[Peace-discuss] This list is for brief announcements only
C. G. Estabrook
galliher at illinois.edu
Thu Oct 21 11:48:02 CDT 2010
Discussions of this nature belong in the election campaign.
---- Original message ----
>Date: Thu, 21 Oct 2010 09:38:24 -0700 (PDT)
>From: carol inskeep <carolinskeep at yahoo.com>
>Subject: [Peace-discuss] This list is for brief announcements only
>To: Gregg Gordon <ggregg79 at yahoo.com>, "C. G. Estabrook"
<galliher at illinois.edu>
>Cc: Peace List <peace at lists.chambana.net>, Peace-discuss <peace-
discuss at lists.chambana.net>
>
>Discussions of this nature belong on Peace Discuss.
>
>--- On Wed, 10/20/10, C. G. Estabrook <galliher at illinois.edu>
>wrote:
>
> From: C. G. Estabrook <galliher at illinois.edu>
> Subject: Re: [Peace] [Peace-discuss] Fw: Money Can't Vote
> To: "Gregg Gordon" <ggregg79 at yahoo.com>
> Cc: "Peace List" <peace at lists.chambana.net>,
> "Peace-discuss" <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
> Date: Wednesday, October 20, 2010, 11:09 PM
>
> First, Iraq and Afghanistan are both part of what the
> Pentagon calls "The Long War" (for oil) in the Mideast. So
> far, the US has killed a million people in Iraq under
> Clinton (whose Secretary of State said that the tens of
> thousands of dead children were "worth it"); a million
> under Bush; and apparently hundreds of thousands in AfPak
> under Bush and his third (Obama) term.
>
> That falls short of the perhaps 4 million we killed in SE
> Asia, but of course Obama's escalated murders in SW Asia
> are in no way justified by being fewer in number than
> Kennedy-Johnson-Nixon's in Vietnam.
>
> It's difficult to determine when the Long War begins, but
> it takes a tick up in the Carter administration when Carter
> (and Obama's) adviser Zbigniew Brzezinski sends Osama bin
> Laden and friends into Afghanistan (before the Russian
> invasion) "to give the Russians a Vietnam of their own," as
> he said at the time, in the most expensive CIA operation to
> date.
>
> If a Republican administration after 2012 brings Obama's
> AfPak war to an end, then we'll have a third example of a
> Democratic war concluded by Republicans in as many
> generations. But that may not be likely. The news suggests
> that the Obama administration is looking to expand the war
> with an attack on Pakistan and/or Iran. It certainly isn't
> looking to abandon the world's greatest energy-producing
> region.
>
> Control of Mideast energy resources has been a cornerstone
> of US foreign policy since 1945. Obama is simply lying when
> he says the war is to "stop terrorism" - it obviously
> increases terrorism - but he has to lie, because the only
> Constitutional authority he has to wage war in the Mideast
> is Congress' "Authorization for the Use of Military Force"
> of September 2001 - which is directed against terrorism.
>
> Something positive to do: years ago, there was a great
> debate in America, "How do we get out of Vietnam?" The
> best answer was given by Herb Caen: "Ships and planes."
> Load up the troops and bring them home. The Russians did -
> and survived and prospered from the end of their war.
>
> Eventually we did, but it took two presidents' being driven
> from office and (even more important) a revolt of the
> American conscript army to do it.
>
> Regards, CGE
>
> On 10/20/10 7:15 PM, Gregg Gordon wrote:
>
> So I conclude from your statement that you don't consider
> either Iraq or Afghanistan to be "major" wars. So why
> are you so worked up about them? I think you're just
> still mad at Lyndon Johnson.
>
> And please, don't accuse me of being some kind of racist
> who doesn't mind us murdering brown people. That is so
> lame. It's just that not all of us see the world in as
> simple terms as you seem to. Simple solutions are nice,
> but they're mainly for the simple-minded.
>
> All I'm saying is if you're so gung-ho on stopping the
> war, why don't you come up with something positive to do
> (as opposed to sniping from the sidelines) that might
> help get us closer to that goal? We'll all get behind
> you.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------
>
> From: C. G. Estabrook <galliher at illinois.edu>
> To: Gregg Gordon <ggregg79 at yahoo.com>
> Cc: Jenifer Cartwright <jencart13 at yahoo.com>; Peace List
> <peace at lists.chambana.net>; Peace-discuss
> <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
> Sent: Wed, October 20, 2010 5:10:40 PM
> Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] [Peace] Fw: Money Can't Vote
> You are aware, are you not, that America's major wars
> since WWII - called by synecdoche "Korea" and "Vietnam" -
> were started by Democratic administrations and ended by
> Republican administrations. Since the current Democratic
> administration has greatly expanded the killing in AfPak,
> it's hard to argue that they're going to reverse their
> policies. Voting for them is an acquiescence to those
> policies.
>
> To say of Obama and the Democrats, "Let them kill some
> Asians, because they might do some good someplace else,"
> is at best a counsel of despair, if not an outright
> criminal attitude. Particularly when it seems that
> they're doing precisely the wrong things elsewhere, too -
> not surprisingly, because they're working for the owners
> of the banks, the insurance companies, the oil and
> construction companies, etc. --CGE
>
> On 10/20/10 4:48 PM, Gregg Gordon wrote:
>
> Maybe because there are other important issues that she
> does agree with him on. The only way you're going to
> find a candidate you're in 100% agreement with is to
> run for office. If support for the war is an absolute
> deal breaker for you, fine. Not everybody sees it that
> way. But if you think the war will end sooner if more
> Republicans get elected, I think you're out of your
> mind.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------
>
> From: C. G. Estabrook <galliher at illinois.edu>
> To: Jenifer Cartwright <jencart13 at yahoo.com>
> Cc: Peace List <peace at lists.chambana.net>;
> Peace-discuss <peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
> Sent: Wed, October 20, 2010 4:33:52 PM
> Subject: Re: [Peace] [Peace-discuss] Fw: Money Can't
> Vote
> This guy supports the war. I can't see why anyone on an
> anti-war list would contribute to him.
>
> On 10/20/10 4:28 PM, Jenifer Cartwright wrote:
>
> Another request for help...
> I love this guy!
> --Jenifer
> --- On Wed, 10/20/10, Rep. Alan Grayson
> <alangrayson at graysonforcongress.com> wrote:
>
> +------------------+
> |CallforGrayson.com|
> | |
> |[IMG] |
> | |
> |Make 10 calls now!|
> +------------------+
>
> Dear Jenifer,
>
> This election is about the people standing against
> corporate special interests, which are trying to
> bury me with lying ads because they know I can’t
> be bought. But money can’t vote – people can.
>
> This week is the first week of Early Vote, which
> means people in Central Florida are voting right
> now.
>
> Getting our supporters to the polls now could make
> up our winning margin, and that's why we need you
> calling supporters and asking them to vote.
>
> You can start calling whenever you like, but we
> really need people to start calling at 4 p.m.
> Eastern Time.
>
> Can you sign up for a shift today from 4-6 p.m. ET,
> or this evening 6-8 p.m. ET?
>
> We'll give you suggestions on what to say, and a
> reporting tool so it's easy to let us know how it's
> going.
>
> Thank you.
>
> Truth,
>
> Alan Grayson
>
> P.S. -- If you don't have time today, please sign
> up to make calls on another day between now and
> Election Day, November 2. Every voter you talk to
> will make a difference.
>
> Sign up now.
>
> Paid for and Authorized by the Committee to Elect
> Alan Grayson
>
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>
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>
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