[Peace-discuss] Uncle Noam on the BBC

Thu Nov 6 15:28:17 CST 2008

Compelling wise comments!  It resembles what Howard Zinn, another  
wise man,  expressed to Amy Goodman recently on her program.

--mkb

On Nov 6, 2008, at 3:12 PM, Ricky Baldwin wrote:

> I think we've left it up to our so-called leaders long enough.  I  
> think we have to realize that we are not children, not helpless  
> babes in cradles, whose only hope to scream and cry if we do not  
> get what we want.  It's time we took some responsibility for  
> turning things around.  That is not letting anyone "off the hook".   
> Just the opposite.  It's about being forthright and assertive about  
> what we expect - or rather demand - out of our elected  
> representatives.
>
> Karen is right.  There is a helluva lot that Obama said he would do  
> that we do not want him to do.  What we want him to live up to is  
> the hopes and dreams and aspirations of the people who elected him,  
> regardless of his repeated explanations that he was not about  
> that.  The analogy to Kennedy is perfect.  That is, we don't aim  
> for Obama to become Kennedy; we aim for Obama's supporters to push  
> forward with the raised expectations and the energy that carried  
> Kennedy's supporters (some of them) into the movements that as  
> Chomsky says raised the moral standards of this country beyond what  
> they had been for years.
>
> Bob asks the crucial question: how to get that message to Obama.  I  
> think it's a safe bet that he and his advisers read the newspapers  
> and watch tv.  That's one way.  There are also these petitions and  
> letters that Just Foreign Policy and J Street, and probably others,  
> are organizing.  Barbara is right: there is no time to lose.  That  
> doesn't mean we drag out the Impeach Obama signs.  Just the  
> opposite.  That makes it too easy to marginalize our points.  We  
> lead with our strong suit: we talk about real problems and real  
> solutions - what's wrong with leaving any troops in Iraq, what's  
> wrong with expanding the war in 'AfPak', emphasize the value of  
> "diplomacy" and more importantly peace and social justice.
>
> It's up to us to get that stuff out.  Unless we prefer to sit by  
> while it all goes to hell so we can say I told you so.
>
> Ricky
>
> "Only those who do nothing make no mistakes." - Peter Kropotkin
>
>
> From: LAURIE SOLOMON <LAURIE at ADVANCENET.NET>
> To: peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
> Sent: Thursday, November 6, 2008 12:36:29 PM
> Subject: FW: [Peace-discuss] Uncle Noam on the BBC
>
>
>
> Subject: RE: [Peace-discuss] Uncle Noam on the BBC
>
>
> >I think the Chomsky point is that it is a great opening moment for  
> the People and for organizers of people, a point also made by Naomi  
> Klein (on >October 29) who said, "Obama is a Centrist. It is up to  
> us to move the Center."  Even were he to be better than our fears,  
> he cannot fail to disappoint >because the size of the mess he steps  
> into.
>
>
> While I agree that this may be an opening and that if you move the  
> center Obama and other Centrists will probably follow, I think that  
> the above statements and statements like this tend to get Obama and  
> his administration as well as the Centrists in and out of Congress  
> off the hook by shifting responsibility for anything which does not  
> change in a progressive/reformist/liberal/leftist direction to the  
> People rather than placing the responsibility where it belongs on  
> Obama and his supporters and Administration.  I think the people  
> who put their faith and hope in Obama as the new opportunity for  
> change should hold his feet to the fire for each and every thing –  
> big or little – that he does not do or does differently from how he  
> represented himself throughout the campaign, allowing for no  
> excuses, rationalizations for failures to do so.
>
>
>
> From: peace-discuss-bounces at lists.chambana.net [mailto:peace- 
> discuss-bounces at lists.chambana.net] On Behalf Of Barbara kessel
> Sent: Thursday, November 06, 2008 11:42 AM
> To: kmedina at illinois.edu
> Cc: peace discuss
> Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Uncle Noam on the BBC
>
>
> I think the Chomsky point is that it is a great opening moment for  
> the People and for organizers of people, a point also made by Naomi  
> Klein (on October 29) who said, "Obama is a Centrist. It is up to  
> us to move the Center."  Even were he to be better than our fears,  
> he cannot fail to disappoint because the size of the mess he steps  
> into.
>
>       We need now to "stretch the map" of anti-war protestors. Just  
> because 64% of the voters said that their top issue was the economy  
> and 10% said it was the war does not mean that these issues remain  
> unrelated in all the minds of that 64%. True Anecdote: 84 year old  
> father of a friend of mine, who is a veteran of WWII, a stone  
> racist, always voted Republican, cast his first Democratic vote for  
> Obama saying to his grown children, "I am sick and tired of seeing  
> the government throwing our money away on useless and unnecessary  
> wars."  Barbara Kessel
>
> On Thu, Nov 6, 2008 at 11:12 AM, Karen Medina  
> <kmedina at illinois.edu> wrote:
>
> >The Prophet [Noam] says: what matters is what people do with their
>
> disappointment when Obama fails to meet their expectations.
>
> I think the best thing Obama can do is hire the best cabinet  
> possible to do the real
> work and he be the negotiator between the groups. He's smart enough  
> and there is
> some evidence that he just might find the humility to do this.
>
> He should take on one thing himself: universal healthcare would be  
> a good choice.
>
> My worst fear is that he appoints only centrists and the right to  
> his cabinet. He has
> a mandate to move left, but he may not be able to recognize it. He  
> has a tendency
> to overcompensate to the right.
>
> -karen medina
>
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