[Peace-discuss] The people

[John W.]

At 03:41 PM 7/23/2007, n.dahlheim at mchsi.com wrote:

>The people are sovereign---I agree with that in principle.  But, I don't 
>think the masses will translate this
>principle into meaningful action.  That will require people acting with 
>responsibility.  People will need to
>be organized and responsible...  Something people will not do easily.  We 
>are way, way behind the 8-ball
>here as a nation in having an informed, organized populace eager to fight 
>government corruption.


It's a nice theory.  I can't concede, however, the "fact" of the people's 
sovereignty.

Perhaps the proper question is, will we the sovereign people of America 
have to become as desperately poor and oppressed as the East Germans were 
before we rise up and overthrow the corrupt tyrants who rule us?

And there are other examples where your illustration doesn't hold true, 
Bob.  In Haiti, much of Central and South America, and most of Africa, the 
"sovereign" people have been brutally oppressed for hundreds of years, 
first by outside colonial powers and more recently by their own home-grown 
dictators in alliance with corporate imperialism.  What does "sovereign" 
mean, in practice, when you're desperately poor and oppressed?  It doesn't 
put food on the table.

You, Bob, speak as one who has never really known want, never been 
threatened with brutal repression and death merely for daring to express 
his beliefs.  And that's why I agree with Nick...too many Americans are 
surfeit with material goods and a false sense of security to rise up 
against their oppressors.  It ain't gonna happen here.

John Wason



>----------------------  Original Message:  ---------------------
>From:    Bob Illyes <illyes at uiuc.edu>
>To:      peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
>Subject: [Peace-discuss] The people
>Date:    Mon, 23 Jul 2007 20:37:07 +0000
>
> > The people are sovereign, Nick. This is not an abstract concept. It is a
> > fact. The DNC and RNC know this, and they dread that the people might
> > realize it, because if the people realized that they were in charge, they
> > would act, and the folks in the DNC and RNC would be looking for useful
> > employment.
> >
> > Revolution is not required. In East Germany, the people just showed up in
> > the streets. As far as I know, no shot was fired. Their argument was not
> > with communism, it was with corruption. The bad guys filled suitcases with
> > money and left town in a hurry. They knew that the people were sovereign.
> >
> > Bob