[Peace-discuss] [sf-core] What are the chances?
Mike Lehman
rebelmike at earthlink.net
Mon Sep 3 15:19:32 UTC 2012
Jenifer,
I tend to vote _for_ people, not against them, despite our bogus
democracy often turning on how much crap can be thrown at one or the
other of two poor choices that basically propose doing little to nothing
to alter an abusive, corrupt, and ultimately illegitimate
political-economic system.
Yes, in Illinois it hardly matters who you vote for individually., Obama
has the state sewn up. In other states, it doesn't matter, because
they're packed with yahoos struggling to drag us back to the 19th
century -- and hoping Romney will do that. There are other choices on
the ballot, some worth considering in comparison to
One-of-the-Inevitable-Pair.
And you can always just skip that ballot line entirely, although that's
a bit of a cop-out with the top of the ticket and with what's at stake
for some in how the results turns out. Thus if I was in a swing state,
it would be a tougher choice. I might even vote for Obama, because I do
think he's somewhat less toxic for the average citizen than Romney. It
would really depend on my mood going in to vote that day, as at least in
a swing state there is what amounts to a choice, as narrow as it might
be. For all Obama's many faults, if one compares him to Romney, most are
an order of magnitude less poisonous than Romney's.
Iran is a good example. If Romney was president right now, we'd probably
be deeply involved in the mess that unleashing Israel to do as
Netanyahoo wants will bring on. Obama has certainly been an enabler of
the current regime in Tel Aviv, but also a (somewhat) restraining
influence. Will the US turnaround and give Israel the green light to go
ahead and attack Iran, even with Obama? Possibly, but even that is a
faint ray of sunshine in comparison to the total eclipse of humanity
that Romney would facilitate.
That's just one issue, but we all know there are many more. Certainly
not much basis to vote for Obama, but yes, there is a difference and one
worth considering -- if your vote might be made in a jurisdiction where
it could tip the scales.
I usually stay out of these arguments, because I don't see them as
worthwhile in changing much. But if I had to pick the time of the year
to be dropped, naked and without food, tools or protection into the US
political wilderness, I'd rather it be in an Obama spring than a Romney
fall. At least with Obama I'd have a chance to eat, make shelter and
figure out how to survive the coming winter. With Romney, we'll all
simply soon freeze to death, which might be the most humane of the many
ways in which a Romney presidency will abuse most of the population.
Mike Lehman
On 9/3/2012 12:24 AM, Jenifer Cartwright wrote:
> Excellent post, Mike, was seconding yr every word until the last bit.
> Why won't you be voting for Obama? I'm too scared to do otherwise. I'm
> assuming y're an IL resident? Would you vote for Obama if you lived in
> e g MO-WI-OH-IN,FL, and if not, why not?
>
> --- On *Sun, 9/2/12, Mike Lehman /<rebelmike at earthlink.net>/* wrote:
>
>
> From: Mike Lehman <rebelmike at earthlink.net>
> Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] [sf-core] What are the chances?
> To: "sf-core" <sf-core at yahoogroups.com>
> Cc: peace-discuss at anti-war.net
> Date: Sunday, September 2, 2012, 11:26 PM
>
> As a historian, in my opinion I think you're drawing the wrong
> analogy from 1932. If Romney wins, it will be as if Hoover won in
> 1932 -- and then you can hope all you want about the people having
> any impact on his greed and lust for power.
>
> Frankly, I wouldn't take much in the way of political advice from
> the NY Times anyway. I read it regularly, just as I listen to what
> the president has to say from time to time. Do I invest in either?
> Are you kidding?!?
>
> Douthat's puppy love for Ryan, the "policy entrepreneur" kind of
> makes me want to puke. Serial greed freak, maybe. Policy presumes
> it at least benefits the public and nothing I've seen from Romney
> is anything more than the Pig of Greed wearing Sarah Palin's lipstick.
>
> Two bad choices? Don't presume that they're equally bad, which
> seems to be the point of the argument that it's no skin off
> anyone's knee if Romney happens to manage to buy the presidency
> this time around. Give those jerks another shot at packing the
> Supremes and Carl will likely be scratching out marks on a prison
> wall along with other thought criminals, even though he and Romney
> probably do agree on abortion. I've yet to figure out how folks
> that claim to believe in small government want it to be just the
> size to forcibly fit in the womb. The present situation, while it
> may gall some, at least leaves these decisions to a woman's
> conscience, where it should be. I have yet to figure out how some
> people seem to talk to god enough to claim to know what s/he
> thinks on this matter, which is likely to be a lot more
> complicated than a Republican platform plank.
>
> Not that I trust Obama more than a cup of warm spit on much of
> anything. But there are two possibilities of who wins in November
> and I know which one I'd prefer to have to put up with given that
> bad hand, even though I won't be voting for him.
> Mike Lehman
>
> On 9/2/2012 7:02 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:
> > Ross Douthout has a column in the NYT today in which he too
> draws a comparison with 1932:
> >
> >
> <http://www.nytimes.com/2012/09/02/opinion/sunday/douthat-franklin-delano-romney.html>.
> >
> >
> > On Sep 2, 2012, at 4:29 PM, "Brussel, Morton K"
> <brussel at illinois.edu </mc/compose?to=brussel at illinois.edu>> wrote:
> >
> >> On Sep 2, 2012, at 3:52 PM, C. G. Estabrook wrote:
> >>
> >>> Although I won't vote for either one of them, it's not at
> all clear to me whether a Romney or an Obama presidency would add
> more to the sum of human happiness, since they both profess the
> same murderous economic and military policies (for all their
> efforts at product differentiation).
> >>>
> >>> Obama's re-election cannot avoid being interpreted as approval
> of those policies (cf. Little Bush's "political capital" in 2004),
> while Romney's election might be seen as their rejection, despite
> his protestations.
> >>>
> >> I think not. If such be the case, it [Obama winning] will
> result from a confused guess by the voting electorate that given
> the alternatives, Romney and company would offer less than Obama,
> while following basically the same corporate and imperialistic
> policies with perhaps even more fervor. And then there's the race
> factor, which should not be minimized.
> >>> Perhaps, like FDR in 1932, a victorious Romney may be driven
> to reverse his professed positions, if the popular demand is
> strong enough. Politics is in the streets, not the ballot box.
> >>>
> >>>
> >> In ignorance, there is always room for hope.
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Yahoo! Groups Links
> >
> > <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sf-core/
> >
> > <*> Your email settings:
> > Individual Email | Traditional
> >
> > <*> To change settings online go to:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/sf-core/join
> > (Yahoo! ID required)
> >
> > <*> To change settings via email:
> > sf-core-digest at yahoogroups.com
> </mc/compose?to=sf-core-digest at yahoogroups.com>
> > sf-core-fullfeatured at yahoogroups.com
> </mc/compose?to=sf-core-fullfeatured at yahoogroups.com>
> >
> > <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > sf-core-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com
> </mc/compose?to=sf-core-unsubscribe at yahoogroups.com>
> >
> > <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
> > http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Peace-discuss mailing list
> Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net
> </mc/compose?to=Peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net>
> http://lists.chambana.net/mailman/listinfo/peace-discuss
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.chambana.net/pipermail/peace-discuss/attachments/20120903/a9fef85c/attachment.html>
More information about the Peace-discuss
mailing list