[Peace-discuss] Israeli massacre in Gaza [and J Street PAC's call to end the violence and the blockade]

[Stuart Levy]

On Mon, Dec 29, 2008 at 12:13:25AM -0600, C. G. Estabrook wrote:
> Naturally I mean that you can't say things that aren't true.
>
> The quoted statement as a whole is objectionable. You refer only to the
> statement's "declining to assign blame" -- rather difficult without falling 
> into the "all are equally at fault" nonsense, an attempt to equalize the crimes 
> -- "disingenuous at best."

No, I don't think that's right.  Consider the atmosphere,
where so many people, not only Americans and Israeli politicians but also
Mahmoud Abbas, are saying "This invasion is all Hamas' fault".

The J St. statement is carefully *not* saying that both
sides are *equally* at fault.  If they did, it would be
misrepresentation, and I'd agree they'd be in the wrong.
Instead they say

    [...] And there is nothing to be gained from debating which injustice
    is greater or came first.   What's needed now is immediate action
    to stop the violence before it spirals out of control.

> The statement also misrepresents the role of the US as passive or 
> uninvolved while calling for its intervention -- more nonsense,
> hardly innocent: they know what they're writing. --CGE

How does it do that (represent the current role of the US
as anything in particular)?  Or do you mean that they omitted to
point out that the US is a massive supplier of arms, political support,
etc., i.e. a "friend" to Israel?  

Disturbing the unquestioned passive portion of US support for Israel --
under which "American politicians are already hearing from those who
see only one side" -- seems like exactly what this kind of call
is intended to do!



> Stuart Levy wrote:
>> On Sun, Dec 28, 2008 at 11:30:52PM -0600, C. G. Estabrook wrote:
>>> But you have to tell the truth, even in political statements.
>> Surely far more truth exists than we can fit in *any* statement. Just as
>> there's more on and under a landscape than a mapmaker can fit in any map.
>> As with maps, (political) statements are made, and the truth that goes 
>> into
>> them is selected, for a purpose.  Neglecting to assign blame doesn't have 
>> to
>> be misrepresentation.
>> If this were for a brief being drawn up for the International Criminal 
>> Court
>> then assigning blame and considering proportionality of force would be
>> central.  (As I think Mary Robinson said during the bombardment of 
>> Lebanon,
>> those who ordered it "should look to their personal exposure.")  But 
>> that's
>> not the intent here, and we shouldn't judge it as if it were.
>>> I suggest J Street means to play Good Cop to AIPAC's Bad Cop.  --CGE
>> That makes sense in a way.   Though I don't think J Street's aims have all
>> that much in common with AIPAC's.   Although both say they "support" 
>> Israel,
>> they have wildly different views of what they'd approve of Israel doing -- 
>> re
>> attacking Iran, or returning West Bank settlement land, for example.
>>> Stuart Levy wrote:
>>>> On Sun, Dec 28, 2008 at 10:15:34PM -0600, C. G. Estabrook wrote:
>>>>> Stuart Levy wrote:
>>>>>> ... 
>>>>>> http://action.jstreet.org/t/3251/petition.jsp?petition_KEY=508&tag=gazaemail-txt
>>>>>>  Here's their call:
>>>>>>> ... And there is nothing to be gained from debating which injustice
>>>>>>> is greater or came first.   What's needed now is immediate action
>>>>>>> to stop the violence before it spirals out of control...
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