[IMC-US] A good point about open publishing

deva drdartist at riseup.net
Wed Jul 21 17:18:42 CDT 2004 

I am indecisive about an open publishing newswire though leaning  
towards not having one

On the one hand, it is alot of work, and if it is not tied to a local  
community, the ability to post and comment is less likely to foster  
local action or any action. On the other hand, without it, the US site  
becomes the voice of really a very small number of people and is  
another step away from the idea that anyone can tell their story and  
back towards journalists and editors to do it.

John asked the question - What is the US site? Is it to be an imc in  
it's own right, or is it just a doorway to the local imc's? Does this  
question need to be answered? Or can it sort of be both? What benefit  
is it? How is it useful?

When I think about it, it seems useful as a doorway to all the local  
imc's.

Does there need to be a feature-wire and a center column? Can it just  
be a center column feature-wire that is a syndicated feed of features  
from the local imc's? Then it would syndicate the entire feature. The  
editorial group could weed out local features that are unnecessary. For  
example, here in Portland there are often features that announce some  
very local event and that seems meaningless to syndicate.

I suggest the feature-wire be archived so that someone could then  
search the back database of stories. That way the site is useful as a  
one single place you can search for stories about a single issue.

The site could also collect together audio, video and print links so  
that it is acting as a door to those mediums as well as feature stories

As someone suggested, the site could focus on informing people what is  
indymedia, developing a way to get the stories onto google news, into  
other venues etc

Focusing on making the information from local imc's more accessible and  
more widely read, rather than being yet another imc site to look at to  
find original content.

After thinking about it for a while, this is the way I am leaning...

cheers
deva
portland imc volunteer




On Jul 21, 2004, at 9:19 AM, Ryan Kaldari wrote:

> Google's policy is: "We do not include sites that allow open  
> publication."
> And they define open publication pretty broadly. When I explained that  
> our RSS feed was moderated, they didn't care. They said it still fell  
> into their definition of open publishing.
>
> Ryan Kaldari
>
> On Jul 21, 2004, at 10:53 AM, faith swords wrote:
>
>> if i remember correctly from the Indymedia US caucus at the allied  
>> media
>> conference this summer, what ryan said that google told them was that  
>> even
>> their syndicated articles wouldn't be picked up by google news because
>> their editorial board is open to the public. apparently, anything  
>> open to
>> the public falls under the same catagory as open publishing.
>>
>> but i may not be clear on the details. we'll have to wait for ryan to
>> chime in. i'm sure it couldn't hurt for someone to talk with google  
>> about
>> this particular site, regardless of their debate about other sites.
>>
>> --faith
>>
>> On Wed, 21 Jul 2004, john duda wrote:
>>
>>> one option that might make it easier to get into google news is a
>>> german-style open publishing wire, where posts do not automatically
>>> get displayed on the newswire, but require the approval of a
>>> moderator...this is an easy option to implement.
>>>
>>> i've also heard that it has at least been possible in the past to
>>> give google news a feed which only includes the moderated articles,  
>>> but
>>> i'm not sure if this is still the case.
>>>
>>> john
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jul 21, 2004 at 10:38:40AM -0500, faith swords wrote:
>>>> hey everyone,
>>>>
>>>> as for google and the OP issue: as far as i know, google won't pick  
>>>> up OP
>>>> sites for their news site. ryan from TN IMC has been talking with  
>>>> them
>>>> trying to get this sorted out but he hasn't been having much luck.  
>>>> maybe
>>>> he could elaborate on what their policy is, as it's been explained  
>>>> to him
>>>> by google.
>>>>
>>>> --faith
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, 20 Jul 2004, ana wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Hmmm. that is weird. i was sure we had somethign different in  
>>>>> there about OP
>>>>> because it was a concern when we had a caucus at the AMC last year  
>>>>> and the
>>>>> draft that came out of that had a different clause about op. but i  
>>>>> guess
>>>>> something changed.
>>>>>
>>>>> i just found the original proposal we sent to newimc and it seems  
>>>>> vague, as
>>>>> in it wasnt decided entirely.
>>>>> http://archives.lists.indymedia.org/new-imc/2003-August/004310.html
>>>>>
>>>>> First it says (which i wrongfully remembered as saying 'might'  
>>>>> follow
>>>>> global's model):
>>>>>
>>>>> "The suggested format for the US site is a syndicated newswire of  
>>>>> US-
>>>>> features, much like the global site syndicates features from IMCs  
>>>>> around
>>>>> the world.  Syndication was chosen specifically as the recommended  
>>>>> format
>>>>> due to problems of open-publishing newswire abuse and following the
>>>>> precendent set on the global Indymedia website (i.e., the open  
>>>>> newswire
>>>>> will be available off the main page).
>>>>>
>>>>> and then it says:
>>>>>
>>>>> EDITORIAL:  The editorial group will be responsible for newswire
>>>>> maintenance (if an open newswire is part of the site) and feature
>>>>> writing/compiling/editing.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, maybe it wasnt completely decided yet. I dont remember. But I  
>>>>> also dont
>>>>> want to hold this process up any more.  So, while i dont think it  
>>>>> is a good
>>>>> idea at all to have an op function on the site, I wont block  
>>>>> having it as
>>>>> an option.
>>>>>
>>>>> It hurts though, because i think peopel will be attracted to the  
>>>>> "broader
>>>>> exposure" of a national site and the tendency might go towards not  
>>>>> posting
>>>>> on local sites anymore. A real shame. Additionally, we will need
>>>>> *quadruple* the amount of peopel working on site mantainance to  
>>>>> monitor the
>>>>> wire and take off racist posts, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> And lastly could someone working on code check to see if stories  
>>>>> would still
>>>>> get picked up by google news with an op wire on it. Either way, we  
>>>>> should
>>>>> make sure the site is being built to facilitate getting picked up  
>>>>> on google
>>>>> news. i know democracy now has had real issues with that because  
>>>>> it wasnt
>>>>> thought of before hand. im sorry if i missed posts about this  
>>>>> already. but
>>>>> has anyone looked into that at all?
>>>>>
>>>>> gnight all.
>>>>> ana
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Quoting john duda <john at manifestor.org>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 19, 2004 at 11:45:11PM -0400, Ana wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Re New imc process:  I believe it was in our application that we  
>>>>>>> would
>>>>>> not
>>>>>>> have open publishing, precisely because of local IMC concerns  
>>>>>>> that we
>>>>>> were
>>>>>>> taking their local traffic away.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> could you point me to the documents?  i've been having a really  
>>>>>> hard
>>>>>> time trying to trace out the imc-us approval process due to broken
>>>>>> mailman links in the archives, all the stuff i've seen so far has
>>>>>> indicated that usimc was approved on the assumption it would have  
>>>>>> an
>>>>>> op wire.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> for example:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://archives.lists.indymedia.org/new-imc/2003-September/ 
>>>>>> 004411.html
>>>>>> email from Sascha to new-imc outlining imc-us' committments to IMC
>>>>>> Membership
>>>>>> Criteria
>>>>>>
>>>>>> f. Agree to the use of Open Publishing as described in the NIMC  
>>>>>> Editorial
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Policy [editorial collective comments: "We did agree that the  
>>>>>> term "Open
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Publishing" was one that is still being defined by the Global  
>>>>>> Network
>>>>>> Collective, and we would wait and see what the results were before
>>>>>> rewriting this criteria]:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The IMC-US affinity group agrees to do this.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://archives.lists.indymedia.org/imc-process/2003-October/ 
>>>>>> 005187.html
>>>>>>
>>>>>> (philly imc's non-blocking suggestions)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - That the newswire have an open publishing feature as well as a
>>>>>> syndication
>>>>>> feature, using for example the same format as the global site, to
>>>>>> encourage democratic participation in the news-making process.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> i'm not trying to be disruptive, but i am really concerned that
>>>>>> launching an indymedia site with a strong editorial voice and a  
>>>>>> lack
>>>>>> of open publishing is setting a new and probably controversial
>>>>>> precedent, one which may generate a lot of animosity for the imc  
>>>>>> us
>>>>>> project in the global network.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> john
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am strongly opposed to an op wire on the US site. We should  
>>>>>>> just be a
>>>>>> tool
>>>>>>> to highlight the work of local IMCs.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 7/19/04 9:27 PM, "jon pike" <profpike at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tribal put in a reminder that this site will be
>>>>>>>> covering the RNC and newswires have proven valuable in
>>>>>>>> the past for getting stuff up quickly about
>>>>>>>> significant protest actions.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So, maybe it would be good to have such a function on
>>>>>>>> the site. After all didn't FTAAIMC, or is that a
>>>>>>>> differnet case entirely?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> "The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders.  
>>>>> That is
>>>>> easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked,  
>>>>> and
>>>>> denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the  
>>>>> country
>>>>> to  danger." -- Hermann Goering, Nazi propaganda strategist.
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>
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