FW: [Peace-discuss] Fw: Lou Dobbs is dangerous ('murder music' as hate speech)

[C. G. Estabrook]

If so, then it's prosecutable under existing law.  No new law is needed.


Stuart Levy wrote:
> On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 09:05:26PM -0500, C. G. Estabrook wrote:
>> One can deplore such a thing and condemn it in all available places, but to
>>  make such speech a crime is to allow the government to arrest and punish 
>> people for the content of what they say (or sing).
>> 
>> That would substantially expand the present US legal doctrine that 
>> government cannot punish inflammatory speech unless it is directed to 
>> inciting, and likely to incite, imminent lawless action.
> 
> But don't we have an example of just that, with murder music?
> 
>> I don't think we want to expand the government's powers in that way.  --CGE
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Stuart Levy wrote:
>>> On Sun, Aug 16, 2009 at 05:23:26PM -0700, Jenifer Cartwright wrote:
>>>> Y're kidding, right?? If I were in charge of hiring and firing at CNN,
>>>> I would indeed have the right to "stop something," specifically the 
>>>> continuation of Lou Dobbs on CNN. By exercising my own freedom of
>>>> speech, I am telling CNN that I want them to do exactly that. Again, it
>>>> is my right and responsibility to do this. I think Neil has already
>>>> covered this very well -- the difference betw totally silencing someone
>>>> and refusing him a national platform. --Jenifer
>>> I heard today at ICJPE meeting of another variety of hate speech. It's
>>> called "murder music".  A Jamaican musician, Buju Banton, is touring the
>>> US, singing songs whose lyrics call outright for killing gay and lesbian
>>> men and women.  Indeed, in Jamaica, it's especially bad news to be
>>> homosexual -- many have been murdered in just the last few years, 
>>> targeted for their sexual orientation.  (Found this in the Wikipedia page
>>>  on "LGBT rights in Jamaica": Just after the 2004 murder of one Jamaican 
>>> gay-rights activists, a Human Rights Watch researcher found a crowd 
>>> celebrating outside his house.  She quotes them as singing slogans about 
>>> killing gays -- singing lines straight from Banton's and other music.) 
>>> There are of course nonlethal forms of persecution too.  Some LGBT people
>>>  have fled Jamaica and sought and been granted asylum in other countries,
>>>  specifically for being persecuted based on their sexual orientation. 
>>> Given a pattern like this, do we indeed want to say that we should not
>>> recognize any such category as a hate crime?  Now, in the US, LGBT groups
>>> are using their free speech rights to try to influence local venues to
>>> cancel their bookings with this Buju Banton, including one at the House
>>> of Blues in Chicago. If they succeed, he won't be able to perform there.
>>> Does this amount to censorship?  Do we call it an improper restriction on
>>> free speech?