[Peace-discuss] Will the American people have a choice in 2008?

[Ricky Baldwin]

And good riddance to Ron Paul
[http://senate.ontheissues.org/Ron_Paul.htm].

But I think the point is not necessarily to WIN the
presidency, but to INFLUENCE it.  

In my opinion, supporting Dennis Kucinich is an
excellent way to do this for a serious peace and
justice movement.  Ralph Nader is another.

But I think ultimately what we must begin to take
seriously is our power as ordinary people, which goes
far beyond our (somewhat marginal) ability to vote -
that is, to cast the straw that breaks the camel's
back on one night in November.  Our strength is in our
numbers and our diverse backgrounds and in our
speaking up and stirring up trouble for the status
quo, when we choose to do it, to speak our minds and
vote with our feet and heads and hands all year round,
every year.  Our grassroots activism.

WE HAVE A CHOICE EVERY DAY!

Far too often, I think, the Left or Progressive
groups/individuals in the US begin negotiating over
how little we can get before the campaigns even get
started, much less the primaries or - god forbid - the
election!  We act like brokers - but with so little to
trade, because we have frittered it away.  So many of
us, who are pleased to call ourselves practical
people, fly out of the gate repeating what the most
mediocre campaigns/candidates are telling us we want
or can get.

But campaigns, candidates, and even presidents have
shown themselves to be much more responsive to a
mobilized electorate with a fire in its belly, that
makes demands, that tells THEM what WE want.

That's our choice.  Every election, every year, every
day.  We can pull or be pushed.

And, by the way, I've always loved George Carlin - I
remember when I was a kid and saw him stamping around
the stage making fun of the racism and the Freudian
machismo of shooting big phallic missiles over "always
to bomb the brown people".  And if he says the
American people are stupid (well, nobody ever went
broke...), I take that as his way of critiquing the
patritic hegemony, maybe chiding people into
questioning why we allow these things to happen.  I'd
count him on our side.  But he's not an organizer,
he's a comedian.  Sorry, but let's not get too serious
about his jokes, OK?

Ricky

--- n.dahlheim at mchsi.com wrote:

> Well, no...  They won't.  Kucinich won't be allowed
> near the Presidency.  
> Neither will Ron Paul on the 
> libertarian side...
> 
> "...Americans will probably remain willfully
> ignorant of the big red, white and 
> blue dick being jammed 
> up their assholes everyday. The owners of this
> country know the truth. It's 
> called the American Dream, 
> because you have to be asleep to believe it."
> -George Carlin
> 
> "When you're born in this world, you're given a
> ticket to the freak show. When 
> you're born in America 
> you're given a front row seat."[6]
> "I think I figured out why Americans are so stupid.
> Think about how stupid the 
> Average American is. 
> Well, HALF of 'em are stupider than THAT!"
> "[Americans] They're superstitious, they have these
> beliefs, these primitive 
> religious beliefs.  I mean 
> they're just really kind of credulous, and gullible.
> People believe in, for 
> instance, hell and angels, okay, 
> these are very primitive, very, very backward to me,
> backward sounding beliefs, 
> these are child-like, 
> and that's the key, because they get you when you're
> a kid, they get you when 
> you're little, and they tell 
> you there's a God, and if you can make people
> believe, I believe this, if you 
> can make someone believe 
> that there's an invisible man, living in the sky,
> who's watching everything you 
> do, and keeping count of 
> everything you do, which is good and which is bad,
> then you can make that person 
> believe anything 
> after that, you can add anything you want, the 4th
> of July shit just rolls right 
> in, land of the free, home 
> of the brave, the press is fair and impartial,
> justice is blind, all men are 
> created equal, your vote is 
> important, the United States government is on your
> side, the army is here to 
> keep the peace, the police 
> are on your side...Oh, and freedom of choice, this
> is the big one, the illusion 
> of choice, we're led to feel 
> free by the exercise of meaningless choices. There
> are, for instance, important 
> things — not too many 
> choices, unimportant things-ice cream flavors, what
> do you want, we've got 31, 
> the flavor of the week, 
> the flavor of the month, but political parties-we're
> down to two, jeez. Sources 
> of information, media 
> companies down to five, banks, insurance companies,
> pharmaceuticals, chemical 
> companies, oil 
> companies-used to be seven, down to three, pretty
> soon it's gonna be two. But if 
> you’re lookin' for a 
> bagel or a fuckin' donut, hey, what do you
> want-pineapple supreme, hazelnut; 
> we've got everything you 
> want. Cereals, I counted, personally in the store
> counted 192 different cereal 
> choices, 192. 140 
> different cat foods, I counted, and that includes a
> tartar-control cat food for 
> senior citizen cats, okay?"
> 
> 
> > From: n.dahlheim at mchsi.com
> To: Chuck Minne <mincam2 at yahoo.com>
> CC: peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
> Subject: Will the American people have a choice in
> 2008?
> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2007 05:14:54 +0000
> 
> From: Chuck Minne <mincam2 at yahoo.com>
> To: peace-discuss at lists.groogroo.com
> Subject: [Peace-discuss] Half of the bankruptcies
> due to not being able to pay
> 	hospital bills.
> Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2007 03:58:37 +0000
> 
> >From http://kucinich.us/node/3859
> 
> MODERATOR: Next we're going to hear from Congressman
> Dennis Kucinich.
> 
> DENNIS: Good afternoon. Good afternoon.
> 
> It's wonderful to be here with you. And as I'm
> listening to this discussion
> today, it reminds me that you are the ones who have
> to insist that America
> reconnect...and its goodness.
> 
> Yesterday, in the House of Representatives,
> Americans were told that we can't
> have peace; we have to keep a war going for another
> year or two in order to have
> peace. I voted against that because I believe that
> we have to take a new
> direction, which is: if you want peace, you vote for
> peace and you have a plan
> for peace.
> 
> We're being told, in this state and other places,
> that you can't have
> kindergarten care or universal pre-kindergarten
> care. And yet, when you accept
> that, efforts are made to just cut short a movement.
> 
> Today, at this forum, the sub-message is that you
> can't break the hold that the
> insurance companies have. Not a single candidate up
> here has challenged the
> underlying problem with our health care system. And
> that is: insurance companies
> are holding our health care system hostage and
> forcing millions of Americans
> into poverty with unconscionable premiums, co-pays,
> deductibles.
> 
> [Applause and cheers.]
> 
> So I ask you: Is it consonant with America's
> greatness that candidates step away
> from the one solution that could change it all? A
> not-for-profit health care
> system is not only possible, but H.R. 676 -- a bill
> that I've introduced in a
> number of congresses (the Conyers-Kucinich Bill) --
> actually establishes
> Medicare for All; a single-payer system, and it's a
> not-for-profit system. It's
> time we ended this thought that health care is a
> privilege. It is a basic right,
> and it's time we ended the control that insurance
> companies have, not only over
> health care, but over our political system.
> 
> [Applause.]
> 
> Think for a moment if Lincoln had decided, "Well,
> you know, there's just too
> much resistance to this idea of emancipation." Think
> if the Suffragettes had
> decided, "Well, you know, we can't take on these men
> who are determined not to
> include women in the political process." What if
> Martin Luther King had said,
> "You know, we can only push so far for civil
> rights"? Or if Cesar Chavez had
> said, "Well, you know, no puede"?
> 
> What if? What if we buy into this logic that says
> that [we] can't have peace?
> 
> We're being told here today to buy into a view of
> the world which says that,
> "Well, you know, the insurance companies run the
> system. We'll work out
> competition between the insurance companies, and
> maybe we'll have government
> subsidize the insurance companies."
> 
> Where is our call for greatness? What if FDR had
> said, "Well, you know, we can't
> really do the New Deal"?
> 
> I'm talking about a real deal for the American
> people; a universal,
> single-payer, not-for-profit Medicare for All, and
> it's good to be here with you
> to talk about it. It's already in legislative
> forums. Sixty-two members of
> Congress have signed onto the bill. Over 14 thousand
> physicians have signed onto
> the bill. The people of California voted for a plan
> just like it. The Senate of
> New Hampshire endorsed it the other day. The
> legislature in Kansas put their
> name on it and endorsed the idea.
> 
> We can do this. Si, se puede; yes we can. Break the
> hold of the insurance
> companies on our health care system and lift the
> American people out of poverty:
> that's what my presidency is going to be about.
> Thank you. 
> 
> [Applause and cheers from audience members.]
> 
> Thank you. [Continued applause.] Thank you.
> 
> So let's talk; let's have a conversation.
> 
> MODERATOR: Well, Congressman, you are the first
> advocate we've heard today of a
> single-payer health care system -- essentially
> Medicare for everybody. However,
> the last time my understanding is that it was on the
> ballot, was in Oregon,
> which is, except for Vermont, probably the most
> liberal state in the country on
> these issues; and it didn't pass. Where do you find
> the political will for a
> single-payer system?
> 
> DENNIS: I traveled this country in the last
> election; came to an understanding
> that health care is the one issue that unites
> everyone. Where does the support
> come for a not-for-profit health care system? It
> comes from all over the
> country. But it's waiting for a candidate for
> President who will lead the way;
> and I've already done that. The Conyers-Kucinich
> Bill, H.R. 676, is the vehicle.
> 
> Now, how can you break the hold that insurance
> companies have? Because, let's
> fact it: in Oregon, they pumped millions of dollars
> into doing everything they
> could to try to defeat the initiative.
> 
> This is really simple: You need a President who
> doesn't have strings attached;
> someone who is ready to confront these insurance
> industries; someone who isn't
> owned by the interests. Look it: Right now on Wall
> Street, these hedge funds are
> coming together for a million...
> 
> [The recording stalls during the next few seconds of
> the video. Consequently,
> there is silence, along with an abrupt break in
> content.]
> 
> ...because simply, I don't have any strings
> attached. I've been in politics 40
> years. I've been a Councilman, a Clerk of Courts, a
> Mayor, a State Senator, and
> a six-term U.S. Congressman. I'm known for having
> integrity, and a willingness
> to take a stand, and for changing the outcome when
> others say it can't be done.
> 
> This is the moment that I call upon you, and the
> SEIU, and the American people
> to say, "Let's join this movement that already
> exists, call upon the power of
> our hearts and our intellects." 
> 
> What are the animating forces? How's this: Half of
> the bankruptcies in America
> right now are directly connected to people not being
> able to pay their hospital
> bills. And, of that amount, 75% of the people are
> working, have jobs. People's
> whole lives are on the line, here. So the question
> is, "Will the American people
> be given a real choice in this election?"
> 
> You know, this isn't American Idol, here. I mean,
> really, you know? 
> 
> I mean, I could come up here and do a little dance
> about, "Well, you know, we're
> going to take on those insurance companies." Oh
> really? Are you going to take
> away the profits? Are you going to remove the fact
> that 31% of the money that's
> in the system right now, of $2.2 trillion a year,
> goes for the activities of the
> for-profit system? If we take that money away from
> the insurance companies and
> use it for the American people, well, guess what? We
> have enough money for
> vision care, dental care, mental health,
> prescription drugs, and long-term care.
> 
> I'm going to call on the American people to stand up
> for their right: health
> care as a right, not as a privilege.
> 
> [Applause and cheers.]
> 
> MODERATOR: Congressman, we have an e-mail question
> from James in Patterson,
> California, who wants to know, "Why are health care
> costs going up so much, and
> what can we do to stop these increases?"
> 
> And could I just add a question to that...
> 
> DENNIS: Of course.
> 
> MODERATOR: ...because, in the framework of a
> single-payer system, people say the
> consequence of trying to contain costs in a
> single-payer system would ultimately
> be rationing. So could you take us through, first,
> how a single-payer system
> would address costs and, also, what you say about
> these sorts of concerns that
> people raise about it?
> 
> DENNIS: You know, think about this, now. The
> insurance companies, when they look
> at a single-payer system, a not-for-profit system,
> they'll say, "My God, you're
> going to end up with rationing." What do we have
> now? Forty-six million
> Americans don't even have coverage...talk about
> rationing! They're not even in
> the line. Okay? "Give me my portion." "No."
> 
> [Applause and cheers.]
> 
> Another 50 million people are under-insured, and the
> rest are paying these high
> premiums, co-pays, and deductibles. We've got to
> break the hold that the
> insurance companies have. 
> 
> And their public relations operations will say,
> "Well, rationing." The fact of
> the matter is, this plan that I'm talking about
> covers everyone.
> 
> How do you reduce costs? Let's look at the costs
> that are involved in the system
> right now. Corporate profits, stock options,
> executive salaries, advertising,
> marketing, the cost of paperwork: all of this takes
> about 31% out of the health
> care dollar. What does all that have to do with
> health care? Zero. Zip. Nada.
> 
> I'm talking about creating a system, which, by the
> way, is similar to that in
> every other industrialized nation in the world. We
> take the profit out of
> medicine: health care is a right; it is not a
> privilege.
> 
> So how do we control costs? By having everyone in
> the same pool -- everyone --
> having everyone covered, and having the benefits
> stay available to everyone --
> whatever their income; no means testing -- and by
> creating a movement.
> 
> Now, I want to add something to an earlier question
> you raised. And that is
> that...my good friend Senator Edwards (he and I
> campaigned together four years
> ago)...he raised this question, which is *the*
> question in Washington: "Well,
> it's just not feasible to take this plan for
> not-for-profit health care."
> 
> Senator Clinton talked about challenging the
> insurance companies but doesn't
> really get to the ultimate challenge; and that is,
> "Who controls health care in
> America?"
> 
> Senator Obama is still developing his plan.
> 
> This plan that I'm talking about, I co-authored this
> plan. I'm one of the ones
> who wrote the plan. I know the way the system is set
> up. The area that I
> represent in Cleveland, people are losing their
> homes because they can't pay
> their doctor bills. And so, the question is -- what
> it ultimately comes down to
> -- is, "Who has the courage and the willingness to
> take a stand...
> 
> [The recording stalls during the next few seconds of
> the video. Consequently,
> there is silence, along with an abrupt break in
> content.]
> 
> ...breadth and depth of the American people, and
> call forth our greatness. To
> say we're going to change this. We're not going to
> be trapped by these insurance
> companies who give us diminishing returns, who
> insist on a high-premiums,
> co-pays, and deductibles.
> 
> [Applause.]
> 
> MODERATOR: Thank you. Congressman, you're kind of an
> urban kind of guy. And
> Ashley Osborne, who is a labor and delivery nurse in
> Elko, which is a rural
> county in northern Nevada, has a question for you
> about how you would address
> concerns in people who are in her situation.
> 
> ASHLEY: Good morning. As you know, my name is Ashley
> Osborne, and I'm a labor
> nurse in Elko, Nevada, which is a rural area up in
> northeastern Nevada. And,
> commonly, I see moms come into my department with
> pregnancy-induced -- severe
> pregnancy-induced -- health care issues that could
> be eliminated or caught early
> with prenatal care. Unfortunately, they are unable
> to get that. What are your
> plans on improving health care in the rural area in
> the U.S.?
> 
> DENNIS: Well, first of all, this plan covers
> everyone; rural as well as urban
> areas, alike. Rural areas tend to be underserved.
> I'm looking also at creating
> an infrastructure program to create millions of jobs
> -- rebuilding America's
> infrastructure -- which would build hospitals in
> rural areas. And rural people
> would then have access, because access is the huge
> question in rural areas. And
> when you talked about women being able to get the
> care they need, this system --
> prenatal care, post-natal care -- I have a plan for
> child...
> 
> [The recording stalls during the next few seconds of
> the video. Consequently,
> there is silence, along with an abrupt break in
> content.]
> 
> ...doesn't try to stop women from getting the care
> they need because there's an
> insurance agent telling an OB-GYN doctor, "We just
> can't do that. You're asking
> for too much."
> 
> This system will meet the health care needs of the
> American people. We're being
> told we just can't have those needs met. We've got
> to start thinking
> differently.
> 
> Does that answer your question?
> 
> [There is no verbal reply, but it is apparent that
> Ashley nods affirmatively,
> because Dennis continues by saying...]
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> [Applause.]
> 
> MODERATOR: Thanks. And now I would like to turn to a
> public health student here
> at UNLV, Megan McCormack, who raises a pertinent
> point. I mean, if there's any
> place where you're interested in outcomes, it's in
> health care. Megan?
> 
> MEGAN: Hello. I'm Megan McCormack. I'm a junior at
> UNLV here. We're spending an
> increasing percentage of our Gross Domestic Product
> on health care, while we
> continue to have poorer outcomes than those
> countries who are allocating a lower
> percentage of their GDP towards their own health
> care. How does America plan to
> stay globally competitive with increasing health
> care costs?
> 
> DENNIS: That is a key question. I mean, in my own
> congressional district, we
> have auto plants that have been threatened and
> others across the country have
> been threatened, because the high cost of health
> care is causing Ford and GM to
> pay billions of dollars in health care costs. Now
> Canada, on the other hand, has
> a much stronger industry because they have a health
> care plan for their people.
> 
> This plan that I'm talking about is going to help
> American business. It's going
> to strengthen the economy. It's going to make it
> possible for individuals to be
> able to hold onto more of their money.
> 
> It's true that many families right now are spending
> in excess of $10 thousand a
> year for health care. With this plan, only a
> fraction of the money that is being
> spent right now would have to be part of the
> financing of the system. I mean, do
> you know that 60% (right now) of the money that is
> in health care is spent by
> the Government? The Government has 60% of the
> spending right now. If you
> eliminate administrative costs, if you purchase bulk
> purchase of drugs -- just
> the way veterans do -- you start to come up with the
> money that you need to
> provide coverage for everyone, and that is a major
> help for small businesses and
> large businesses, alike.
> 
> This patchwork proposal that you've been given here
> today by the other
> candidates locks us into insurance companies who
> then take their pound of flesh.
> And, generally, it keeps people from being able to
> have any control over their
> own budgets.
> 
> I want to go back to what most American people are
> experiencing: economic
> uncertainty, because of the way the American health
> care system is set up.
> People are aware, no matter how much money they
> have, that if they have an
> illness in the family, it could wipe them out. Who
> isn't going to make the
> choice to take care of a loved one? You do what you
> have to. But why, I would
> ask you, should someone have to lose their home in
> order to ensure the health of
> a loved one? Why should someone not be able to get
> the long-term care they need
> for a loved one or have to sign on the dotted line
> to give away everything
> you've worked for for a lifetime in order to get the
> long-term care you need?
> 
> See, what I'm talking about is a real
> transformation. I think the American
> people are ready for that. But they need someone to
> be, not just a messenger,
> but someone who knows this issue and is ready to
> stand up and speak out.
> 
> Yes, we can improve our economy and save our
> businesses, large and small. And
> I'm dedicated to doing that. And I'm able to do it,
> too. 
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> [Applause.]
> 
> MODERATOR: You know, Congressman, earlier, Senator
> Edwards...
> 
> [The recording stalls during the next few seconds of
> the video. Consequently,
> there is silence, along with an abrupt break in
> content.]
> 
> ...payer Medicare-like option built into his plan,
> and it would be one of the
> things that people could consider in making their
> health care choices. And he
> raised the possibility that, if that were out there
> as an option, and people
> started choosing it and found out that they really
> liked it, then the country
> could almost evolve toward a single-payer system. Do
> you see this as a real
> scenario, given the other interests that are out
> there; or do you think that, in
> fact, it's going to have to sort of come down in one
> fell swoop, if it's ever
> going to happen?
> 
> DENNIS: Well, you just answered the question. And
> that is that, if you have
> competition between insurance companies, everyone
> knows what happens. That
> doesn't drive down costs; it drives up profits.
> That's the fact. If you say,
> "Well, you're going to give people a choice" --
> either be on a private plan or
> being with the Government - what happens is that the
> private companies start
> cherry-picking people in the best health and then
> you end up with what's called
> adverse selection: those who are the most medically
> compromised end up on
> programs that the Government is paying for; and then
> the Government program
> starts to go down. You end up in an insurance death
> spiral, is what it is called
> in the industry.
> 
> Now think about it. Candidates are up here
> advocating that government provides
> subsidies to the insurance industry. What's that
> about? 
> 
> [Cheers and applause.]
> 
> I mean, didn't we have enough of subsidizing the
> pharmaceutical companies with
> that phony Medicare D program that President Bush
> had? How are we any different
> as Democrats? Think about that.
> 
> Do you know what? Universal health care: oh,
> everybody's for it. Almost is
> resonant with that fellow in "The Music Man" who
> says "There's trouble in River
> City." Universal health care. You know what? Even
> the insurance companies are
> for universal health care...especially the insurance
> companies if the Government
> is subsidizing them. What a deal that is for the
> insurance companies! But what a
> rotten deal it is for the American people!
> 
> We've got to have not-for-profit health care, get
> the insurance companies out of
> the picture. Health care is not a privilege, it is a
> right, and it is a human
> right.
> 
> [Applause and cheers.]
> 
> Universal health care...right! I mean, come on! You
> need a president who didn't
> fall off a Christmas tree. You need a president who
> will be involved in straight
> talk, straight from the shoulder. And you need a
> president who doesn't have a
> key in the back that is being wound up by special
> interests to come before the
> American people and tell them what the interests
> want.
> 
> I'm telling you what the American people want, and
> I'm ready to take that
> message all across this country, and I'd like your
> help in doing it.
> 
> [Cheers and applause.]
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> I have four seconds left, buzzer-shot. You want
> not-for-profit health care, I'm
> the candidate who can deliver. Kucinich.us. Thank
> you very much.
> 
> MODERATOR: Thank you very much, Congressman.
> 
> 
> 
>   
>   
>   
>   But judge for yourself, don't be afraid, Watch
> This or This
>   
> 
>  
> ---------------------------------
> Expecting? Get great news right away with email
> Auto-Check.
> Try the Yahoo! Mail Beta.>
_______________________________________________
> Peace-discuss mailing list
> Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
>
http://lists.chambana.net/cgi-bin/listinfo/peace-discuss
> 



 
____________________________________________________________________________________
Finding fabulous fares is fun.  
Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains.
http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097