[Peace-discuss] Fwd: Richard Dawkins Furious At PopeFor TyingGodless To Nazis

[Laurie Solomon]

Funny, I have heard many people express the same comments with respect to Carl on many occasions that he has articulated in his post with respect to Dawkins, namely:

>If anyone took Dawkins seriously before this, I doubt they will now.

>If I thought anyone took Ditchkins seriously, I'd propose a symposium or panel on the subject.  I doubt I'd find many takers.

Ironically, I do have to wonder how many people are really interested enough to actually tune into  Carl's UPTV program once you discount his small group of followers and members of AWARE.




  

 
From: Morton K. Brussel 
Sent: Sunday, September 19, 2010 11:25 PM
To: C. G. Estabrook 
Cc: E.Wayne Johnson ; Peace-discuss 
Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: Richard Dawkins Furious At PopeFor TyingGodless To Nazis


So what do you disagree with in Dawkins' reply? Arguments would be more useful than sneers. Perhaps you should read his book(s) and doff your parochial hat..  


His remarks were both apt and appreciated.  


--mkb


Thanks, Jenifer, for relaying these remarks. 


On Sep 19, 2010, at 9:44 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:


  If anyone took Dawkins seriously before this, I doubt they will now.

  For those who are still abject believers, I recommend Terry Eagleton, "Reason, Faith, and Revolution: Reflections on the God Debate"  (Yale UP pbk, 2010).

  If I thought anyone took Ditchkins seriously, I'd propose a symposium or panel on the subject.  I doubt I'd find many takers.

  Actually, I'd be willing to host it on my UPTV program, News from Neptune. 

  But I don't think anyone's interested enough for that. 


  On 9/19/10 9:31 PM, E.Wayne Johnson wrote: 
    Most importantly, the Nazis were German.

    That fact explains the lion's share of the variance.


      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: Jenifer Cartwright 
      To: Peace-discuss 
      Sent: Monday, September 20, 2010 1:32 AM
      Subject: [Peace-discuss] Fwd: Richard Dawkins Furious At Pope For TyingGodless To Nazis


            Have at it, folks. 
             --Jenifer

            --- On Sun, 9/19/10, fransears> wrote:



              Richard Dawkins Furious At Pope For Tying Godless To Nazis

              Posted in Liberaland by Alan • September 17, 2010,

              Pope Benedict’s speech to Queen Elizabeth in England praised how
              Britain fought “Nazi tyranny that wished to eradicate God from
              society,” prompting one of the world’s best known atheists, Richard
              Dawkins, to proclaim it  “a despicable outrage.” What set off Dawkins
              is this paragraph:

              “Even in our own lifetime, we can recall how Britain and her leaders
              stood against a Nazi tyranny that wished to eradicate God from society
              and denied our common humanity to many, especially the Jews, who were
              thought unfit to live. I also recall the regime’s attitude to
              Christian pastors and religious who spoke the truth in love, opposed
              the Nazis and paid for that opposition with their lives. As we reflect
              on the sobering lessons of the atheist extremism of the twentieth
              century, let us never forget how the exclusion of God, religion and
              virtue from public life leads ultimately to a truncated vision of man
              and of society and thus to a “reductive vision of the person and his
              destiny” (Caritas in Veritate, 29).”

              Dawkins responds:

              Even if Hitler had been an atheist, his political philosophy was not
              based upon atheism and had no connection with atheism. Hitler was
              arguably (and by his own account) a Roman Catholic. In any case he
              enjoyed the open support of many of the most senior catholic clergy in
              Germany and the less demonstrative support of Pope Pius XII. Even if
              Hitler had been an atheist (he certainly was not), the rank and file
              Germans who carried out the attempted extermination of the Jews were
              Christians, almost to a man: either Catholic or Lutheran, primed to
              their anti-Semitism by centuries of Catholic propaganda about
              ‘Christ-killers’ and by Martin Luther’s own seething hatred of the
              Jews. To mention Ratzinger’s membership of the Hitler Youth might be
              thought to be fighting dirty, but my feeling is that the gloves are
              off after this disgraceful paragraph by the pope.

              Dawkins is urging a letter-writing campaign to British media in protest, adding:

              I am incandescent with rage at the sycophantic BBC coverage, and the
              sight of British toadies bowing and scraping to this odious man. I
              thought he was bad before. This puts the lid on it.

           





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