[Peace-discuss] Re: Immigration Reform Rally!

Mon Dec 7 10:47:54 CST 2009

Gee Wayne, all the folks I know who've ended pregnancies are middle- or upper-middle class... and then there are all those folks on welfare who have 8+ kids... Lessee, what do you call them?? Oh yeah, Welfare Queens.
 --Jenifer

--- On Sun, 12/6/09, E. Wayne Johnson <ewj at pigs.ag> wrote:

From: E. Wayne Johnson <ewj at pigs.ag>
Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Re: Immigration Reform Rally!
To: "Ricky Baldwin" <baldwinricky at yahoo.com>
Cc: "AWARE peace discussion" <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>, "Stuart Levy" <slevy at ncsa.uiuc.edu>
Date: Sunday, December 6, 2009, 3:59 PM

I didnt mean you personally but noted late, too late, it could be most easily taken that way.

I just wanted to point out the elitist overtones.

I would contend that were it not for the outright murder of ~50 million American citizens via abortion, there would be no dysfunction of population equilibrium that is the real force driving the wave of net immigration...

Abortion would not be legal if not for its eugenic effect.  

(Of course I am strongly opposed to abortion, be it early, late, preemptive, or retroactive.)  

When people tell me what they think about abortion they just tell me what they think about murder.

Why kill the child before birth?  What not wait some time after birth and decide whether you like the baby or not?  
Doesnt that make more sense then getting rid of the kid before ya know if its any good or not?

You could take the child back to the hospital for "recycling".  I understand that there is a high demand for not-quite-fully-differentiated cells for the "spare parts" and "good used parts" market.

Of course I write foolishness here, but really, what is the difference?  

On 12/6/2009 3:28 PM, Ricky Baldwin wrote: 

No such thing, Wayne.  This event is being organized by a student group, hence the focus.  La Colectiva Latina actually works on immigration issues generally, and does some excellent work among the very population you mention here locally - at Shadowwood, etc

If you mean me, I've actually done solidarity work with farmworkers standing up for their rights, in ways that they chose, for quite a few years.  If you want to make this about me, I'm surprised you hadn't noticed the postings on those issues.  I happen to think that the right approach to immigration "problems" is to guarantee the same rights, at work and so on, to everybody - then there's no incentive for unscrupulous employers to hire coyotes to scam desperate victims of our imperialist policies into slavery and near-slavery here - and to stop supporting repressive regimes abroad that create waves of immigration, etc.

To clarify, abortion ought to be freely available for anyone who wants it - regardless of anyone's paranoia about that.  But I'm only in favor of euthanasia for so-called "Libertarians" who are opposed to other people's rights ;-)

By the way, thanks, Stuart.  That's what I hear, too.  Wayne is engaging in groundless speculation again, I believe.  I won't speculate about the basis of his speculation.

Ricky

"Speak your mind even if your voice shakes." - Maggie Kuhn

--- On Sun, 12/6/09, E. Wayne Johnson <ewj at pigs.ag> wrote:

From: E. Wayne Johnson <ewj at pigs.ag>
Subject: [Peace-discuss] Re: Immigration Reform Rally!
To: "Stuart Levy" <slevy at ncsa.uiuc.edu>
Cc: "AWARE peace discussion" <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
Date: Sunday, December 6, 2009, 2:53 PM

Why special favours for those fortunate ones who attend universities and not for those who pick fruit, sort and pack vegetables, work in in meatpacking establishments, and clean our homes and buildings?

On 12/6/2009 2:27 PM, Stuart Levy wrote: 
On Sun, Dec 06, 2009 at 12:40:26PM -0600, E. Wayne Johnson wrote:

Ricky,

You really are all about Eugenics, aren't you?

Abortion for the human weeds.

Import the best and brightest.

What do you propose for the "Culls"?  Detention?  Euthanasia?

Wayne
    Wayne,

What on earth?  This event is to promote a humane US immigration policy.

Plyler v. Doe for example says that states have to offer public education
to everybody, without screening by immigrant status.

I do hear eugenics-like language being used in the debate at times,
but coming from people opposed to such a policy.  They talk about
impure stock coming across the borders, and not wanting them to mix with
the good american stock.  Things like that.  Much as many people did in the
late 19th/early 20th century when the impure stock were coming from
southern and eastern europe, like my father's parents.

I don't hear that kind of thing coming from people supporting things
like the DREAM act, do you?

On 12/5/2009 12:43 PM, Ricky Baldwin wrote:

From: Celeste Larkin <celeste.larkin at gmail.com>

    Subject: [PeoplesPotluck] Immigration Reform Rally!
    To: peoplespotluck at lists.chambana.net
    Date: Friday, December 4, 2009, 9:37 PM

    Wednesday, December 9th at 6:30 PM, in the Foellinger Auditorium,
    the IDream Coalition will be hosting the *D.R.E.A.M.
    Act/Immigration Reform Rally*!  At the rally, we will be calling
    upon our legislators, community and university to support
    Immigration Reform that helps undocumented students gain
    citizenship through higher education.

    *_So what's the
 rally all about?_ *
    -Come to *learn* about past and present immigration legislation
    such as:

        * Plyer v. Doe
        * Gutierrez/Immigration Bill
        * HB 60
        * DREAM Act

    Inform yourself about our country's immigration laws!

    -Come to see different U of I student organizations speaking about
    how the immigration debate relates to them and *why we should
    */*ALL*/* care!*

    -Come to witness testimonials from undocumented students who have
    *shared their struggle* and personal immigration stories.

    -Come to find out how you can *get involved* in future movements
    for human rights and immigration reform.

    So come, learn, witness, and show your support for those thousands
    of undocumented students--because a few minutes of your time could
    change someone's life forever!

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