[Peace-discuss] response to Carl

[C. G. Estabrook]

You confirm my account of your remark, Danielle: "... if you were asking
me to fight for 24/7 free speech in the mall -- going so far as to kill
the project over that issue -- I would not."  And, as I said, I think that
opinion is general on the Urbana city council, as the Wal-Mart issue
indicates.

But civil liberties are at stake here -- freedom of speech and freedom of
assembly.  The Bill of Rights guarantees them for the public square, but
we know that paper rights mean little unless people insist upon them.  As
malls take over the function of public squares, those rights must be
insisted on there, as well -- "24/7."  And that must be done by political
authorities at the state and local levels, because courts recognize rights
only when people insist on them.

You said that you were unwilling to insist on them in this case for fear
of breaking the deal, but I think you should.

Regards, Carl


On Wed, 1 Dec 2004, Danielle Chynoweth wrote:

> Carl (and audience), You have misrepresented my statements.  I said
> that that if you were asking me to fight for 24/7 free speech in the
> mall - going so far as to kill the project over that issue - I would
> not.  Why?  Because I am a "fake liberal"?  Stop making straw men so
> you can feel superior - enough already. My statement was a strategic
> rather than philosphic statement.  If everyone was ready to drop
> everything and make 24/7 free speech in the mall THE priority, then I
> am ready to join YOU.  I did not at all get a sense from the group
> that they were ready to make this this biggest fight.  If it was the
> biggest fight, you would have organized a giant force on this issue
> well before last Sunday.  What I was explaining what the magnitude of
> a fight it would be and where I thought I could make change NOW given
> the support I have (which is often very little). I was not explaining
> my philosophical stand on free speech versus business interests.
> 
> Since the AWARE meeting you have spent zero time working on this issue
> since you prefer to talk rather than organize.  I am an organizer.  I
> have spent many hours on this issue since the AWARE meeting.  I have
> fought with Lincoln Square and city adminstrators, called Mort, Susan,
> and Durl, and taken the lead on this - because it is the right thing
> to do for Urbana.  My goal is to do as much as I can to make Urbana a
> better place rather than stay on my high horse, insult my allies, get
> nothing, and cry like a victim on the outside of the gates.
> 
> Too many of my fellow progressives prefer "purity" over engaging those
> around them to make change.  Change is made by putting one foot in
> front of the other, not by flying high over everyone else looking down
> on them spouting criticism.
> 
> Don't e-mail me back your whitticisms, start organizing! peace out, -
> Danielle
> 
> 
> > Did I understand Danielle (a member of the Urbana city council) correctly
> > when she seemed to say that, if she had to choose between free speech
> > ("24/7") and business interests in the new mall (because the developers
> > "wouldn't go for it"), she'd choose the latter?  That may be a general
> > opinion on the supposedly liberal Urbana council, which notoriously placed
> > business interests before those of its citizens in the Wal-Mart matter,
> > but it seems to me a serious mistake.  Perhaps that political work will
> > have to start at home for Urbana residents. --CGE
> 
> 
> 
> 
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