[Peace-discuss] The "two faces" of Winston Churchill

[John W.]

On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 11:31 AM, C. G. Estabrook <galliher at illinois.edu>wrote:



>      ... gentle nurse,
> I pray thee, leave me to myself to-night,
> For I have need of many orisons
> To move the heavens to smile upon my state,
> Which, well thou know'st, is cross, and full of sin.
>
> Use every man after his desert, and who should scape whipping?
> Use them after your own honour and dignity.
> The less they deserve, the more merit is in your bounty.
> Take them in.
>
> David is in fact engaged in a godly enterprise - getting things right,
> rather than acquiescing in an imperial mythology that promotes
> the murder of innocents today.  That surely is sin.
>


The latter, or the former?  *smile*  Yes, the murder of innocents surely is
sin.  Is that what Hitler....errr, I mean Churchill was engaged in?  And
FDR?  And Abraham Lincoln?  And all the other luminaries whom you gentlemen
despise?




>   On 8/16/10 11:11 AM, John W. wrote:
>
> I hope G*d is more merciful in His assessment of the two of you than you
> are in your assessment of virtually every human being on earth, living and
> dead.  Meanwhile, though, it must be glorious to possess such Olympian
> wisdom derived from books.
>
>
>
> On Mon, Aug 16, 2010 at 11:04 AM, C. G. Estabrook <galliher at illinois.edu>wrote:
>
>
>>  Nicely put.
>>
>>
>> On 8/16/10 10:42 AM, David Green wrote:
>>
>>> http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/
>>>
>>> I don't think that there is as much irony or mystery about WC as
>>> Greenwald and
>>> NYT reviewer Hari make out to be. Hari refers disparigingly to Nicholson
>>> Baker's
>>> "Human Smoke," which I think gets WC about right. He was a monster. There
>>> is no
>>> more reason to revere Churchill for "defeating" Hitler than there is to
>>> revere
>>> Stalin, who in fact really did defeat him. I was not surprised by the NYT
>>> review, only a little surprised by Hari, and somewhat more surprised by
>>> Greenwald's take.
>>>
>>> DG
>>
>>
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