[Peace-discuss] Re: [Peace] Re: Memorial in Champaign-Urbana
Heather Ault
hault2 at uiuc.edu
Wed Jun 3 13:39:11 CDT 2009
Hi Neil and everyone,
Let's stop using this email list from this point on - out of respect for
everyone receiving these emails, as this is not the intended discussion.
I sincerely appreciate your cooperation and consideration! Thanks
everyone for your input.
Heather
On Wed, 03 Jun 2009 13:16:10 -0500, "C. G. Estabrook"
<galliher at illinois.edu> said:
> Neil--
>
> A large number of Dr. Tiller's procedures resulted in the premature
> ending of a
> human life, the denial of a "future like ours." That phrase is used in
> what to
> my mind is the best philosophical demonstration that abortion is
> unethical: Don
> Marquis, "Why Abortion is Immoral," The Journal of Philosophy, 86:4.
> There's a
> summary at <www.bbc.co.uk/ethics/abortion/philosophical/future.shtml>:
>
> "The claim that the primary wrong-making feature of a killing is the loss
> to the
> victim of the value of its future has obvious consequences for the ethics
> of
> abortion. The future of a standard foetus includes a set of experiences,
> projects, activities, and such which are identical with the futures of
> adult
> human beings and are identical with the futures of young children. Since
> the
> reason that is sufficient to explain why it is wrong to kill human beings
> after
> the time of birth is a reason that also applies to foetuses, it follows
> that
> abortion is prima facie morally wrong."
>
> I think you over-generalize a bit about the "pro-life movement." There
> are of
> course people who are opposed to abortion, the death penalty, and war
> (and I
> agree that not to do so would be inconsistent). See, e.g., Feminists for
> Life
> <http://www.feministsforlife.org/>.
>
> Solidarity indeed, Carl
>
>
> Neil Parthun wrote:
> > Carl et al.
> >
> > There is a significant difference.
> >
> > Dr. Tiller's procedures were done for certain situations: -the fetus was dead
> > in the womb and it would ridiculous for the woman to carry it to term -the
> > woman found out she had a disease (i.e. cancer) late in the pregnancy and
> > having the child may kill her -the woman was a victim of rape/incest -- I've
> > had the opportunity to hear from some doctors who worked with him who
> > discussed a 10 and 11 year old child who was raped by a family member. He
> > performed the procedure so they could have the opportunity for a normal life.
> >
> >
> > These were done for documented medical reasons that are widely considered to
> > be valid when one looks at the facts rather than the hysteria of "Tiller the
> > Baby Killer".
> >
> > The usage of US forces, as documented many times by Carl himself, in the name
> > of empire is the use of intimidation and violence to achieve geo-political
> > goals for the service of a nation state.
> >
> > Such fundamental differences are glossed over here. I understand the
> > consistent life ethic from people like Fr. Berrigan, but this position is
> > almost non-existent in today's political structure.
> >
> > Today's "pro-life" movement has many inconsistencies (i.e. for the birth of
> > children, but for the death penalty, for the wars in
> > Iraq/Afghanistan/Pakistan, etc.) and as such, there are significant
> > difficulties in equating the two deaths and the issue of war/abortion here.
> >
> >
> > Solidarity, -N.
> >
> > Neil Parthun Sports/politics writer, UC-IMC
> >
> > "There are many victories worse than a defeat." - George Eliot
> >
> >
> C. G. Estabrook wrote:
> > Dr. Tiller was murdered Sunday 31 May in Wichita, Kansas. On Monday 1 June
> > US Army Pvt. William Long was shot and killed outside a military recruiting
> > office in Little Rock, Arkansas, by a man opposed to the wars in Iraq and
> > Afghanistan.
> >
> > If a vigil, prayerful or otherwise, is appropriate for Dr. Tiller, why is not
> > one also being organized for Pvt. Long? The only reason I can see is that
> > the bien-pensant is in favor of Dr. Tiller's activities but opposed to those
> > of Pvt. Long. The vigil therefore becomes a certain "propaganda of the
> > deed."
> >
> > In default of an adequate argument, war is no more justified by the
> > victimization of those who practice it than is abortion. --CGE
> >
>
...
Heather Ault
MFA Candidate, School of Art and Design
University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign
www.heatherault.org
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