[Peace-discuss] Re: [Peace] "Iraq and Recession" press conference noon today (Thu), IDF, Springfield & Wright

[Morton K. Brussel]

It seems rather obvious to me that building weaponry is like pouring  
dollars into the ground; its only function is to destroy, since I  
don't buy the argument that this is needed for "defense".  True,  
military spending may stimulate employment in the concerned and  
related industries and even have technological benefits, but many  
economists have shown that it is a less efficient way to stimulate  
the economy than putting resources into civilian projects and  
infrastructure. Putting trillions into building this nation up  
nonmilitarily is far better economically than using those resources  
to destroy others'.  FDR could and should have done even more. The  
fact that the U.S. economy picked up after 1939 or 1941 was not only  
because of military spending, but because the economy became much  
more regimented because of the requirements of total war.
--mkb



On Apr 24, 2008, at 2:10 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:

> I'm not so sure.
>
> The Third Reich didn't fall apart from the economic effect of its  
> war policies.  Just the opposite: it was German rearmament after  
> 1933 that saved Germany from the worst of the Depression.  It took  
> the US until the end of the decade to catch on.
>
> The New Deal never solved the Depression (of course it was forced  
> by popular pressure to do some good things) -- only war spending  
> after 1940 did that. (It also produced the Great Fear in American  
> planners after the war: since war spending ended the Depression,  
> the end of the war meant the return of the depression; the only  
> solution was continued preparation for war.)
>
> What economic health the Bush II era has enjoyed may be due to Iraq  
> war spending.  You know that, absent 9/11, the president and  
> Congress would not have  spent anywhere near so much money on  
> anything else, especially not anything worthwhile.
>
> It is true that there's an argument about diminishing returns in  
> this "military Keynsianism"  -- for one thing, a greater tranche is  
> non-domestic than was the case 60 years ago -- and there's all  
> sorts of other reasons to condemn how the current administration  
> has and hasn't spent money.  But it's at least not clear that  
> current war spending is economically ruinous for the US.
>
> The liberal argument against the Vietnam War, 40 years ago, was  
> that of course it was a good idea if it could be done, but it was  
> costing too much.  I didn't think much of that argument then, and I  
> don't now. --CGE
>
>
> Stuart Levy wrote:
>> On Thu, Apr 24, 2008 at 11:36:52AM -0500, C. G. Estabrook wrote:
>>> Suppose the German anti-war movement had the freedom to operate  
>>> that we do, and they chose in 1943 to mount a campaign with the  
>>> theme "The War is Costing Too Much"...  --CGE
>> If they'd succeeded, I'd have been happy to cheer them on.
>> If the US falls apart as a result of these ruinous & immoral
>> policies, future mainstream historians may well look on us as we look
>> now on the Third Reich.  We have that luxury now because the Germans
>> had to admit defeat, and were judged by those who defeated them.
>> But if the US survives this, who will get the chance to look at us
>> that way?  Or better, when will that widespread judgement come?
>> Until then we can still expect that many people will oppose war as
>> an economic burden, even if too few see it as a burden on their
>> consciences as well.
>> When Derrick Jensen spoke here a few months ago -- talking about
>> the essential violence and essential unsustainability of industrial
>> civilization -- one of his comments was that he suspects Bush & co.
>> are closet Luddites.  How could they have been more diligent
>> in hastening our downfall?
>> _______________________________________________
>> Peace-discuss mailing list
>> Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
>> http://lists.chambana.net/cgi-bin/listinfo/peace-discuss
> _______________________________________________
> Peace-discuss mailing list
> Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
> http://lists.chambana.net/cgi-bin/listinfo/peace-discuss