[Peace-discuss] ron paul, teabaggers, and some of their best friends

Wed May 5 08:25:29 CDT 2010

Right now, nobody has to register w/ a draft board. Nobody has to worry about deferments, nobody has to enlist or reup in the least objectional branch b/c the gov't will choose a worse one if they don't (except for the poor folks, deluded and otherwise who feel they have no other choice, and those caught in stop loss, of course). Trust me: if suddenly everyone betw 18 and 25 had their nuts (and boobs?) in a noose, then yeah, I think that'd get folks' attention and there'd be a whole lotta squawking, whereas now there's essentially none.
Vietnam: as I understand it, the rank and file in the military helped to bring the war to an end thru mutiny -- and that was certainly self-preservation (of their lives, of their mental-physical-moral well-being), along w/ a conviction that the war was pointless on top of that. --Jenifer

--- On Tue, 5/4/10, Anthony Pomonis <apomonis at gmail.com> wrote:

From: Anthony Pomonis <apomonis at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] ron paul, teabaggers, and some of their best  friends
To: "David Green" <davegreen84 at yahoo.com>
Cc: "Peace Discuss" <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
Date: Tuesday, May 4, 2010, 7:55 PM

On Tue, May 4, 2010 at 7:00 PM, David Green <davegreen84 at yahoo.com> wrote:

"In my opinion, the student antiwar movement of the 1960s (which was part of a much larger antiwar movement, including soldiers themselves), was NOT motivated by self-interest or even self-preservation." 

DG

Be that as it may, self preservation and self interest are the lasting legacies of that time.  (Enter: American Policy Since)  

Many positions of power are held by those from the era.  
I think that was Carl's main point.  
Stuart, I love your observation on the tax.  All military families I know want their children to come home, rhetoric be damned.  Anything to come home.  The best question I can think of is, "How can we as a people learn and improve upon historical failure?"  

We need ideas.    
--TP

From: C. G. Estabrook <galliher at illinois.edu>
To: Jenifer Cartwright <jencart13 at yahoo.com>

Cc: E.Wayne Johnson <ewj at pigs.ag>; Peace Discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>

Sent: Tue, May 4, 2010 5:51:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] ron paul, teabaggers, and some of their best friends

"The usual explanations for the difference between then and now
won't do. The suggestion, for example, that the renewal of a
military draft would ignite students' self-interest doesn't

account for the fact that most 60s-era students were sufficiently
sheltered from the draft to make their chances of seeing combat
negligible. Lewis B. Hershey, director of the Selective
 Service
until 1970, granted draft deferments to students and some
white-collar professionals on the reasoning that engineers,
scientists, and teachers were essential to national security and
the war effort. By the time the lottery system evened the playing

field somewhat in 1969, 'Vietnamization' was under way, and the
number of combat roles filled by American GI's began shrinking."

http://chronicle.com/article/The-Times-They-Changed/65192/

On 5/4/10 4:54 PM, Jenifer Cartwright wrote:
> The only way to get ANY folks out of the woodwork to protest the US's
> imperialist wars is to reinstate the draft. How 'bout we [peace activists]

> start a rumor that that's in the works and see what happens? Add that to
> blogs and picket signs, get talk radio hosts ranting about it. Worth a try
> :-) --
 Jenifer
>
> --- On *Mon, 5/3/10, Ricky Baldwin /<baldwinricky at yahoo.com>/* wrote:
>
>
> From: Ricky Baldwin <baldwinricky at yahoo.com> Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss]

> ron paul, teabaggers, and some of their best friends To: "E.Wayne Johnson"
> <ewj at pigs.ag> Cc: "Peace Discuss" <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net> Date:

> Monday, May 3, 2010, 11:06 AM
>
> Wayne, I assume you are referring here to the "tea party" as the rebellion?
> I think there's an element of that, but it's dragged so far out of that

> orbit by the weight of its racism
 and Know-Nothingism, homophobia and fear
> of socialism, and miscellaneous rightwing conspiracy theories, that it's
> more likely to push national policy away from anything that might help
> working people than accomplish anything good and decent...

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