Fw: [Peace-discuss] Food for thought?

Sun Jan 11 17:05:52 CST 2009

>But the plan of the society was oriented (no pun here) toward people who
dont have
>cars and so it works pretty well that way. 

Yes, but that is the key.  Most contemporary industrialized nations are no
longer oriented that way and attempts to add those orientations onto the
existing ones and structures tends not to work very well.  Furthermore, to
return to orientations that support green infrastructure often costs so much
as not to be cost effective.  The return of a  tracked or overhead electric
wired trolley  system to L.A. is a good example.  Ironically ( like mass
transit) bicycles and foot transportation, roller skates or skate board,
scooters, etc.  work best and are most justifiable when the sever areas of
high population density with not only definable departure and destination
locations but a wide variety of neighborhood shops like green grocers,
butchers, drug stores, general stores, coffee shops, restaurants, etc.
within the nearby neighborhood so that one can get things to take home
frequently in small quantities that one can carry effectively and
efficiently on a bike and by hand  without worrying about inclement weather,
defrosting of frozen foods, or the need to stock up.  In less dense
communities where there is no central sets of departure and destination
points that large numbers of people use and no  nearby local shops that one
can stop off at on the way to work or home, mass transit becomes less
efficient and effective, more costly, etc. as does other green types of
alternative transportation.  The same can be said for other types of
infrastructures such as sewer  and water systems, electric grids and wired
telephone and internet, streets and sidewalks, street lighting, police and
fire services, food services, etc.

From: peace-discuss-bounces at lists.chambana.net
[mailto:peace-discuss-bounces at lists.chambana.net] On Behalf Of E. Wayne
Johnson
Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 4:20 PM
To: unionyes
Cc: Peace-discuss List
Subject: Re: Fw: [Peace-discuss] Food for thought?

I lived in China 5 years, didn't own a car, and never wanted a car.
But the plan of the society was oriented (no pun here) toward people who
dont have
cars and so it works pretty well that way.  I had a very good bicycle the
sort of
which is nearly impossible to find here.  It was a 28" FengHuang (Phoenix)
and it cost
me 280 yuan (about $35) which was a huge price.  It had big fat tires like
my grandmother's old
bicycle and it was built to carry freight loads on the rack.

The bus system was very good with simple metal signs that indicated where
the bus was going.  Each bus stop
had a name so one could know where the bus was going.  The time that the bus
would be at each stop or
else the frequency of buses was also posted.  It was a user-friendly system.
There were also Capitalists with
smaller buses and little cars who ran the same routes in between the times
for the public buses.  All the buses, public and private
were usually well filled.  Often packed.

*
One of the more interesting technologies is to use elemental boron as a
energy storage medium.  The boron
pellets are "burned", releasing zero gaseous emissions, but combining with
oxygen and water to produce borax,
which is recycled and converted back to elemental boron.  
No one has figured out what they do with the entropy.

unionyes wrote: 

----- Original Message ----- 

From: unionyes <mailto:unionyes at ameritech.net>  

To: LAURIE <mailto:LAURIE at ADVANCENET.NET>  SOLOMON 

Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 1:52 PM

Subject: Re: [Peace-discuss] Food for thought?

The short answer is Green Collar Jobs.

Besides an increase in solar, wind, etc. use, encouraged by some type of
government help ( R and D, tax credits, direct investment, training
programs, etc. ), the re-tooling of the U.S. auto industry to make electric
cars, high speed rail and inter-urban light rail ( which would BEGIN to
creep us towards Western Europe and Japan, who are 40 years ahead of us ).

The long answer is a more systemic problem which ties in with why the above
short answer hasn't happened and addressing your concern Laurie, about the
corporate system being sustained. The system that created the problems we
currently have.

That problem is the Capitalist system.

The other point that is mentioned about the construction industry being
dominated by white males IS absolutely true.

The problem is that the construction Unions have allowed the contractors
almost total control of hiring / firing.

The Unions take in apprentices every year, with a ratio of about 20 %
minorities and women. The problem is that they don't get enough work via the
contractors and 75 % drop out after one to three years.

In fact, in Champaign-Urbana where 95 % of the construction work is located,
you will find that 90 % of the Workers on these jobs do NOT live in
Champaign-Urbana.

State and Federal construction projects ( U of I )  are required to have a
workforce on these projects that reflect the community in terms of race.

If you use the population diversity of the County as a benchmark, then 9 %
of the Tradespeople should be African American, 2% Hispanic ( or more ), and
about 1% Asian ( excluding visiting academics at the U of I ).

What is typical on the job-sites overall is 2% African American at best. No
Hispanics unless they are specialty crews from Chicago ( terrazo floors,
etc. ), and I have only seen ONE Asian Tradesperson in my 30 years in the
Trades.

And the above are the COUNTY figures. You can guess how this would change if
you used City of Champaign and Urbana figures for benchmarks.

David J.

----- Original Message ----- 

From: LAURIE SOLOMON <mailto:LAURIE at ADVANCENET.NET>  

To: sf-core at yahoogroups.com ; peace-discuss at lists.chambana.net 

Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 12:45 PM

Subject: [Peace-discuss] Food for thought?

Food for thought?  The question here, I guess is:  if this is actually the
case and if training people to have the right and most current needed skills
will take time, what kinds of stimulus can there be which does not reward
those who already have the skills and jobs while actually accomplishing the
production of something productive and useful in terms of tangible
infrastructure improvements and repairs as opposed to merely keeping the
economy, financial centers, and corporations up and running as usual with
little actual tangible benefits to the standard of living and needs of the
ordinary population.?

FOCUS | The Stimulus

http://www.truthout.org/011109Y

Robert Reich, Robert Reich's Blog: "The stimulus plan will create jobs
repairing and upgrading the nation's roads, bridges, ports, levees, water
and sewage system, public-transit systems, electricity grid, and schools...
But if there aren't enough skilled professionals to do the jobs involving
new technologies, the stimulus will just increase the wages of the
professionals who already have the right skills rather than generate many
new jobs in these fields. And if construction jobs go mainly to white males
who already dominate the construction trades, many people who need jobs the
most - women, minorities, and the poor and long-term unemployed - will be
shut out."

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