Subject: [Imc-cleveland] Re: [IMC-US] The "USA" Label for the New Site
>Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2003 14:17:19 -0400
>
>I am heartened by the fact that my thoughts are being considered i had no 
>idea what the
>response would be.
>
>It doesn't seem to be enough that the local IMC collectives will each opt 
>in or out.  Seems
>likely to me that the IMC collectives may be made up mostly of tech or 
>media oriented "Anglo"
>persons while the surrounding populations are people of color.  Decisions 
>on self-determination
>should be made by the members of the oppressed nations, in their numbers.
>
>Two very casual and somewhat tongue in cheek  ideas: 
>"bellyofthebeast-US.indymedia.org"  or the
>perhaps confusing "babylon-US.indymedia.org"
>
>Sascha Meinrath wrote:
>
> > Hi Andy,
> >
> > After our discussions about using USA -- it was agreed to go with the
> > simpler "US" monicker.  Another main point that was discussed is that 
>any
> > IMC that wished to opt out of being a part of the IMC-US collaboration
> > could do so.  This would allow for local decision-making in terms of
> > whether to be a part of a national IMC collective.  As to your example
> > concerning Hawai'i IMC -- I think it's a decision best left up to the
> > Hawai'i IMC collective; if they wish to opt out of joining a US project 
>no
> > one is going to be angry with them.
> >
> > In terms of what the US IMC would be, I think the way it's being set up
> > addresses the very question of self-determination you rightfully raise.
> > It would be a collective of collectives -- where decisions about whether
> > (and how) to be involved are left to local IMCs.  It would be more of a
> > _resource_ that's made available to interested IMC -- an information
> > dissemination point for stories, and a communications network for
> > IMC-istas.
> >
> > Hope this alleviates your concerns,
> >
> > In solidarity,
> >
> > --Sascha Meinrath
> > Urbana-Champaign IMC
> >
> > On Tue, 17 Jun 2003, Andy Pyle wrote:
> >
> > > I raised an objection to the USA title at the IMC caucus meeting at 
>the AMC that was more
> > > of a gut reaction than an analysis, and there was also objection from 
>my fellow
> > > Clevelander Kris.
> > >
> > > My somewhat existential objection was based simply on the fact that I 
>was tired of hearing
> > > USA! USA! USA!.
> > >
> > > Actually my objections run far deeper and I want to apologize for not 
>being more
> > > thought-out and political during the caucus, I was kind of taken by 
>surprise.
> > >
> > > The question is a POLITICAL question and not a question of technique 
>and I think we have
> > > to put the politics in command of the tech aspect.
> > >
> > > The Question is "What is the USA and Who Gets To Decide?"
> > >
> > > As the US Gov't occupied and incorporated by force various pieces of 
>territory it took
> > > into itself various nationalities  which became oppressed nations.... 
>some would say
> > > internal colonies.  I believe in the right of self-determination for 
>these nations and
> > > don't think the US gov't should have the right to tell Indymedia that 
>"what it says goes"
> > > as far as determining what is "The USA"
> > >
> > > I am not going to try to rank in order of importance or validity of 
>analysis the national
> > > territories occupied by the US: Hawai'i, Puerto Rico, Occupied Mexico 
>(California, Texas,
> > > Arizona.......), the lands of the Navajo, Dakota, Iroquois, 
>Cherokee....., and what some
> > > call New Afrika, the former slave states containing the "Black Belt",  
>known for its rich
> > > productive soil (North Carolina, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, 
>Mississippi, and
> > > Louisiana.  I am simply going to use Hawai'i as an example.
> > >
> > > Would Hawai'i belong under a "USA.Indymedia" site?  Here is an 
>occupied country of its own
> > > nationality which was forcefully seized by the US military and 
>incorporated as one of the
> > > 50 States.  Even the US Congress has apologized for this act, although 
>they have not
> > > offered to give it back.  Would you include a Hawai'i Indymedia under 
>"USA Indymedia"??
> > > To do so would be to ratify the seizure and occupation.  Under the 
>present schema which
> > > just includes cities and regions, the question doesn't come up.  But 
>under the USA (!)
> > > schema, it does.
> > >
> > > And how about Los Angeles, Houston, Atlanta.......  Its a can of 
>worms.
> > >
> > > Let us contrast ourselves to the evil French political theorist 
>Chauvin who made his mark
> > > as a rabid nationalist and gave rise to the epithet "Chauvinist".
> > >
> > > This question of self-determination is not for Indymedia to decide. It 
>is a question of
> > > principle. It is for the peoples of the oppressed nationalities to 
>decide. We are living
> > > in a prisonhouse of nations-the phrase is from Lenin- and should stay 
>away from the
> > > great-nation chauvinism that the USA.Indymedia title implies.
> > >
> > > Pick another title.
>
>_________________________________________________________
>"The only truly revolutionary act today
>is to tell the truth about everything."
>  -- Robert Anton Wilson
>http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/imc-cleveland

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